DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 173 Joined: 27-Feb-2021 Last visit: 14-Feb-2024
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I use a small glass for crystalization from mimosa hostilis. So on the walls of the glass there form realy big pure crystals and all the yellow stuff is on the bottom. It gets realy clean this way without any further processing. If you smoke it right, you can't hold a pipe.
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 4160 Joined: 01-Oct-2016 Last visit: 08-Jun-2024
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M0K0 wrote:I use a small glass for crystalization from mimosa hostilis. So on the walls of the glass there form realy big pure crystals and all the yellow stuff is on the bottom. It gets realy clean this way without any further processing. Ditto, and the glass I use is tapered. One love What if the "truth" is: the "truth" is indescernible/unknowable/nonexistent? Then the closest we get is through being true to and with ourselves. Know thyself, nothing in excess, certainty brings insanity- Delphic Maxims DMT always has something new to show you Question everything... including questioning everything... There's so much I could be wrong about and have no idea... All posts and supposed experiences are from an imaginary interdimensional being. This being has the proclivity and compulsion for delving in depths it shouldn't. Posts should be taken with a grain of salt. 👽
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❤️🔥
Posts: 3648 Joined: 11-Mar-2017 Last visit: 02-Nov-2024 Location: 🌎
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Jees wrote:We've had several persons here getting crystals from former goo by lowering the ionic strength in the acid solution. The goo and the yellow oil are related to each other I reckon.
A/B extraction soups from plant material are usually heavier based (ionised) than a backwash. With a backwash you only need to get a high enough pH, no more.
Extraction soups from plants often have much more base (ions) than needed for a high enough pH: for lysing the plant cells and for dodging emulsions. No such things are as present in a backwash.
Exactly that is why a backwash delivers better crystals imho, the lower ionic strength, also because nobody really adds NaCl-salt (cfr max ion tek) as an extra ionic parameter in a backwash.
Connecting the dots with this theory. I second this. Backwash details that could minimize DMT polymerization: - Stir in dilute acid overnight. With time, the most stubborn DMT polymers seem to be broken up. Like Jess said, don't use a lot of acid to minimize ionic strength in the next step. - Add Naphtha before basing - Add base slowly while shaking with Naphtha and sample the water pH. Target a pH of 10.7, to finish up (water will also stop clouding as base is added). I think we want to avoid cloudy water sitting around to minimize DMT polymer. Not sure which of these matter more, but combined they turn yellow goo to white xtals. Yellow goo and white xtals seem the same to me effect-wise. Advantages of white xtals: seem more soluble in naphtha during the pulls, easier to handle, and more reliable vaping on e-mesh (goo seems to need higher temperature that can be variable). Also during extraction, it helps to not get too crazy with pH and ionic strength. Jees is right, that some aggressiveness is needed to fight emulsions and the plant matrix. I think good targets when battling plant matter are pH~12 and ~2.5M ionic strength (as used in the max ion tek). Naphtha can also be added before basing, but this time the pH is increased until the plant emulsion is broken up. With more aggressive conditions DMT polymerizes making it more difficult to go into naphtha, which then requires heat, which also makes contaminants more soluble in Naphtha. With gentler conditions, impossible emulsions can form. Therefore, there is an optimal range (which I think max ion tek found). Edit: also during the plant extraction when at high pH (~12) having dilute DMT (<0.5%) may help minimize polymer formation (again, a condition used in max ion). In summary, Conditions that may cause DMT to aggregate into goo: - High ionic strength - High pH - High DMT concentration - Time in alkaline water (more is worse) Back salting conditions that may break up DMT goo into white DMT: - Don't back salt at a very high DMT concentration (~1% or less seems ok) - Time in dilute acid (more is better, overnight with stirring seems sufficient). Dilute acid could be 1 in 5 parts vinegar. Note: in the past, some people may have confused this acidic polymer break down with a false DMT "oxide" reduction and even added zinc unnecessarily) - Low ionic strength (skip salt) - Time in alkaline water (less is better, so add naptha before basing and shake while basing to minimize time water is cloudy). - Low pH target ~10.7 (stop ~ after white clouds stop forming)
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 24 Joined: 25-Nov-2018 Last visit: 25-Feb-2024
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M0K0 wrote:I use a small glass for crystalization from mimosa hostilis. So on the walls of the glass there form realy big pure crystals and all the yellow stuff is on the bottom. It gets realy clean this way without any further processing. seems a good idea.is it easy to scrape dmt from the glass؟
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 25 Joined: 08-May-2021 Last visit: 06-Dec-2022 Location: Earth
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Another thing you might try is Q21Q21’s vinegar/lime tek. According to Q21Q21, the first pull should always produce snow white crystals. SWIM used the tek a few times, but SWIM used petroleum ether 40-60 as the non-polar solvent instead of naphtha. The downside of this NPS is that it is highly volatile and you’ll lose a lot to evaporation. The plus is that this solvent seems to produce perfectly white and smooth crystals every time. I’ve written about SWIM's experiences with the tek here.
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 4160 Joined: 01-Oct-2016 Last visit: 08-Jun-2024
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Thought this would be fun to share here. 100g starting material. Cyb's Max Ion Tek 6 pulls with naphtha between 35-40ml per pull 1.054 final yield. One love Voidmatrix attached the following image(s): yup.jpg (371kb) downloaded 175 time(s).What if the "truth" is: the "truth" is indescernible/unknowable/nonexistent? Then the closest we get is through being true to and with ourselves. Know thyself, nothing in excess, certainty brings insanity- Delphic Maxims DMT always has something new to show you Question everything... including questioning everything... There's so much I could be wrong about and have no idea... All posts and supposed experiences are from an imaginary interdimensional being. This being has the proclivity and compulsion for delving in depths it shouldn't. Posts should be taken with a grain of salt. 👽
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 4031 Joined: 28-Jun-2012 Last visit: 05-Mar-2024
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Nice Voidmatrix!
How was the pulling temp please? The white and 1% yield makes me think below or at 40degC. At 50degC I suspect more yield but also more yellow oil troughout the crystals. Never go to60degC, the naphtha would be flashing up vapours.
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 4160 Joined: 01-Oct-2016 Last visit: 08-Jun-2024
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Jees wrote:Nice Voidmatrix!
How was the pulling temp please? The white and 1% yield makes me think below or at 40degC. At 50degC I suspect more yield but also more yellow oil troughout the crystals. Never go to60degC, the naphtha would be flashing up vapours. Thank you! Well, I was going to wait until next month before doing another, but will probably start working on one where the acid bath is already completed so I can answer your question. I usually heat the solvent in near boiling water for about a minute before adding to the soup. I'll take the actual temp for this step on this next extraction. One love What if the "truth" is: the "truth" is indescernible/unknowable/nonexistent? Then the closest we get is through being true to and with ourselves. Know thyself, nothing in excess, certainty brings insanity- Delphic Maxims DMT always has something new to show you Question everything... including questioning everything... There's so much I could be wrong about and have no idea... All posts and supposed experiences are from an imaginary interdimensional being. This being has the proclivity and compulsion for delving in depths it shouldn't. Posts should be taken with a grain of salt. 👽
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Posts: 3648 Joined: 11-Mar-2017 Last visit: 02-Nov-2024 Location: 🌎
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Did max ion on 100g of bark, but I added Naptha before basing to try to minimize polymerization while basing. Instead of a pH meter, I based until the emulsion starts to break up. Can't say if this "approach" reduced polymerization for sure, but I am happy with the result. 2.2% after 3 pulls of off-white DMT. I may have a couple hundred mg on a 4th pull xtalizing soon. The jar broke while I was doing my 5th pull and the bark was lost 😔. Think I'll end up at ~2.5% and be happy with that. Loveall attached the following image(s): IMG_20210914_153004378.jpg (3,172kb) downloaded 156 time(s).
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 4160 Joined: 01-Oct-2016 Last visit: 08-Jun-2024
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Ya, I assumed my roughly 1% yield was expected and a result of the quality of bark. I'm going home, smoalking changa, then will salinate and base an acid soup... I'm surrounded by troublemakers One love What if the "truth" is: the "truth" is indescernible/unknowable/nonexistent? Then the closest we get is through being true to and with ourselves. Know thyself, nothing in excess, certainty brings insanity- Delphic Maxims DMT always has something new to show you Question everything... including questioning everything... There's so much I could be wrong about and have no idea... All posts and supposed experiences are from an imaginary interdimensional being. This being has the proclivity and compulsion for delving in depths it shouldn't. Posts should be taken with a grain of salt. 👽
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Posts: 3648 Joined: 11-Mar-2017 Last visit: 02-Nov-2024 Location: 🌎
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Enjoy Voidmatrix. Fourth pull had 370mg. Very few crystals, scraped up it a semi solid orange with a little bit of oil. I think this is polymerized DMT. Room temp Naphtha leaves this perfectly good DMT behind (I think) since polymerized DMT is less soluble at room temp. During re-x in a small amount of naphtha, the lower degree of polymerization parts go into solution first, leaving the more polymerized and darker DMT behind, which can give the illusion of a "clean-up", but in reality one could be throwing away the higher degree of polymerized DMT which is perfectly good. I think I can de-polymerize it and get white xtals like Jees and I have done before. Will stir in organic acid overnight to break the polymer up and to a base extraction with minimal polymerization conditions (no salt, gentle pH, naphtha present while basing). If the de-polymerization works, I'll get ~2.6% yield from 4 pulls of off-white xtals 🤞 Loveall attached the following image(s): IMG_20210915_173504670.jpg (531kb) downloaded 132 time(s).
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 1285 Joined: 23-Jun-2018 Last visit: 22-Feb-2022
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Check out this thread... https://www.dmt-nexus.me...aspx?g=posts&t=91937This was done with a standard A/B. Loveall that last chunk looks tasty!! olympus mon wrote:You need to hit it with intention to get where you want to be! "Good and evil lay side by side as electric love penetrates the sky..." -Hendrix"We have arrived at truth, and now we find truth is a mystery- a play of joy, creation, and energy. This is source. This is the mystic touchstone that heals and renews. This is the beginning again. This is entheogenic." -Nicholas Sand
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 24 Joined: 25-Nov-2018 Last visit: 25-Feb-2024
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@Moko , @loveall , @voidmatrix , @unclebob thankee all guys ! i finally get snowish crystal in my extraction.I think using Heptane as solvent was the imortant factor.it's finest solvent indeed.BTW i didn't use warm bath and avoid all heating.i havn't freezed my 2nd and 3rd pulls.first pull was 400 mg
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 4160 Joined: 01-Oct-2016 Last visit: 08-Jun-2024
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girche wrote:@Moko , @loveall , @voidmatrix , @unclebob thankee all guys ! i finally get snowish crystal in my extraction.I think using Heptane as solvent was the imortant factor.it's finest solvent indeed.BTW i didn't use warm bath and avoid all heating.i havn't freezed my 2nd and 3rd pulls.first pull was 400 mg Ahem, uh, pics please One love What if the "truth" is: the "truth" is indescernible/unknowable/nonexistent? Then the closest we get is through being true to and with ourselves. Know thyself, nothing in excess, certainty brings insanity- Delphic Maxims DMT always has something new to show you Question everything... including questioning everything... There's so much I could be wrong about and have no idea... All posts and supposed experiences are from an imaginary interdimensional being. This being has the proclivity and compulsion for delving in depths it shouldn't. Posts should be taken with a grain of salt. 👽
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Boundary condition
Posts: 8617 Joined: 30-Aug-2008 Last visit: 24-Oct-2024 Location: square root of minus one
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Voidmatrix wrote:Dirty T wrote:I have noticed the yellow around the edges at times as well. I was just really thrown off by the top this time because I almost never get goo. I even used fresh Naptha last night, I usually re use naptha to get more up front which leads to less backsalting later. I am very interested as well in the polymorphisms of the molecule. Was there any difference in ambient temperature, or temperature anywhere else during the process this time? Thanks for the word correction btw. "Polymerizations?" Did I really just do that. Time for this much needed nap One love FWIW, polymerisation (or oligomerisation, at least) and polymorphism may be intimately linked in the case of freebase DMT crystal inasmuch as the yellow goo is probably down to base-catalysed polymerisation/oligomerisation. [EDIT: I should have read the thread, seems this has been covered already.] Quote:Ahem, uh, pics please 2nd that. “There is a way of manipulating matter and energy so as to produce what modern scientists call 'a field of force'. The field acts on the observer and puts him in a privileged position vis-à-vis the universe. From this position he has access to the realities which are ordinarily hidden from us by time and space, matter and energy. This is what we call the Great Work." ― Jacques Bergier, quoting Fulcanelli
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Posts: 3648 Joined: 11-Mar-2017 Last visit: 02-Nov-2024 Location: 🌎
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Loveall wrote:Enjoy Voidmatrix.
Fourth pull had 370mg. Very few crystals, scraped up it a semi solid orange with a little bit of oil.
I think this is polymerized DMT. Room temp Naphtha leaves this perfectly good DMT behind (I think) since polymerized DMT is less soluble at room temp. During re-x in a small amount of naphtha, the lower degree of polymerization parts go into solution first, leaving the more polymerized and darker DMT behind, which can give the illusion of a "clean-up", but in reality one could be throwing away the higher degree of polymerized DMT which is perfectly good.
I think I can de-polymerize it and get white xtals like Jees and I have done before. Will stir in organic acid overnight to break the polymer up and to a base extraction with minimal polymerization conditions (no salt, gentle pH, naphtha present while basing).
If the de-polymerization works, I'll get ~2.6% yield from 4 pulls of off-white xtals 🤞 Attempt to de-polymerize in progress. Will report in a couple days.
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Posts: 3648 Joined: 11-Mar-2017 Last visit: 02-Nov-2024 Location: 🌎
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A mini A/B with 5% vinegar + 5% citric + 5% ascorbic and 12 hours of stirring converted orange goo (first image) to white DMT (almost 100% conversion, see second image). Note: A previous attempt with 2% citric only and 24h was not successful (indicating it is not a contamination issue). This is a repeat of a previous result in a thread that Benz started and nothing new. So how about looking into a TEK that keeps polymerization in mind and tries to minimize it? So what would a "Min Poly TEK" look like? Some polymerization always happens, so maybe a TEK with a dedicated de-polymerization step is worth while. How about something like this: 1) Plant Matrix separation: Mix 100g bark, 200g water, and 25g of NaOH. Rest for 24h for plant matrix to be broken down. 2) De-polymerization: Add 500ml of vinegar. After that, dissolve in 40g of citric acid and 40g of ascorbic acid. Shake every once in a while for at least 24h. 3) FB extraction: Add 100ml of naphtha. Add 40g of NaOH to roughly neutralize the solution. Slowly add more NaOH (~10 to 20g) while mixing. Liquid will become cloudy temporarily and emulsions will form. With enough NaOH the emulsion will break. Siphon off naphtha. 4) Freeze precipitate as usual. Loveall attached the following image(s): IMG_20210916_092715904.jpg (727kb) downloaded 74 time(s). IMG_20210920_211200830.jpg (3,302kb) downloaded 76 time(s).
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 350 Joined: 13-Feb-2021 Last visit: 18-Jul-2023 Location: United States
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Apologies if this has been answered or is somewhere in the wiki, but I browsed very quickly to no avail and need to get to bed, so I thought I would put this out to see if the community had a decisive answer for me. If I have yellow spice that was pulled using a slightly modified cybs stb tek (NPS=naptha), could I, in theory, use toluene to clean it up a bit and turn it white? I ran out of naptha, but do have some tuluene from another hobby lying around, and was wondering if I could save a few dollars by simply using it.... Thanks in advance to anyone who may be able to help. Blessings. May we continue to be blessed
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 350 Joined: 21-Aug-2021 Last visit: 29-Jun-2023 Location: The Bible Belt
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The problem with solvents like Toluene and Xylene is you can not freeze precipate and that's where all those nice white crystals form. I can get pure white crystals pulling with plain Naptha if I freeze precipate but if I evaporate I always get yellow goo. Recrystallization using Naptha freeze precipation will turn the yellow goo into white crystals. You should really be saving, reusing and cleaning your Naptha anyway.
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 350 Joined: 13-Feb-2021 Last visit: 18-Jul-2023 Location: United States
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Dirty T wrote:The problem with solvents like Toluene and Xylene is you can not freeze precipate and that's where all those nice white crystals form. I can get pure white crystals pulling with plain Naptha if I freeze precipate but if I evaporate I always get yellow goo. Recrystallization using Naptha freeze precipation will turn the yellow goo into white crystals. You should really be saving, reusing and cleaning your Naptha anyway. Ok, thank you. However, it was freeze precipitate, and I was re-using it, I think that is how I ended up with the yellow is from re-using it multiple time. I was unaware that I could clean yellowed naptha back into clear May we continue to be blessed
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