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Psychosis and the use of psychedelic drugs Options
 
Seeingisbelieving
#1 Posted : 3/6/2021 12:10:05 AM

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James Kent Dosenation 2-10 : The Unravelling
MAPS bulletin
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3024828/
https://academic.oup.com/schizop...rticle/46/6/1396/5908041
https://academic.oup.com/schizop...rticle/46/6/1396/5908041
https://journals.plos.org/ploson...371/journal.pone.0063972
I propose that this be a safe NON JUDGMENTAL space to lay out experience reports concerning delusional ideas, voices in your head, seeing people who are not there, and completely breaking free from conventional reality. Please refrain from commenting on other peoples experiences in a judgmental way. Keep the preaching to a minimum. This thread is not here to argue about what is real and unreal. If we are dealing with psychotic phenomenon then most of what will be espoused is unexplainable. I know that some of you are saying "Are you an idiot? That's what psychedelic drugs do in the first place! " and what I have to say to that is I know, but there are people who were never able to fully grasp or accept difficult experiences or occurrences of psychotic phenomenon and I think being able to lay out those experiences and admitting you were fooled, damaged or deluded by the psychedelic experience can be a great harm reduction tool for future readers and current posters.

I have been trying to find an explanation for this experience for quite some time now and really have not been able to find answers outside of mysticism, non local phenomenon and religious experience.
Consider this my psychedelic delusion confessional and I encourage others to place their stories here.

When I was 15 years old I decided because I had tried mushrooms one times previously that I would ingest a "heroic" dose, 5 grams on a whim and then venture out to a friends house party. I ingested the 5 dried grams in one whole mushroom while a fellow traveler ingested 1/8 of an ounce. We set out together after downing our shrooms with Orange juice and were on the highway driving. Within ten minutes I was seeing infinite trails of speed limit signs, lights, and what seemed to be the sounds of my buddies sound system. We stopped at a quick trip and I will never forget how magical a quick trip bathroom can look that far out on psilocybin. I gathered myself into the car after my friend purchased myself cigarettes.( <the worst habit imaginable)

My friend who is extremely small immediately seemed Larger than the space he inhabited and was giving off the vibe of an alien Junk collector. We spent many minutes laughing about how we were feeling and continued on a busy highway to my friends home. We floated out of the now parked car under the street lamp across the street up the stairs and into the home. We wondered across the party house greeted by some friends in the kitchen. They were bathed in warm incandescent light and seemed to radiate pure happiness. I could hear, smell and feel deeply and felt glad to be there in that moment. I immediately made aware I was tripping on mushrooms and made my way downstairs to spend some time with a couch and some more cigarettes.

I sat amongst 10 or 15 of close friends and unknown people. Within minutes of sitting down a man sitting across from me who I had always had good standings with began transfiguring. His face was distorted incredibly and his face began growing horns, hair and multiples of eyes. Drool and blood was dripping from every orifice on the beast and it was staring right at me. I was convinced that I was losing my mind because when I looked away and looked back the tusks and hair were continuing to get longer. ( side note - this "friend" later hurt people I cared deeply about by sexually assaulting them and various other individuals while they were intoxicated and I truly believed it was because of my projection that this manifested into reality)

I rushed up from the couch sickened by the visual and demonic projection that I was placing on my new friend. I crawled through the legs of a group of people descending the basement stairs and burst through the screen door into the cold night air. I collapsed onto my hands and knees and began vomiting. I began hyperventilating and curled up into the fetal position. I looked into the sky and saw a familiar blue being wearing golden jewelry and wearing a crown of jewels looking down on me laughing about how foolish I had been to try and take a heroic dose of mushrooms in a bad setting. I collected myself, headed into the house and made my way into an empty bedroom, turned off the lights and lay down on a bed. THIS IS WHERE IT GETS INTERESTING TO ME

I stared with eyes open at a fibonacci spiral that felt as if it was pulling my whole being into it. The next moment I am flying above my friends house above the evergreens and looking down on lamp lit streets. I quickly have a sudden sense and notice that one car is driving very erratically. The car is swerving, playing loud music and all of a sudden crashed into a curb and mailbox. It felt like a snap and my consciousness was pulled back into my body and in one single motion I had sat up pulled out my flip phone and was already on the phone with my friend who had arrived at the party with me but I had completely forgotten. I spoke first and said "Oh my god dude did you just get into a car accident?" He replied "yeah How did you know?" and I said "I'm on five grams of mushrooms and just saw it happen"

He told me that he was about to pull up to the house and that I should come outside. I went outside onto the front porch, lit another cigarette and waited for him to pull up. He parked down the block and I made my way towards him. I retrieved my backpack full of herb from his car and kindly told him that I would not be continuing this journey with him.

I wrote up this experience report to highlight two main points. Mistakes I have made and what I learned from those mistakes. My teenage self naively ignored the advice of more seasoned experimenters and chose instead to do exactly what is warned against; Taking a high dose in an uncomfortable setting around people who were unfamiliar to myself . I want it to be clear my mind set at the time could not have been better but I mistakenly put myself in harms way by choosing to have the experience in an uncomfortable setting around unfamiliar people. The substance cannot be at total fault because I have had very great experiences on lower doses with my very close friends. Modern research is showing how psychedelic experiences are mimicking early psychosis by inducing a primary state of consciousness which I believe to be similar to the consciousness experienced by babies and toddlers.

This experience led to the creation of this artwork.






 

Trippy glass for trippy people.
 
grimlid
#2 Posted : 3/13/2021 6:42:37 AM

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Good mushrooms I guess. Cool story. I love hearing about out of body experiences. Ive had a few minor ones. Mostly from cocaine and sleep depravation.
I can only assume you eventually came to terms with the fact that you didnt cause the demonic monster friend to assault your other friends? Perhaps your intuitive psychedelic state allowed you to see the inner self he had hidden? Much as you witnessed the car accident while laying in the back yard....
"I think; therefore I might be."
 
Seeingisbelieving
#3 Posted : 3/13/2021 6:35:05 PM

so and so from wherever whenever


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grimlid wrote:
Good mushrooms I guess. Cool story. I love hearing about out of body experiences. Ive had a few minor ones. Mostly from cocaine and sleep depravation.
I can only assume you eventually came to terms with the fact that you didnt cause the demonic monster friend to assault your other friends? Perhaps your intuitive psychedelic state allowed you to see the inner self he had hidden? Much as you witnessed the car accident while laying in the back yard....


Hey grimlid,

Do you ever really come to terms with a break from reality? Most people do not. I believe the evidence that people never fully recover from psychotic episodes lies in the facts of the delusions of other that have come before us. I didn't post this to validate my experience NOR did I want an opinion or another "theory" about my experience. I posted this here to start a discussion about the delusional quality of psychedelic experiences and was curious to see if people were willing to "wake" up out of the matrix of delusion and speak openly about the negative aspects of the hallucination and echo chambers the psychedelic community creates. I grew up reading about entheogens here. I've read a lot of the books(not all but I have a SERIOUS collection of psychedelic literature) and the erowid website and was inspired by Terence Mckenna and all of the other "luminaries" and believe that young inexperienced people need to be aware that most of the "theories" and ideas espoused by the people in the psychedelic community were and are DELUSIONAL and magical thinking brought on by a psychotic episode.

If anyone wants to further discuss this topic in an open nonjudgmental way feel free to share your experiences.
 
grimlid
#4 Posted : 3/13/2021 7:05:16 PM

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Seeingisbelieving wrote:
grimlid wrote:
Good mushrooms I guess. Cool story. I love hearing about out of body experiences. Ive had a few minor ones. Mostly from cocaine and sleep depravation.
I can only assume you eventually came to terms with the fact that you didnt cause the demonic monster friend to assault your other friends? Perhaps your intuitive psychedelic state allowed you to see the inner self he had hidden? Much as you witnessed the car accident while laying in the back yard....


Hey grimlid,

Do you ever really come to terms with a break from reality? Most people do not. I believe the evidence that people never fully recover from psychotic episodes lies in the facts of the delusions of other that have come before us. I didn't post this to validate my experience NOR did I want an opinion or another "theory" about my experience. I posted this here to start a discussion about the delusional quality of psychedelic experiences and was willing to see if people were willing to "wake" up out of the matrix of delusion and speak openly about the negative aspects of the hallucination and echo chambers the psychedelic community creates. I grew up reading about entheogens here. I've read a lot of the books(not all but I have a SERIOUS collection of psychdelic literature) and the erowid website and was inspired by Terence Mckenna and all of the other "luminaries" and believe that young inexperienced people need to be aware that most of the "theories" and ideas espoused by the people in the psychdelic community were and are DELUSIONAL and magical thinking brought on by a psychotic episodes.

If anyone wants to further discuss this topic in an open nonjudgmental way feel free to share your "transcendent experiences" that have no real standing in the reality that we live every single day.

did I come across as judgmental?
I only usually judge how someone is affecting me based on their behavior or actions ect...I did state an assumption though, is that what you are referring to?
"I think; therefore I might be."
 
Seeingisbelieving
#5 Posted : 3/13/2021 7:38:01 PM

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No man I am not calling you judgmental. I'm just stating that is the atmosphere I would like to be kept in the thread. I would like people to share delusional experiences and crazy ideas they have gotten from psychedelic substances but It doesn't help if the people sharing are under the assumption that their delusions are real. I appreciated what you had to say on the other thread I commented on. I appreciate your opinions, truly. I just feel like the delusional aspects of the psychedelic experience and the way our mind is easily fooled by just about everything(seriously look into it) is a very important topic for discussion. I was hoping that there were a few skeptics on these boards that do not buy into the belief systems or thoughts such as "psychedelics reveal the truth of all reality" that permeate the psychedelic community but I am starting to see that I may be wrong.

Thanks for your time reading my story and I hope that I didn't come off as a bad guy to you or rub you the wrong way. We are all just humans trying to figure this out and I'm going to admit right now there is a LOT that I want to learn. Thank you again for your time.




 
grimlid
#6 Posted : 3/13/2021 8:12:50 PM

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Fully understood. thanks for the clarity. In this digital world I find communication can get easily misunderstood and context be switched by accident. I had actually composed a lengthy narrative of some schizophrenic episodes I have seen and experienced around mushrooms that grow locally in the pacific northwest that were not unlike your experience. Lol. I didnt want to hijack your thread though. to be continued thanks.
"I think; therefore I might be."
 
Seeingisbelieving
#7 Posted : 3/13/2021 8:14:00 PM

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please do share grimlid! I would love to read your experiences and am very glad to have you participate. Thank you again!
 
grimlid
#8 Posted : 3/13/2021 9:21:06 PM

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Wow where to even begin? Ive had so many mental health experiences while using psychedelics, not just me but close friends also.
As far as mental health and psychedelic drug use goes, to me it is a double edged sword or 2 way street. It Can go either way. I used to sit with the barrel of the family rifle (loaded) in my mouth regularly, like daily. Finding drugs made these feelings go away. Drinking alcohol huffing glue and eating lsd and shrooms seemed to make the suicidal thoughts disappear.
On the other side of that coin is the unwanted potential unlocking of schizophrenic episodes. When I read your post I was reminded of a medium sized counterculture high school grad party I attended where there was a huge bag of local mushrooms being handed out at the door. They grow prolifically around the pacific northwest in fall. I ate about 1.5 to 2 cups fresh wet and slimy. I had only done a few grams prior but had numerous breakthroughs combining huffing with shrooms. I wasn't ready for this though. My buddy who was epileptic and kind of followed us there wasn't supposed to get high but someone gave him shrooms. he started having a seizure and everyone is like asking me what to do.
Meanwhile people's faces are melting and their teeth are the size of 2 by fours and I start hearing voices in my head. Voices telling me to kill myself. Voices telling me love everyone. Voices telling me the dog can read my mind. Im hearing my friends voice (who wasnt there) telling me to call him. I try to escape assuming the cops are coming since my buddy needs an ambulance anyways. My girlfriend trys to convince me to have sex with her and her face turns to a hideous demon or monster. I am in sock feet and t shirt and run away into the december rain (mid year grad party for the kids who didnt pass previous semester lol).
I just started walking and listening to the voices in my head. I remember people staring at me, cars stopping to ask me if IM ok. I can't talk, I'm shaking but not cold. My socks have worn through and my feet are bleeding. I didn't notice these things. its 3 degrees or so, pouring rain and I walk about 4 miles wanting to tell my friend I keep hearing his voice in my head and its like a safe voice but the only pay phone is so far away at the ice rink. I finally get there and cant remember how to talk. Im trying to tell the guy I love him and he's my only safe person but he's like I cant understand you.
I walked back to the party to get my shoes and jacket. I'm grateful the voices stopped and my coping mechanism was to seek a safe friend and run away. What happened I cant say for sure. I can barely remember the walking part and my adolescent mind didn't want to psychoanalyze it overtly at the time. I was pretty embarrassed really. I had to dump the girl, I couldn't look at her anymore and she thought I was weird. Apparently I screamed when she wrapped her appendages around me and she was high too so I guess that traumatized her. I dropped out of school within a few weeks and became a drug dealer. Not sure what the pre disposition was or what the mushroom trip did. I don't blame the trip but I certainly cant say it was a positive contribution. I believe my own bad karma played a role here. I certainly played the role of the bad kid. Wanting to attempt an experience like the ones I read about in Carlos Castaneda's Teachings of Don Juan also played a factor here.
The same shrooms also in large amounts caused another kid who was already in university to attempt to kill his room mate under the belief that he was the messiah and the room mate was the anti christ. In his mind he was saving the world. He wound up in psychiatric care and narrowly avoided an attempted murder charge. the guy was badly injured with damage to his throat from strangulation and h=needed medical care to repair his damaged larynx. I tried to locate the guy to discuss this with him later but never could in the pre internet era.
No it isn't all sunshine and roses and I didn't really know that going in. That trip made me part of who I am today 35 years later so maybe Im a bit grateful. maybe. That's just one that really stood out for me, I could likely spin yarns on bad trips until the cows came home. the bad karma life I used to lead would warrant these things.
"I think; therefore I might be."
 
Voidmatrix
#9 Posted : 3/14/2021 12:47:33 AM

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Due to my own personal thinking relative to how much of an experience can be a part of reality, my opinions here are probably not the most appropriate.

I do think these kinds of discussions are healthy for harm reduction in many aspects, and thank you for starting it.

Thank you for sharing such deep and authentic experiences with us. I enjoyed reading both of your extremely intense experiences. Makes me just think, "oh mushrooms... as rough as you can be, I love you." Lol

One love
Question everything... including questioning everything...
There's so much I could be wrong about and have no idea...
The only safe place is the choice you make
All posts, responses, ideas and supposed experiences are that of an imaginary interdimensional being . This being comes to you with the proclivity and compulsion for delving in depths it shouldn't. That being said, everything posted must, perhaps, be taken lightly and with a grain of salt. πŸ‘½
 
Ramma
#10 Posted : 3/14/2021 1:16:51 AM

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Ive never gotten over my shock from DMT use
Blissful is solitude for one who's content, who has heard the Dhamma, who sees.
Blissful is non-affliction with regard for the world,restraint for living beings.
Blissful is dispassion with regard for the world, the overcoming of sensuality.
But the subduing of the conceit "I am"
That is truly
the ultimate bliss.
 
Seeingisbelieving
#11 Posted : 3/14/2021 4:06:02 AM

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Voidmatrix wrote:
Due to my own personal thinking relative to how much of an experience can be a part of reality, my opinions here are probably not the most appropriate.

I do think these kinds of discussions are healthy for harm reduction in many aspects, and thank you for starting it.

Thank you for sharing such deep and authentic experiences with us. I enjoyed reading both of your extremely intense experiences. Makes me just think, "oh mushrooms... as rough as you can be, I love you." Lol

One love



Feel free to post your experiences. Like I said no judgement will be directed to you or your beliefs. I really do think that being honest and admitting that you can be "fooled" is a valuable lesson. If you are not ready to admit that you hold onto delusions I understand. Thank you for the kind words and encouragement.
 
Seeingisbelieving
#12 Posted : 3/14/2021 4:14:45 AM

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Ramma wrote:
Ive never gotten over my shock from DMT use



Ramma, I know you have the experience base to draw from. If you feel comfortable sharing any experience that has lead to you having delusional thoughts or beliefs regarding reality feel free to post here. I'm very curious to read your stories. If you do choose to share please let it all out and do not forget a single detail.
 
Voidmatrix
#13 Posted : 3/14/2021 4:49:33 AM

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Seeingisbelieving wrote:
Voidmatrix wrote:
Due to my own personal thinking relative to how much of an experience can be a part of reality, my opinions here are probably not the most appropriate.

I do think these kinds of discussions are healthy for harm reduction in many aspects, and thank you for starting it.

Thank you for sharing such deep and authentic experiences with us. I enjoyed reading both of your extremely intense experiences. Makes me just think, "oh mushrooms... as rough as you can be, I love you." Lol

One love



Feel free to post your experiences. Like I said no judgement will be directed to you or your beliefs. I really do think that being honest and admitting that you can be "fooled" is a valuable lesson. If you are not ready to admit that you hold onto delusions I understand. Thank you for the kind words and encouragement.


Thank you. And don't get me wrong, I do think that delusions can stem from psychedelics and that our minds can be fooled, even in sobriety. Hence I suspend judgement overall. Experiences have a certain "seeming" relative to state of mind: some seemings seem "real," others identified as "delusions" and others that don't seem to be able to be identified within a paradigm of "seeming." For me with psychedelics, I've had experiences that "seemed" more "real than my waking "reality."

How do we decide what's real? What to believe? Where our convictions lie? This is different for everyone. And these questions come to what defines delusion, and is that defining structure in alignment with the "reality" of what is "delusion."

Overall, I know nothing, so can only say how it "seems," tripping or sober. I'm skeptical of it all.

There is the reality and then there is the filter of our experience to our minds of that reality. There is the processing, and the meta processing of that processing of reality. We create paradigm structures to explain it through edifying thought processing systems that are attempting to be as isomorphic as possible with "reality."

How far in their distinctions of reality are these things removed from "reality?"

Is it not a presupposition that there is a "reality?"

And are our attempts at objectivity nothing more than far reaching intersubjective verifyability? Thus potentially limited by the same delusions?

To be clear, this is a reflection of what goes on in mind with parameters around topics such as these. This is not to create a debate. Just showing a little of why I feel my opinions may not be appropriate, to respect topic parameters.

That said, I will share a short story with a massive hallucination.

Often, when there's a strong change in temperature, particularly cool to hot, I get nauseous if I'm tripping. Sensitive nervous system. Upon arriving to my apartment with my girlfriend at the time and another buddy from the movies, I knew upon walking in that I'd need to puke once in my unit.

I've learned to look forward to vomiting while tripping mushrooms, because one starts tripping 10x harder (at least I do)

I had eaten 7g.

My girlfriend beat me to the bathroom...

So I went into the kitchen and vomited in the sink. I didn't bother turning the lights on, and so only a little bled into the space.

As I finished vomiting, these flexing wavering tubes appeared before my eyes, multicolored neon in appearance. It seemed to be responding to my movements. Then to me specifically. Especially since the tubes were rotating, embedded with eyes locked onto to me through each tube's length. They blinked occasionally, but were completely fixated on me. I could feel something from them, but it's inexpressible.

One love
Question everything... including questioning everything...
There's so much I could be wrong about and have no idea...
The only safe place is the choice you make
All posts, responses, ideas and supposed experiences are that of an imaginary interdimensional being . This being comes to you with the proclivity and compulsion for delving in depths it shouldn't. That being said, everything posted must, perhaps, be taken lightly and with a grain of salt. πŸ‘½
 
Ramma
#14 Posted : 3/14/2021 5:06:29 AM

Drinking DMT smoke


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the problem is we are all deluded Very happy
Blissful is solitude for one who's content, who has heard the Dhamma, who sees.
Blissful is non-affliction with regard for the world,restraint for living beings.
Blissful is dispassion with regard for the world, the overcoming of sensuality.
But the subduing of the conceit "I am"
That is truly
the ultimate bliss.
 
Voidmatrix
#15 Posted : 3/14/2021 5:10:42 AM

Surrender and BE free


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Ramma wrote:
the problem is we are all deluded Very happy


Love it!Big grin
Question everything... including questioning everything...
There's so much I could be wrong about and have no idea...
The only safe place is the choice you make
All posts, responses, ideas and supposed experiences are that of an imaginary interdimensional being . This being comes to you with the proclivity and compulsion for delving in depths it shouldn't. That being said, everything posted must, perhaps, be taken lightly and with a grain of salt. πŸ‘½
 
Ramma
#16 Posted : 3/14/2021 5:33:28 AM

Drinking DMT smoke


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Delusion is our wrong understanding or wrong views of reality. Delusion is our misperception of the way the world works; our inability to understand the nature of things exactly as they are, free of perceptual distortions. Influenced by delusion, we are not in harmony with ourselves, others, or with life; we are not living in accordance with Dharma. Affected by the poison of delusion, which arises from ignorance of our true nature, we do not understand the interdependent and impermanent nature of life. Thus, we are constantly looking outside of ourselves for happiness, satisfaction, and solutions to our problems. This outward searching creates even more frustration, anger, and delusion. Because of our delusion, we also do not understand the virtuous, life-affirming actions that create happiness, nor do we understand the nonvirtuous, negative, and unwholesome actions that create suffering. Again, our delusion binds us to a vicious cycle where there does not appear to be any way out.

Blissful is solitude for one who's content, who has heard the Dhamma, who sees.
Blissful is non-affliction with regard for the world,restraint for living beings.
Blissful is dispassion with regard for the world, the overcoming of sensuality.
But the subduing of the conceit "I am"
That is truly
the ultimate bliss.
 
downwardsfromzero
#17 Posted : 3/14/2021 10:11:22 PM

Peeing into the abyss

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If anything, psychedelics have illuminated preexisting delusion in my life. And any further delusions that may have sprung from the sense of limitless possibilities that the psychedelic experience can ignite have still been products of my own mind. Of course, as Ramma explains, being deluded in the first place it is not easy to recognize it as such. From a state of delusion there is a high risk of mistaking a newly uncovered delusion for some facet of 'ultimate truth' and, energy following attention and all that, this can as it were add fuel to the fire. If this feeds back into everyday life after coming down the effects can be catastrophic. This has a lot to do with the term that Robert Anton Wilson used - "Chapel Perilous".

It is eminently right to warn of this aspect of risk that psychedelics present but in keeping with what Voidmatrix says concerning the nature of reality we must balance it with an understanding of the degree to which various types of delusion continue unchecked in everyday life without any assistance from psychedelics whatsoever.

Again, psychedelics amplify what is already there. If that is a delusional state we cannot always guarantee that we will identify it as such. Another phrase that springs to mind here is "imprint vulnerability".

[Sorry that I have to break off from this line of thought for now as it is my bedtime.]

Ramma wrote:
Thus, we are constantly looking outside of ourselves for happiness, satisfaction, and solutions to our problems. This outward searching creates even more frustration, anger, and delusion
Hits the nail, on the head.
Ora, lege, lege, lege, relege et labora

β€œThere is a way of manipulating matter and energy so as to produce what modern scientists call 'a field of force'. The field acts on the observer and puts him in a privileged position vis-à-vis the universe. From this position he has access to the realities which are ordinarily hidden from us by time and space, matter and energy. This is what we call the Great Work."
― Jacques Bergier, quoting Fulcanelli
 
Seeingisbelieving
#18 Posted : 3/14/2021 11:31:34 PM

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downwardsfromzero wrote:
If anything, psychedelics have illuminated preexisting delusion in my life. And any further delusions that may have sprung from the sense of limitless possibilities that the psychedelic experience can ignite have still been products of my own mind. Of course, as Ramma explains, being deluded in the first place it is not easy to recognize it as such. From a state of delusion there is a high risk of mistaking a newly uncovered delusion for some facet of 'ultimate truth' and, energy following attention and all that, this can as it were add fuel to the fire. If this feeds back into everyday life after coming down the effects can be catastrophic. This has a lot to do with the term that Robert Anton Wilson used - "Chapel Perilous".

It is eminently right to warn of this aspect of risk that psychedelics present but in keeping with what Voidmatrix says concerning the nature of reality we must balance it with an understanding of the degree to which various types of delusion continue unchecked in everyday life without any assistance from psychedelics whatsoever.

Again, psychedelics amplify what is already there. If that is a delusional state we cannot always guarantee that we will identify it as such. Another phrase that springs to mind here is "imprint vulnerability".

[Sorry that I have to break off from this line of thought for now as it is my bedtime.]

Ramma wrote:
Thus, we are constantly looking outside of ourselves for happiness, satisfaction, and solutions to our problems. This outward searching creates even more frustration, anger, and delusion
Hits the nail, on the head.


I may have worded my original post in the wrong way and I think that is why you guys are getting the wrong idea. I will work on fixing that. I only ask for you to share psychedelic experiences leading to psychosis defined here. Delusions fall in line with textbook definition of psychosis. If you are not able to accept modern medical theory we are not going to be able to share space in this thread. I did not ask for judgement, philosophical explanations about what is real or unreal or preaching buddhist principles of dharma which oddly suggest admitting delusion and freeing one self from all illusion is the true end of enlightenmentVery happy . I really would prefer to keep this thread rolling with experiences! I would love if you shared an experience DWZ and if you cannot I understand. These types of experiences do NOT happen to everyone! Thank you for your time!
 
Voidmatrix
#19 Posted : 3/14/2021 11:37:29 PM

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Seeingisbelieving wrote:
downwardsfromzero wrote:
If anything, psychedelics have illuminated preexisting delusion in my life. And any further delusions that may have sprung from the sense of limitless possibilities that the psychedelic experience can ignite have still been products of my own mind. Of course, as Ramma explains, being deluded in the first place it is not easy to recognize it as such. From a state of delusion there is a high risk of mistaking a newly uncovered delusion for some facet of 'ultimate truth' and, energy following attention and all that, this can as it were add fuel to the fire. If this feeds back into everyday life after coming down the effects can be catastrophic. This has a lot to do with the term that Robert Anton Wilson used - "Chapel Perilous".

It is eminently right to warn of this aspect of risk that psychedelics present but in keeping with what Voidmatrix says concerning the nature of reality we must balance it with an understanding of the degree to which various types of delusion continue unchecked in everyday life without any assistance from psychedelics whatsoever.

Again, psychedelics amplify what is already there. If that is a delusional state we cannot always guarantee that we will identify it as such. Another phrase that springs to mind here is "imprint vulnerability".

[Sorry that I have to break off from this line of thought for now as it is my bedtime.]

Ramma wrote:
Thus, we are constantly looking outside of ourselves for happiness, satisfaction, and solutions to our problems. This outward searching creates even more frustration, anger, and delusion
Hits the nail, on the head.


I may have worded my original post in the wrong way and I think that is why you guys are getting the wrong idea. I will work on fixing that. I only ask for you to share psychedelic experiences leading to psychosis defined here. Delusions fall in line with textbook definition of psychosis. If you are not able to accept modern medical theory we are not going to be able to share space in this thread. I did not ask for judgement, philosophical explanations about what is real or unreal or preaching buddhist principles of dharma which oddly suggest admitting delusion and freeing one self from all illusion is the true end of enlightenmentVery happy . I really would prefer to keep this thread rolling with experiences! I would love if you shared an experience DWZ and if you cannot I understand. These types of experiences do NOT happen to everyone! Thank you for your time!


I will respectfully bow out of this thread after this post.

But I hope you know I wasn't judging you and I appreciate you.

One love
Question everything... including questioning everything...
There's so much I could be wrong about and have no idea...
The only safe place is the choice you make
All posts, responses, ideas and supposed experiences are that of an imaginary interdimensional being . This being comes to you with the proclivity and compulsion for delving in depths it shouldn't. That being said, everything posted must, perhaps, be taken lightly and with a grain of salt. πŸ‘½
 
dreamer042
#20 Posted : 3/15/2021 3:25:55 AM

Dreamoar

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I'd say your story is less about psychosis than it is about youthful recklessness. It's nothing more than an inexperienced kid taking too much, in the wrong place, at the wrong time. This is just the school of hard knocks way that's taught most of us how and why to use these things responsibly.

This is not to discount the facts that psychedelics can perpetuate delusional thinking, and, like any stressor, can trigger a psychotic break in those with an existing predisposition for psychotic disorders. The main qualifiers here are whether the hallucinatory and delusional effects persist after the substance wears off, and whether or not those symptoms interfere with normal functioning.

The harm reduction is the same as it ever was. Know your body, know your mind, know your substance, know your source. Ensure a safe and productive set and setting. Use a sitter if necessary. Have a toolkit of coping strategies available, and know what resources are available to you if and when you need them.

It's quite interesting that psychedelics are now being employed (in proper context, under the guidance of trained professionals) to treat many of the mental illnesses that can be perpetuated when using them irresponsibly. Quite an interesting turn of events I'd say.
Row, row, row your boat, Gently down the stream. Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily...

Visual diagram for the administration of dimethyltryptamine

Visual diagram for the administration of ayahuasca
 
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