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The direct e-mesh thread. Options
 
Egzoset
#561 Posted : 10/7/2020 5:06:04 PM

Vaporist of Borg


Posts: 210
Joined: 21-Oct-2010
Last visit: 06-Mar-2024
Location: Qc/Can
Salutations Propello,

Propello wrote:
I welcome any suggestions to get the thread better in quality.


No problem, just heat the mesh wirelessly and explore ribon-based distribution as when boys had toy guns working on a paper roll featured with tiny explosive charges printed on it. Except your mesh tape would release aerosols instead, and the obvious shape to do so is a toroïd core, some slotted one in this case i believe:



Yet you're still plain denying/ignoring the accumulated value i've put over the years in my customized Hybrid Core alternative which greatly improved VaporGenie's Classic/Bronze pipes and this you just can't pretend to know, because just like the toroïd IH driver you'd rather not try it now that it's been suggested by the Magnificent & Omnipotent Egzoset...

Which is quite fine with me as i couldn't imagine i actually had such powers.

Good day, have fun. Cool
Egzoset attached the following image(s):
Principles of Tape Recording [720x360] .PNG (186kb) downloaded 402 time(s).
Eduard Schuller - Ring Magnetic Head .JPG (13kb) downloaded 402 time(s).
 

Live plants. Sustainable, ethically sourced, native American owned.
 
quantimoto
#562 Posted : 10/7/2020 10:26:30 PM
DMT-Nexus member


Posts: 35
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Last visit: 08-Oct-2020
I think I speak for several readers when I say, we can't understand this diagram - we're (I'm) too dumb, but if you can point us to where said tech can be acquired, I'm sure we'd love to try it Smile

Egzoset wrote:
Salutations Propello,

Propello wrote:
I welcome any suggestions to get the thread better in quality.


No problem, just heat the mesh wirelessly and explore ribon-based distribution as when boys had toy guns working on a paper roll featured with tiny explosive charges printed on it. Except your mesh tape would release aerosols instead, and the obvious shape to do so is a toroïd core, some slotted one in this case i believe:



Yet you're still plain denying/ignoring the accumulated value i've put over the years in my customized Hybrid Core alternative which greatly improved VaporGenie's Classic/Bronze pipes and this you just can't pretend to know, because just like the toroïd IH driver you'd rather not try it now that it's been suggested by the Magnificent & Omnipotent Egzoset...

Which is quite fine with me as i couldn't imagine i actually had such powers.

Good day, have fun. Cool

 
Egzoset
#563 Posted : 10/8/2020 6:07:27 AM

Vaporist of Borg


Posts: 210
Joined: 21-Oct-2010
Last visit: 06-Mar-2024
Location: Qc/Can
Salutations QuantiMoto,

quantimoto wrote:
I think I speak for several readers when I say, we can't understand this diagram - we're (I'm) too dumb, but if you can point us to where said tech can be acquired...


Oh sure, i'm ready to accept the premise that nobody here still ain't made too dumb not to manage using Google Images for their own personal education:

[ https:// image.slideserve.com/714723/tape-playing-l.jpg ]

It's seems i got specially creative with this one, i mean all that green...

Big grin

Now lets see if that other sample will ring a bell:

[ https:// www.physics.brocku.ca/PPLATO/h-flap/phys4_4.html ]
PPLATO | FLAP | PHYS 4.4: Electromagnetic induction
{ Figure 23 See Question E1. }

Once again address complaints to the author, i only picked that up at random.

Anyway it was about some "...schematic diagram of the playback head...", maybe you'll want to ask the author as well!

Wut?

Somehow i didn't think anyone here would actually mind... Not to mention Egzoset, le Magnifique & Tout Puissant (...), has forbiden exploration of Induction Heat by all others except himself and hence more specifically reserves heating by magnetic hysteresis losses, naturally including any eventual application(s) of the Curie effect besides support for Bi-Energy and Inlet Water, thanks to the Y2K invention of Dan Steinberg (ref.: the item of Fig. #11/#12 of his 1st patent, #US 7434584)...

Rolling eyes

Too bad it's been done already, just not yet!

M'well, JAi's "Curie Pyrolyzer" was invented in 1969...

[ http:// www.jai.co.jp/english/company/history.html ]
Nov. 1969 Released the first Curie point pyrolyzer JHP-1.

So, who else never heard of it?? Just curious.

Good day, have fun. Cool

 
Tony6Strings
#564 Posted : 10/8/2020 1:14:11 PM

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Last visit: 22-Feb-2022
Egzoset, send me a pipe. I will try it out and tell you what I think compared to my rig, which is a glass vapor genie with healthstone in bowl, heated with micro torch.
olympus mon wrote:
You need to hit it with intention to get where you want to be!

"Good and evil lay side by side as electric love penetrates the sky..." -Hendrix

"We have arrived at truth, and now we find truth is a mystery- a play of joy, creation, and energy. This is source. This is the mystic touchstone that heals and renews. This is the beginning again. This is entheogenic." -Nicholas Sand
 
PedroSanchez
#565 Posted : 10/8/2020 8:31:46 PM

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Posts: 414
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Last visit: 09-Jul-2023
Egzoset wrote:
Salutations Propello,

Propello wrote:
I welcome any suggestions to get the thread better in quality.


No problem, just heat the mesh wirelessly and explore ribon-based distribution as when boys had toy guns working on a paper roll featured with tiny explosive charges printed on it. Except your mesh tape would release aerosols instead, and the obvious shape to do so is a toroïd core, some slotted one in this case i believe:



Yet you're still plain denying/ignoring the accumulated value i've put over the years in my customized Hybrid Core alternative which greatly improved VaporGenie's Classic/Bronze pipes and this you just can't pretend to know, because just like the toroïd IH driver you'd rather not try it now that it's been suggested by the Magnificent & Omnipotent Egzoset...

Which is quite fine with me as i couldn't imagine i actually had such powers.

Good day, have fun. Cool


interesting concept.
i do not completely understand the design you are suggesting but i think you are saying there is a tape and a 'recording head', similar to an analogue cassette and player, but i guess instead of a speaker output you would just heat a mesh with the output?
the concept makes a lot of sense, but my doubt would be with the power needed to drive the motor in order to wind the tape, and whether that would be better used to directly heat the mesh.
it certainly sounds like you have thought about this a lot though, and i am no expert in these areas. if i am correct about your design i would love to hear, if you have solved this yet, what the solution to this is, or even if it is worthy of thinking about. my guess is my understanding of driving motors and heating mesh is making me overthink it.

thank you for sharing your ideas
 
Egzoset
#566 Posted : 10/9/2020 1:40:36 AM

Vaporist of Borg


Posts: 210
Joined: 21-Oct-2010
Last visit: 06-Mar-2024
Location: Qc/Can
Salutations Tony6Strings,

Tony6Strings wrote:
Egzoset, send me a pipe.


That's a bit late as i've stopped giving them away nearly a year after the destruction phase was over, which was a gesture i never publicized anyway. Not to mention the last time i considered such scenario it would have had to be done anonymously and within Québec's provincial borders.

The procedure is nothing complicated: remember, i always made my best to keep my semi-DiY challenge(s) as easy to "DUPLICATE & PEER REVIEW" as it can get, with 250+ illustrations to assist almost intuitively...

PedroSanchez wrote:
...i think you are saying...


Only saying that the slotted toroïd was retained for early tape recording design and i figure that was for a few good reasons.

PedroSanchez wrote:
...you would just heat a mesh with the output?


That's the idea, except a ribon of mesh should't really require a motor at all just to get its distribution wheel depleted... The "motor" references were mainly retricted to flux-concentration, not necessarily a refurbished stator as the laminated core might seem inadequate, or at least when trying to experiment with the higher-frequency spectrum (e.g. as a result of eddy-currents). But, maybe preliminary testing based on it might still provide some clues, nonetheless.

Wink

PedroSanchez wrote:
...if you have solved this yet...


Egzoset is used to work alone since i created the alias in 2010, it turns out i made a publication today which illustrates how much patience and other resources are necessary to make ideas progress:

[ https:// postimg.cc/JtXDnZtP ]
The tool box... {2020-Oct-8}

My previous contribution here suggested there's true benefits to switch from resistive conduction heating to wireless induction heat, with no ohmic contacts to interact and convenient conversion to convection mode thanks to the VaporGenie legacy, combined to IH driving precisely...


[ https:// i.postimg.cc/9FyZFCrh/Vapor-Genie-US-7434584-2008-Oct-14-Egzoset-s-fig-11-12-suppl.png ]

Using Induction Heat it should become possible to gain better control over the heat vector ratios (convective, radiative and conductive modes), simply stick to this basic sandwich structure:


[ https:// s33.postimg.cc/yznpddanj/Egzoset_s_Lava_Wand_Concept_-_Capsule_2017-_Apr-22_150x120.png ]

Then eventually there shall be light!... Pleased



Actually i realize the tape doesn't even have to be a susceptor if/when empowered by convection heating; though the current e-Mesh concept could get a similar convective adaptation i suppose...

Good day, have fun!! Cool
Egzoset attached the following image(s):
VaporGenie US 7434584 (2008-Oct-14) - Egzoset's fig. 11-12 supplement [480x640] .PNG (110kb) downloaded 340 time(s).
 
PedroSanchez
#567 Posted : 10/11/2020 10:02:41 AM

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sounds awesome egzoset!
is this something you are planning to build again?
it sounds to me like you do not want to build any, so are sharing the design?
i wish i could build one to play with but i do not fully understand the concepts.

thank you for sharing <3
 
Egzoset
#568 Posted : 10/11/2020 1:14:32 PM

Vaporist of Borg


Posts: 210
Joined: 21-Oct-2010
Last visit: 06-Mar-2024
Location: Qc/Can
Salutations PedroSanchez,

PedroSanchez wrote:
sounds awesome egzoset!


M'well, if you really wish to flatter me please just put a capital "E" to Egzoset, as when i was a young man the teachers insisted this was a polite thing to do... But i must confess being born into the previous century.

PedroSanchez wrote:
...something you are planning to build again?


Well, there are 3 possibilities i can think of so far, so it must be about one of those scenarios:

#1) To "bonify" the e-Mesh concept
#2) To explore my diverse "Plan-A" IH-driven projects
#3) To semi-DiY one more Customized VaporGenie Pipe

PedroSanchez wrote:
...it sounds to me like you do not want to build any...


It depends on which item you pick.

For starters my perception of the e-Mesh solution is that it got to get rid of conduction heat besides its ohmic contacts, but i can accept and understand some incentives related to portability requirements. My LAVACapsule {"Plan-A"} is mostly still in the conceptual phase, in need to identify a proper IH driver for situations inviting a lot of abuse during an early exploratory phase focussed on magnetics, while i'd be glad to assist in the duplication of my work on a potential patent extension for Steinberg's invention, though he couldn't care less each time i tried to raise awareness that his item of Fig. #11/12 could have been included as a "susceptor" in his initial Y2K patent anyway. Except he didn't visualize a "Bi-Energy" setup and i did, which is why i claim my IH delivery tool is ready for a transposition to induction heat: instead of a torch one can conveniently rely on electricity which enables precision micro-dosing and more.

PedroSanchez wrote:
...sharing the design?


My intellectual property was offered openly with no restrictions besides the implications of relying of an existing patent product for my "Prototyping Platform", though as far as i can tell it seems Dan Steinberg didn't consider my recommendation to include Induction Heat in a 3rd VaporGenie patent... Which means as long as it's not simultaneously using fire and SiC foam that's still a distinct niche waiting to emerge. Please take note Egzoset NEVER wanted to get involved in any mercantile activity whatsoever: you provide the material, i can assist with simple instructions about hos to customized a selected VG pipe.

Big grin

PedroSanchez wrote:
...i wish i could build one to play with but i do not fully understand the concepts.


Ah, then i believe it's about item #3. Pleased

Basically one must choose between the Classic Wood, Classic Aluminium or the Bronze Sherlock. The later requiring slightly more lungs force in exchange for increased ease of experience repetition, because of the excellent level of control rendered possible with an On-Top (Sphere) Inlet "PinHole" (manually controlled by the index finger); the price to pay for such convenience being a lesser aroma/taste appreciation. In other words if quality overides quantity on your priority list then i got to recommand a Classic, preferably the Aluminium model with reclaims/maintenance in mind. The Classic Wood may be a better choice if worried about hacking/crafting difficulty levels, it's certainly more forgiving because its 2 metal parts are easy to refurbish if you're handy enough with wood; in addition that could also help acquiring modding skills with the more expensive models in mind (for future upgrades as the fun multiplies with the number of tops)...

Very happy

The slow process of focussing so much on preliminary electronics design simply reflects a void of preparation caused by the Mazzilli topology acting as a monopolizing anchor in the Induction Heat universe, but before that aspect there's a total lack of "Inlet Water" so my only hope is to make "Plan-A" (IH) and "Plan-B" (butane) co-exist simultaneously in order to perform power injection electronically though also generating Inlet Water from the extra-hot exhaust (H2O and CO2) gases from the clean-combustion of butane. This implies my customized VG top must endure intense blue torch fire and prove compatible with the flux-concentrating plunger of an IH driver yet to conceive... Quite another long path to walk for someone who's "opportunity window" actually passed a couple years ago.

My period of active/intensive vaporist experimentation which got its real 2nd start in 2013 didn't just cost time and money: that was physically demanding, so much i can't imagine going through this sort of challenge again. Lucky me, the "LAVA" Hybrid Core layout appears to have reached some fair level of maturity, but i yet ain't sure if an aluminium top will do in both Bi-Energy modes and the more those ideas progress the less i feel like having definitive answers. In any case "Plan-B" is quite ready if you want it!

PedroSanchez wrote:
...thank you for sharing...


Please don't mention it, as a matter of fact it turns out Egzoset's mood can change unpredictably when the ratio of "socialization" to that of announced topic overrides my sensitivity threshold...

A dedicated thread has been launched a long while ago:

[ https:// www.dmt-nexus.me/forum/d...aspx?g=posts&t=87419 ]

It's been waiting for a post much like yours for quite some time now, but if you prefer not to post there that's much the same to me anyway. Once the exchange is launched i'd suggest you should feel free to re-use items of my pictures collection for the addition and support of your own anotations, or maybe just a mention of the filename/datestamp will work as well.

Lets see:

[ https:// www.flickr.com/photos/egzoset/ ]

The following picture corresponds to "Bag, Straw, Pipe {2018-Dec-8} [300x400] .PNG" and it's supposed to be available for download:

[ https://www.flickr.com/photos/egzoset/49729544137/ ]

But this has been "stretching it" too far relatively to that present thread's announced topic so my suggestion to Tony6Strings is to make room in future plans to include:

#1) Conversion from Conductive Heat to Convective + Radiative, possibly with a moderate bit of conduction for pre-heating purposes.

#2) Conversion to Induction Heat in order to improve safety by physically separating the consumption tool from its power source, in order to never carry a stressed high-density power cell close to the face ever again... Call me paranoïd if it serves!

To conclude, back to my explosive powder tape evocation (as those used by kids in their toy gun), i can easily envision IH-driven "Micro-Bursting" applied to a temperature-resistant substrate capable of withstanding potent/time-compressed IH e-Mesh pulsing especially meant to target tiny features of the contact-surface: noble substances would get depleted by the time their corresponding substrate position on such tape roll (or disc...) might start to cause significant/accumulated "baking" contamination. In this later case one will even prefer his substrate to be jetable i presume!

...

Good day, have fun!! Cool
 
PedroSanchez
#569 Posted : 10/12/2020 7:36:00 PM

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i appreciate the information you have given. i cant make enough sense of it to be able to build one right now or decipher into a tek, but if this concept works how i imagine it to then i would love to see a tek for it.
money is short for me so unfortunately i cant spend the money needed to experiment with the concept enough to understand it fully, or even just build one, given a complete tek. i am still saving money to build an emesh vape tool Very happy

if you can write a step by step tek suitable for idiots like me then i think you will make a lot of people very happy. i honestly think the reason nobody is showing an interest in your design is because they do not understand it.
if you have some free time and you can write a tek i think you will write your own chunk of psychonaught history.

hopefully you can find the time. i would love to try this thing one day <3
 
Egzoset
#570 Posted : 10/12/2020 10:28:46 PM

Vaporist of Borg


Posts: 210
Joined: 21-Oct-2010
Last visit: 06-Mar-2024
Location: Qc/Can
Salutations PedroSanchez,

PedroSanchez wrote:
...still saving money to build an emesh vape tool...


It's all free and nobody else is in a more suitable position to decide if you can afford whatever the next step is going to be for you.

PedroSanchez wrote:
...if you can write a step by step tek suitable for idiots...


I'll leave it to experts in idiots, or digital archeologists, etc...

PedroSanchez wrote:
...hopefully you can find the time...


Bad gambling habit, lets wish you get luckier next time!

PedroSanchez wrote:
...hopefully you can find the time...


Years may work for you too, who knows...

It's already been done before, just not yet.
 
anonabyss
#571 Posted : 10/17/2020 5:16:10 AM
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Hey everyone, this is my first post. A huge thank you goes out to Aum_Shanti, Propello, and everyone else in this thread for pioneering this method. This is my favorite method I have tried so far to vaporize DMT. Here's what I'm using:

Voopoo Drag 2
Vandy Vape Mesh RDA V2
100 Micron Wire Mesh

I plan to add some kind of attachment to cool the vapor a bit, but I haven't gotten around to it yet. I have a Sai Poseidon V2 bubbler which I would love to use, but it's too small to fit around the VV V2.





Egzoset wrote:
...induction...convection...


Egzoset, I'm trying to make sense of the plethora of technical tidbits you have so generously shared with all of us. You say a lot about induction heating but do you have a working prototype that uses inductive heating? It seems like your more complete works are gvg modifications that use combustion heating. Is that right? I'd love to see some concrete data on an induction/convection based DMT vaporizer.

That being said, I think you're in for some challenges. I'll address these two orthogonal dimensions separately:
1. Resistive vs inductive heat generation
2. Conductive vs convective heat transfer

1. I'm struggling to see the advantage of inductive heating. I think it's going to be a more complex design. I may just be naive, but I can't help but feel that you're over-engineering it a bit with an induction based approach.

2. I can definitely see temperature stability as an advantage of digitally controlled convection heating, but you have this challenge of getting the DMT up to temperature in a reasonable amount of time. It's one thing when you can directly blow a butane torch on it, but I think the electrical approach is going to require a large heating element and high power. I expect there would be a warm-up period. Also, I think think the advantage of spatially even heating with convection is not so unique when the e-mesh already allows us to evenly distribute the DMT over the heating element as a liquid in a thin layer.

Anyway, I'm still very interested to see what you come up with. Storz & Bickel has done a great job of combining conductive and convective heating into their vaporizers to get phenomenal temperature control. Some people have used Storz & Bickel vaporizers on DMT with great success (haven't tried it yet myself). Unfortunately, there's a long warm-up time and poor battery life, plus the devices are bulky and expensive. There are a lot of other convection devices designed for dry herb vaporization, though I'm not sure about their effectiveness with DMT.

Ultimately, the linchpin in any electrical vaporizer of a temperature sensitive substance is a good controller. I don't think a purely analog approach would yield very good results. Totally custom hardware may also require custom software. You'll need a way to measure temperature and adjust voltage appropriately.

This is actually one weakness we have with e-mesh: the temps are a bit unpredictable because these controllers are not designed to react fast enough to so little heat capacity and evaporative heat loss. They also don't seem to measure the temperature of the mesh accurately.

Egzoset, please keep us up to date with any prototypes. Thanks for sharing your design ideas.
 
Egzoset
#572 Posted : 10/18/2020 5:10:36 PM

Vaporist of Borg


Posts: 210
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Last visit: 06-Mar-2024
Location: Qc/Can
Salutations AnonAbyss,

anonabyss wrote:
Egzoset wrote:
...induction...convection...


Egzoset, I'm trying to make sense...


Well i can't but observe Egzoset is so popular a topic this continues to obliterate most of what was actually written by the Magnificent & Omnipotent Egzoset.

And of course despite an obvious absence of trust... Some would think defiance, if not an extravagant display of communications resources DOING NOTHING which concerns me anyway.

That's fine, quite a bit demotivating but you'll see me on the corner again each time the "GVG" is instrumentalized as a "reference".

To top it all the simple fact this previous post practically demands even more contributions from the poor Egzoset who already spent a couple thousands dollars on it since the alias got created in 2010, just to get the privilege of perpetuating these head games a decade later. I could have used the word "plethora" myself...

Quite fine, business as usual.

Oh, "tidbits". Time to diner!

Well that's all been repeated beyond using direct visual expression, long long ago: it's been done already, just not yet!...

Good day, have fun!! Cool
 
likestrees
#573 Posted : 10/19/2020 1:03:37 AM
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Location: Australia
Propello wrote:
Just received a new mesh dripper that looks very promising.
Vapefly Mesh Plus RDA, https://www.heavengifts....pefly-Mesh-Plus-RDA.html

This one has a flat deck and a lot more space than the vandy vape. I will post some photos with build tomorrow.






Confirmed this RDA and the whole e-mesh setup works amazingly! thank you propello so much! It is an almost perfect way to work with spice (if you could somehow combine the ease of loading of liquid vaping with the certainty of dosage and clean administration of this then we will have the absolute holy grail). To use the Vapefly Mesh Plus RDA i just cut out the mesh to the specs mentioned on the tutorial post, and then trimmed down a little as needed to fit.

I had only 12mg!! and it was so ridiculously profoundly beautiful, much stronger than that dosage on any other method for me though i am a light weight. I just kept saying 'thank you for my life, i love you so much' over and over again. Complete cosmic bliss/ecstasy/euphoria and gratitude for the entire process that led to me being here. I only needed to inhale one tiny flavourless wisp of smoke, by far the cleanest and easiest to get down method ive ever used. Start on a low dosage as recommended!

I paid $192 aud for the whole setup, including a liquid tank as recommended elsewhere by propello which i can also confirm works great. Its nice to be able to use the same mod for both e-mesh and liquid.

e-mesh shopping list:
- Geekvape Aegis Solo 100W Box MOD
- Efest Slim K2 Dual Bay Charger
- SAMSUNG 18650 25R High Drain Li-Lion Battery 20A 2500mAH
- Vapefly MeshPlus RDA (rainbow)
- 510 XL glass drip tip + heatsink + shipping
- 100 micron stainless steel mesh SS304

optional add-on for liquid vaping:
- Vaporesso Veco Tank (2ml)
- Vaporesso EUC Coils (5 Pack) Ceramic 0.3ohm

again couldn't be happier with this set up, it is amazing technology! thank you everyone.



 
Goombas69
#574 Posted : 10/21/2020 8:23:26 PM
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Is Vapefly Mesh Plus RDA the best option and new standard now that Vandy Vape Mesh RDAs are so hard to find?
 
ithaca
#575 Posted : 10/22/2020 10:48:11 AM

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Goombas69 wrote:
Is Vapefly Mesh Plus RDA the best option and new standard now that Vandy Vape Mesh RDAs are so hard to find?


The VV v2 is pretty easy to find still. The Vapefly is much harder in my experience.
 
pierrotlefou
#576 Posted : 10/22/2020 9:02:15 PM
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don't understand... what is the advantage of the "Vapefly Mesh Plus RDA" compare to the "classic" one ?
 
fog
#577 Posted : 10/23/2020 2:56:58 AM
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Easy to find vandy vape v1 mesh clones on aliexpress and fasttech.
 
Goombas69
#578 Posted : 10/23/2020 6:57:00 PM
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Thanks for the responses. I have ordered a VV 2. I only found one out there but that's all I need. It just looks like it could be temperamental and I don't want to be trying to make some custom mod-glass setup. I would have gotten a VV 1 clone if I could correctly identify and buy one. Hopefully I won't have issues with it. Thanks again!
 
ithaca
#579 Posted : 10/24/2020 8:58:16 AM

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Goombas69 wrote:
Thanks for the responses. I have ordered a VV 2. I only found one out there but that's all I need. It just looks like it could be temperamental and I don't want to be trying to make some custom mod-glass setup. I would have gotten a VV 1 clone if I could correctly identify and buy one. Hopefully I won't have issues with it. Thanks again!


should be fine, just has tighter clearances. Try pulling the cover/body up one o-ring in height to give yourself more ceiling room for your mesh. it will still stay sealed enough to prevent any smoke/vapor leaking.

 
ithaca
#580 Posted : 10/24/2020 8:59:20 AM

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pierrotlefou wrote:
don't understand... what is the advantage of the "Vapefly Mesh Plus RDA" compare to the "classic" one ?


seems like it has more room, I think that's it.
 
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