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Ayahuasca brewing newbie Options
 
spyfish
#21 Posted : 5/6/2019 9:27:03 PM

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On a little sidetrack, just stumbled upon a case study claiming a man was hospitalised after ingesting 4.5g rue, and 10 GRAM DMT. He came out of it fine, and discharged uneventfully after 8 hours. Damn.
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downwardsfromzero
#22 Posted : 5/6/2019 11:05:36 PM

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spyfish wrote:
On a little sidetrack, just stumbled upon a case study claiming a man was hospitalised after ingesting 4.5g rue, and 10 GRAM DMT. He came out of it fine, and discharged uneventfully after 8 hours. Damn.
Link

I've read the report and it seems far more likely that the guy took ten grams of mimosa bark - which would still be a thoroughly spanking dose of up to 200 mg of DMT. 10 grams of DMT certainly would have killed him. His self-reporting was likely misunderstood by the medical staff.
Quote:
124. Potentially Lethal Ingestion of DMT and Syrian Rue
Stellpflug SJ, Cole JB, Bangh SA, Roberts DJ. Hennepin Regional Poison Center, Minneapolis, MN, USA
Introduction: Tryptamines and harmala alkaloids have been used individually and in combination for years for their abuse potential, as herbal remedies, and in religious ceremonies. Their abuse can be dangerous, and should be recognized by medical toxicologists. We present an ingestion of N,N-dimethyltryptamine (DMT) and Peganum harmala (Syrian rue), with the DMT dose over 10 times the LD50.
Case report:
A 24-year-old male presented with altered mental status and dizziness. His initial presentation was 4 h after ingesting 10 g of DMT and 4.5 g of Syrian rue. Physical exam included heart rate (HR) 120, blood pressure (BP) 145/84, normal skin, and reactive dilated pupils bilaterally. One hour after arrival his signs and symptoms worsened, with a HR in the 130s and significant confusion and hallucinations. The patient was admitted to a telemetry unit for monitoring and supportive care including IV fluids and benzodiazepines. Over the subsequent 8 h the patient’s hallucinations cleared, his mental status improved to near baseline, his HR declined to normal,and his BP stayed at roughly 140 systolic. He was discharged uneventfully at that time.
Discussion:
This patient ingested a potentially fatal amount of DMT, which is a hallucinogenic tryptamine. Tryptamines can be found in many plants and animals. DMT in particular can be found in a number of different plants and is produced endogenously as well. Syrian rue belongs to a class of plants that produces harmala alkaloids. Harmala alkaloids produce monoamine oxidase (MAO) inhibition. DMT is orally active when used in conjunction with an MAOI. This combination also causes the effects of the DMT to last much longer than if smoked or injected on its own. The patient above took the DMT and Syrian rue to experience a long-lasting hallucinogenic high. He achieved this goal, and the course of the altered mental status lasted a total of 12 h, which is many times longer than the typical high would have lasted with DMT alone. The dose of the DMT this patient reported using is well above the estimated 8 mg/kg LD50.
Conclusion:
The presentation of this patient, with tachycardia and altered mental status, is consistent with the ingestion of DMT and Syrian rue that he reported. This combined ingestion should be recognized by the medical toxicologist.

This is consistent with ingesting 10 g of MHRB and a clearly sufficient dose of rue seed.




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ShamensStamen
#23 Posted : 5/7/2019 1:37:33 AM
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^ i concur.
 
spyfish
#24 Posted : 5/7/2019 6:51:12 AM

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Yeah I was sort of thinking the same, but then again they talk about way over LD50. But yeah seems unlikely someone ingested 10g pure DMT
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kaban uuc
#25 Posted : 5/7/2019 8:16:21 PM

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Thanks a lot for the feedback (thanks spyfish!!)

Please, can I store the final brews (reduced) lets say in the fridge?. The idea is to perform the brews a couple of days or the day before the drinking day. So how should I properly storage it during this time?.
 
spyfish
#26 Posted : 5/7/2019 8:22:22 PM

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Fridge is perfectly fine, will keep for months. For longer, freeze it.

After very long storage, as long you don't see any fungus just give it a boil to kill any potential bacteria and evap alcohol.
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Babaganush
#27 Posted : 5/9/2019 2:16:09 PM
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Thank you so much for the info guys, I really appreciate it!

I plan on brewing this weekend, How long should I let the brew sit to cool before I can drink it?
 
spyfish
#28 Posted : 5/9/2019 2:27:10 PM

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Babaganush wrote:
Thank you so much for the info guys, I really appreciate it!

I plan on brewing this weekend, How long should I let the brew sit to cool before I can drink it?


Until it doesn't burn your mouth or throat when you drink it in one gulp Thumbs up

and shake it right before

Good luck, and be careful. Try to sit up at least until peak is passed before laying down.

Love and light
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Babaganush
#29 Posted : 5/9/2019 4:47:44 PM
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I'm sorry but I've been thinking about this and got a little confused.

You said to start out with 100 gram caapi and 5-7 gram chali, Is that the total amount that I should brew at once? If so how many doses would that give me? Or do I brew more and only take that amount for each dose?

Sorry about that I just got confused and worried that I might not have enough.


I was also wondering how important the location and setting is for brewing, As I know it is for the journey itself.

I was just wondering because I have a few options for brewing location.

My family has a cabin in the woods and I think that would be the perfect place to brew and journey but I'm not sure I will be able to make it up there this weekend.

Other than that I have my house which is ok or my uncle's house to brew at, But I just have a few uncomfortable vibes involving that place and I was worried that they might interfere with the whole experience

Just wanted some input on the matter.

Thanks in advance!
 
spyfish
#30 Posted : 5/9/2019 5:29:32 PM

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Babaganush wrote:

You said to start out with 100 gram caapi and 5-7 gram chali, Is that the total amount that I should brew at once? If so how many doses would that give me? Or do I brew more and only take that amount for each dose?


That would be one dose

Babaganush wrote:

I was also wondering how important the location and setting is for brewing, As I know it is for the journey itself.


So many different opinions on this, Its what you prefer. I cook in my Kitchen, and don't make much out of it. For me its the ceremony that matters. Others make a whole process about the brewing. I'd say; whatever feels right for you.

Babaganush wrote:

My family has a cabin in the woods and I think that would be the perfect place to brew and journey but I'm not sure I will be able to make it up there this weekend.

Other than that I have my house which is ok or my uncle's house to brew at, But I just have a few uncomfortable vibes involving that place and I was worried that they might interfere with the whole experience


Trust your gut feeling, if you have bad vibes about a location don't brew there. May influence your journey if its on your mind.
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Dan_J
#31 Posted : 5/9/2019 5:53:42 PM

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spyfish wrote:

Some important points:
- Do not filter reduced brew, this will be over-saturated water, so you will filter out alkaloids. Filter the reduced brew before reducing. I use a old t-shirt.


Hi, another newbie to brewing here.
Sorry to hijack the thread
I've been doing a 3hr acacia boil, reduce, THEN filter with limited results. Would you say I'm
Losing 50% dmt or 5-15% dmt by filtering after the reduce?
My thread should be just below this one,

Thanks alot

-dan
 
spyfish
#32 Posted : 5/9/2019 6:01:55 PM

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Interesting, i think I just replied to your thread just now Smile

Yes, by filtering the reduced brew your filtering out ALLOT.

I learned this the hard way as well.
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Babaganush
#33 Posted : 5/9/2019 6:44:01 PM
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spyfish wrote:
[quote=Babaganush]
You said to start out with 100 gram caapi and 5-7 gram chali, Is that the total amount that I should brew at once? If so how many doses would that give me? Or do I brew more and only take that amount for each dose?


That would be one dose



Thanks, So how many doses do you think I should brew to start with? And how much material should I put into each pot?
 
spyfish
#34 Posted : 5/9/2019 7:03:35 PM

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Babaganush wrote:
Thanks, So how many doses do you think I should brew to start with? And how much material should I put into each pot?


Depend how much you want to cook Smile If you cook 50 or 100g Chaliponga, it makes dosage calculations easy. I would use at least 5l water for that.

Its all what you prefer.
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Babaganush
#35 Posted : 5/11/2019 3:54:05 PM
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Thanks for all your help Spyfish, I really appreciate it!

I still have a few more questions and I would like to talk directly to you,

Would you be ok with talking over the phone? If so please send me a pm, It won't let me since I'm a new member.

Thanks again!
 
TGO
#36 Posted : 5/11/2019 7:08:26 PM

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Babaganush wrote:
Thanks for all your help Spyfish, I really appreciate it!

I still have a few more questions and I would like to talk directly to you,

Would you be ok with talking over the phone? If so please send me a pm, It won't let me since I'm a new member.

Thanks again!



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Babaganush
#37 Posted : 5/11/2019 8:37:33 PM
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Oops sorry, I read that in the rules only after I posted that, My mistake.
 
spyfish
#38 Posted : 5/12/2019 9:21:57 AM

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Quote:
Would you be ok with talking over the phone?


Absolutely not. Sorry.
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Babaganush
#39 Posted : 5/12/2019 5:56:47 PM
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I understand, Sorry to be a pain.

So here are a few more questions I thought of

Should I shred the leaves or leave them whole? The caapi is already shredded but should I make it smaller?

Do I start reducing after the first wash or do I wait until all washes are done before reducing?

Also how low should I reduce it to?


I was thinking of brewing 500 gram caapi and 80-100 gram chali at once so I would have enough for several doses, But I'm not exactly sure how I would calculate each dose from the finished product.

Also if I need 20 liters of water for 500 gram caapi I don't use it all at once do I? Just use liters for each wash?

Do I need to add water as It boils if I lose some?

And I do need to boil for the entire time not simmer at all, Correct?


Or maybe I should do a smaller batch for a test?


I will be boiling the caapi and chali seperatley, should I boil each for the same amount of time or not?

Oh and good point about needing to eat some fat after drinking, That must be why I had so little effect from the ceremony. Would it make a difference if I took it a few minutes after drinking or do I have to wait 50 minutes?

Sorry for being such a pain, But the more I think about this the more confusing it gets, That's my OCD going into hyperdrive.

Thank you so much for all of your support and patience.
 
spyfish
#40 Posted : 5/13/2019 1:30:15 PM

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Quote:
Should I shred the leaves or leave them whole? The caapi is already shredded but should I make it smaller?

You can, but I never did. You can however freeze the caapi between each wash. Helps with the extraction. Shredding more will help.

Quote:
Do I start reducing after the first wash or do I wait until all washes are done before reducing?

What I do is collect all the washes in a large container and start reducing when all washes are done.

Quote:
Also how low should I reduce it to?

I reduce it down to an amount so I can get a dose down in 1 gulp. Like a shot glass. Gonna taste horrid, and be careful at the end of it gets thick it can burn.

Quote:
I was thinking of brewing 500 gram caapi and 80-100 gram chali at once so I would have enough for several doses, But I'm not exactly sure how I would calculate each dose from the finished product.

Basic math, for 500g caapi, split what you have reduced into 5 doses. If you have 100g chali, you could calculate 5ml per gram, so you reduce it to 500 ml.

Quote:
Also if I need 20 liters of water for 500 gram caapi I don't use it all at once do I? Just use liters for each wash?
Do I need to add water as It boils if I lose some?

If you have a massive pot you can always cook it in one long wash. But for most it's more practical to do several washes. What's important is you have 20+ liters unreduced brew in total. So whatever fits in your largest NON ALUMINIUM pot. And yes, top up as it boils down.

Quote:
And I do need to boil for the entire time not simmer at all, Correct?

Correct, but not needed when reducing. Though simmering will make reducing take ages. I boil.

Quote:

I will be boiling the caapi and chali seperatley, should I boil each for the same amount of time or not?

Depends, chali extract easier than caapi. But I did 3 washes for that as well. But less water is needed.

Quote:
Oh and good point about needing to eat some fat after drinking, That must be why I had so little effect from the ceremony. Would it make a difference if I took it a few minutes after drinking or do I have to wait 50 minutes?


I guess most people don't have this problem. But I just east something right before or after drinking. If I remember.

I can relate to the OCD Big grin

I'm just sitting waiting for my car to get new brake pads. Excuse any spelling mistake, on my phone.
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