DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 1538 Joined: 24-Nov-2009 Last visit: 03-Dec-2021
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Can sodium carbonate be used in place of sodium hydroxide? If so, how much should be used in place of the 250g sodium hydroxide? Or, does sodium carbonate only work well for STB? If so, is there any way to work the FASI into an STB tech? When I come here, I am that kid who always stays after class to ask questions.  The purpose of my questions is to ascertain the most simple and non-toxic way of going about this alchemy... at least until a greater understanding of all the processes is reached. Much gratitude!! Some things will come easy, some will be a test
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illudium Q-36
Posts: 861 Joined: 09-Jul-2009 Last visit: 03-Mar-2022 Location: uranus
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for STB you really need to use sodium hydroxide. The lye breaks down the plant as well as freebases the goodies. sodium carbonate doesn't have the "gusto" to pull off STB. I believe it is used in A/B. All posts written by Madcap should be regarded as fiction.
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 8 Joined: 15-Dec-2009 Last visit: 23-Dec-2009 Location: USA
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No. It seems like you arn't that experienced with the chemistry that goes along with extracting DMT salts. So your best bet is just to follow the directions until you get a better grip on this. Honestly stop being lazy my mad lye isn't that hard to get. Don't worry about your end product being contaimed with it either...just keep your eyes open and steady hand...good luck with your adventures. ~As long as a person does what she/he desires without harming another, we shall live and let live~
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DMT-Nexus member
 
Posts: 12340 Joined: 12-Nov-2008 Last visit: 02-Apr-2023 Location: pacific
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Just do a A/B and use the sodium carb...or do FASA and base it...no need to get lye and do a STB really..unless you are in a rush. Long live the unwoke.
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 2291 Joined: 26-Mar-2008 Last visit: 12-Jan-2020 Location: The Thunderbolt Pagoda
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Sodium carbonate is generally found not to be strong enough to break down plant material for extractions. SWIM's yet to see a satisfactory report on its use. SWIM only uses it for freebase conversion from fumarate. He's seen a few reports of lime working well in a paste, but probably only with pre-powdered; however, SWIM seems to have developed a method that works well with whole bark, though it's still in the experimental stages. SWIM has seen speculation that sodium carbonate would work with standard A/B, but still no reports. With nontoxic bases in pastes, SWIM hypothesizes that to achieve adequate results, the mixture of water, lime, and bark must be sufficiently homogeneous--generally of a dough-like consistency (a little more difficult to achieve with bark than with cactus). SWIM isn't holding out for sodium carbonate working in place of lime and would say that lime is the way to go. Just bear in mind that these nontoxic "limtek" extractions (material mixed into a dough with lime and water, then washed with limonene to extract) are a completely different breed of extraction, as the larger amounts of water used in BLAB would hinder the effectiveness of lime.
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 1538 Joined: 24-Nov-2009 Last visit: 03-Dec-2021
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Yeah, SWIM is in WAY over his head... but determined!  It seems he had the lye/sodium carbonate thing backwards... SWIM has been reading everything here, multiple times, doing SWIM's best to understand relative to his experience. BLAB looked appealing, yes, because it was totally understandable, but also because it used d-limo. SWIM is still trying to process and understand working with d-limo, so SWIM reads everything indiscriminately. So, would anyone be able to help SWIM out with some suggestions? For many--well calculated, lifestyle, spiritual, experiential--reasons, that have been long considered and in best judgment--not out of laziness (please don't make judgements  )--the only way SWIM can possibly do this is with food grade materials. SWIM is still trying to sort out all the roads that lead to Rome. There are so many. Which roads, given the predilection for food grade materials and lack of experience, should be taken? SWIM was considering: A/B, to start. If SWIM uses MHRB, would the heat in the A/B create inferior jungle spice? Then use d-limo as a solvent... Next, SWIM plans an FASW to get the DMT Fumarate. SWIM is more or less okay up until this point. Converting to a freebase is still confusing. Some of the instructions are vague. Calcium hydroxide or sodium carbonate? Acetone? Any extra thoughts for SWIM? or... SWSAC? (someone who sucks at chemistry  ). The power of Ayahuasca is WELL known to SWIM. No preparation of the spirit molecule in any form is to be taken lightly--SWIM knows all about how energy, intentions, focus, and care of preparation affect the outcome. All of SWIM's experiences are what ultimately pushed SWIM to explore extractions, because pure DMT is an entirely different experience, and in his heart, he needs to understand it (same reason SWIM will be darkrooming next winter, it is all aspects of the same journey). SWIM has read about DMT extractions many times in the past, and to do it himself was not even a thought. But after a long-term relationship with Ayahuasca... he knows it is work that must be done... and the advent of working with nontoxic, foodgrade materials opened the door in his mind. SWIM was really sick once, and getting all the toxic chemicals out of his house played a huge role in restoring health. He gets terrible headaches from bleach. SWIM's general rule is he will not put anything in or on his body that is not safe to eat. (Coconut oil makes a fantastic skin moisturizer. ) So, thank you all for your patience. This is heartfelt, sincere, and passionate inquiry. I understand how difficult it can be to explain things to people who struggle (SWIM's incompetence in some subjects is balanced by brilliance in others  ). With much love and gratitude! and DETERMINATION!! Some things will come easy, some will be a test
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 2291 Joined: 26-Mar-2008 Last visit: 12-Jan-2020 Location: The Thunderbolt Pagoda
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While Jorkest's teks aren't nontoxic, they should yield a perfectly foodgrade product and are simple in most respects (separating limonene from lye water is the toughest part). If SWIM starts with pre-powdered MHRB, 69ron's method just involves mixing the lime and the bark, getting it thoroughly wet and thoroughly stirred, then stirring it in limonene, decanting and salting from there. If using whole MHRB, SWIM's working on a tek: https://wiki.dmt-nexus.me/Amor_fati%27s_Nontoxic_Approach_to_the_Extraction_of_DMTFrom SWIY's stated preferences, I would guess that he doesn't want to work with lye, in which case the latter two suggestions would be preferable, as they are both foodgrade throughout. However, though conversion to freebase can be accomplished with nontoxic methods, as outlined here: https://wiki.dmt-nexus.me/DMT_Fumarate_to_DMT_Freebase, it's supposedly quite cumbersome. Most prefer using acetone to accomplish this. The tek SWIM's working on outlines three of the most prominent methods.
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 1052 Joined: 18-Jan-2008 Last visit: 29-Jun-2017 Location: Earth, of course??
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Here you go Manic Minxx: This is information put together from several SWIY's on this forum...69ron, Jorkest, Bufoman, SyZy, uhhhh, some others probably. The 'Food Grade DMT Tek', is a non-toxic tek that utilizes LIME, LIMONENE & FUMARIC ACID. SWIM uses this tek just as it is shown here. It works...as SWIM performs it with his specific tools. The interspersed white text is SWIM's notes to whomever is reading it. This is a document he put together for himself. He's been working on revising it so that it could be posted and understood by others...i.e., filling in informational gaps where SWIM didn't feel the need to write down what was happening. He's only gotten so far though....to the Bufoman Water Re-Xstal, he thinks. However, Manic Minxx can use '69ron's Food Grade DMT Tek' to begin her/his experiments. Jorkest's new development, the FASI precipitation, can be implemented into the tek @ step 4. So, at after Step 3 of this tek, Minxx can jump to Step 4 of the BLAB. OR, this tek can used as is, with the FASW options in steps 4 & 5. As for freebasing, there are several ways to go about it, but you will find below some different methods and notes about the conversion. Hope this helps. It took more than a few minutes to change ALL THE COLORS! Would like to do more, but busy, busy, busy. Any questions, just ask. 69ron's Food Grade DMT Tek:
It's basically a double A/B.
Here are all the steps to end up with freebase DMT using just d-limonene:
1 - Powderize your mimosa bark. Mix 100 grams of bark with 25 grams of calcium hydroxide. Add enough water to make it feel wet but not watery. Mix thoroughly.
(note) SWIM does this in a large 1000ml pyrex measuring cup.
(note) For mixing up this chunky stuff, SWIM uses an over-sized, stainless-steel turkey fork (the tips help to separate the stuff). Chop the stuff, flip it, flop it, push it, churn it, slice through it sideways.....whatever can be done to mix it without making a mess outside of the cup.
2 - Add 300 ml of d-limonene. Mix very thoroughly.. Let sit a few hours or overnight, mixing now and then (THOROUGHLY!!).
(note) For mixing the limonene thoroughly throughout the basified bark stuff, a stainless steel whisk is the best tool. Put the whisk down in there and spin it back and forth like you're trying to start a fire with a stick, only NOT TOO FAST. Take it slow at first and find a good speed/technique without splashing limonene outside the cup. Up, down, round and round. Tilt this way, tilt that way. As you mix, the bark will gather in the whisk....simply spin the whisk back and forth (carefully) while slowly lifting it out of the limonene. The bark re-enters the limonene. Try it and see. It's easy.
3 - Pour off the d-limonene through a filter into the container you'll use to mix in the acid(acetic or FASW).
(note) SWIM pours his through a stainless steel tea strainer (a sieve) into a glass beaker that has a nice pouring lip/spout. Then he pours the limonene into his separatory funnel.
(note) On the last limonene pull, SWIM uses a french press (glass with stainless steel parts) to squeeze out the remaining limonene that is residing in the bark mix, pouring it through the stainless steel tea strainer and into the beaker....the french press is invaluable for this....one could also use The Herbal Perculator or a stainless steel/glass funnel with cheesecloth/coffee filters....anyway to filter and squeeze out the remaining limonene....this is only necessary on the last limonene pull.
4 - Add 25 ml of vinegar to the d-limonene. Mix thoroughly, by swirling and/or shaking....aka, the separatory funnel cha cha....some good energetic music helps make this an enjoyable process.
4 option: instead of using vinegar, add 25 ml of FumaricAcidSaturatedWater (150mg fumaric acid per 25ml hot H2O) for every 75 ml of d-limonene; mix thoroughly, but don't get too carried away.
(note) The vinegar or FASW is added directly into the separatory funnel that contains the limonene.
5 - Separate the vinegar from the d-limonene (vinegar is bottom layer, d-limonene is top layer). This vinegar will contain DMT acetate. Evaporate your vinegar in a food dehydrator, or oven with door open, at 155 F to get sticky DMT acetate.
5 option: separate the FASW from the d-limonene (FASW is bottom layer, d-limonene is top layer); Evaporate your FASW in a food dehydrator, or oven with door open, at 155 F to get DMT fumarate + excess fumaric acid.
(note) Separation is a cinch with a separatory funnel. SWIM tried a gravy separator and was very annoyed, because the base of the spout was about 2cm from the bottom of the glass itself. It didn't work satisfactorily for SWIM....*shrugs shoulders* whatever works best for you.
6 - Repeat steps 4 & 5 at least 2-3 times,
7 - Repeat steps 2 - 6 at least 2 times.69ron's Method of removing Excess Fumaric Acid:
Bring the DMT saturated FASW to near freezing and most of the excess fumaric acid will sink to the bottom of the water and can be filtered off; lastly, evaporate to reveal nearly pure DMT fumarate with traces of fumaric acid as the only contaminant.
(note) SWIM has not tried this method. It probably works great.Bufoman's Method of Removing Excess Fumaric Acid:
To separate the desirables from the fumaric acid one simply adds 12mL H2O per gram of material. (the DMT fumarate is soluble in the water while the fumaric acid is not).
The aqueous (now yellow) solution is carefully decanted into a clean beaker or drying surface.
The water is reduced by 1/2 with a hair drier and then allow to sit open to the air and slowly evaporate.
Within a day (at most) large transparent crystals will begin to precipitate out one can collect these. (If one does not care about ascetics the solution can just be rapidly evaporate with a hair drier or on the oven and the crystals utilized right away. However SWIM recommends the crystallization.)
The remaining solution is then reduced again with a hair drier and allowed to sit as before. Once it has fully evaporated the crystals can be collected.
One now has highly pure DMT fumarate. The crystals are very nice to look at. One can attempt to wash the fumaric acid crystals again with an additional 10mL of H2O to see if any crystals are obtained however due to its solubility most of the DMT fumarate will collect during the first attempt.
(note) SWIM uses this method and finds it satisfactory.
Jorkest's Sodium Carbonate/Ethanol Method For Getting Freebase DMT:
well once you get to the dmt acetate (or dmt fumarate) you freebase again with some sodium carbonate and a bit of water
dry that..and then soak it in ethanol...pour of ethanol and evap for smokeable spice..
Time to freebase. Depending on how much DMT fumarate you have been able to get, add two parts sodium carbonate. So, if you got 1g DMT fumarate, you would add 2g sodium carbonate. Then add 2-4ml of water, just enough to get it nice and wet. Stir this for awhile, it will probably bubble a little bit. Make sure any chunks get absorbed, this may take 5-10 minutes. Throw this into the food dehydrator until dry. Once dry,
SyZyGyPSy's Sodium Carbonate/Isopropanol Method For Getting Freebase DMT:
How to get freebase:
SWIM would not recommend ron's method, though apparently it works.
What SWIM does is get dmt acetate (any other salt should be fine as well), then redissolve it in a little HOT distilled water.
Then, in an eyedropper bottle, he has the bottle roughly 1/3 of the way filled with this redissolved acetic salt solution... he adds another 1/3 warm saturated sodium carbonate solution. Then he fills the eyedropper bottle the rest of the way up with isopropanol (isopropyl alcohol). He agitates and the layers separate, iso on top. Using the eyedropper he removes the iso layer which contains the freebase alkaloids, then adds more iso and repeats two more times (3x total iso pulls) then combines iso pulls and evaps. There's still a little sodium carbonate residue cuz it's an incomplete separation, but there's much less that there would be if he just evapped the aqueous layer.
Then he uses anhydrous iso to redissolve the alkaloid goo, using a spoon to crush up the insoluble sodium carbonate residue and liberate any molecules trapped in it. He does this 3-4x, filtering to remove sodium carbonate residue, then evaps the iso onto a small amt. of leaf.
The reason for using IPA instead of ETOH is the solubility of sodium carbonate. SWIM has read that sodium carbonate is slightly soluble in ethanol, but not so in anhydrous iso. If you use 91% iso for redissolving the freebase goo, the 9% water will still dissolve some sodium carbonate. However you can use 91% for the "pulling" phase, but ideally you want dry iso for the "cleaning" phase.
To clarify, it goes like this:
1. Acetic salt goo is redissolved in small amount of water and freebased with sodium carbonate. Iso of any grade is then added, it doesn't matter what %age since it's mixing with water anyway. Ethanol -could- be used for this, but elsewhere on this forum someone posted an experiment that showed that ethanol does not separate nearly as efficiently as iso. Even the iso separation is not perfect, the top layer still contains a little water and hence a little sodium carbonate. But it's a much better separation than ethanol would be.
2. Iso is pulled off and evaporated. This leaves behind freebase goo, and a little sodium carbonate from the little bit of water that was in the top iso layer. If one used ethanol, there would be much more sodium carbonate here.
3. Anhydrous iso is then used to redissolve the goo without dissolving the sodium carbonate. If one used 91% iso for this, the 9% water would dissolve sodium carbonate. Also if one used ethanol for this, some sodium carbonate would be dissolved, even if one managed to get pure ethanol (which everclear is NOT). Also pure ethanol is much more expensive than iso, and is usually denatured (= NOT food grade!). Dry iso can easily be created from 91% using NaCl and baked epsom salt. It can also be purchased online for relatively cheap (compared to pure ethanol), from soap making supply places and such.
69ron's Method For Getting Freebase DMT:
8 - Take your sticky DMT acetate, and add about 2 parts calcium hydroxide and a tiny bit of water, just enough to make it wet. Thoroughly mix it. Let it sit for about 5 minutes or so. Evaporate your freebased DMT in a food dehydrator at no hotter than 110 F to get freebase DMT, calcium hydroxide, and calcium acetate.
9 - Dissolve your DMT (it’s about 1 gram at this point) and other calcium junk in about 25 ml of warm d-limonene (no hotter than 110 F). Filter and evaporate your d-limonene in a food dehydrator at no hotter than 110 F to get freebase DMT,
10 - Repeat step 9 until no more DMT is extracted from the calcium mix.Jorkest's Sodium Carbonate/Ethanol Method For Getting Freebase DMT:
well once you got to the dmt acetate you freebase again with some sodium carbonate and a bit of water
dry that..and then soak it in ethanol...pour of ethanol and evap for smokeable spice..
Time to freebase. Depending on how much DMT fumarate you have been able to get, add two parts sodium carbonate. So, if you got 1g DMT fumarate, you would add 2g sodium carbonate. Then add 2-4ml of water, just enough to get it nice and wet. Stir this for awhile, it will probably bubble a little bit. Make sure any chunks get absorbed, this may take 5-10 minutes. Throw this into the food dehydrator until dry.
Changa Preparation:
Weigh the amount of leaf you wish to enhance with DMT at the desired ratio.
Using leaf that is chopped to the consistency which it will be smoked at makes
life easier later on. Pictured is a mixture containing 4 grams of Calea leaf and 3.5 grams
of Brugmansia Sanguinea flower. Weigh the amount of freebase DMT needed to enhance your leaf
to the desired ratio. Thoroughly dissolve the freebase DMT (use about 40mL of solvent per gram
of DMT) in one of the following: 100% Ethyl Alcohol, Acetone or Isopropyl Alcohol.
You want to use a dish with a width that will allow your leaf to sit between 5-10mm high.
Add the leaf to the DMT saturated solvent and swirl it around so all the leaf is spread evenly on
the bottom of your dish. If you need to, add a little more solvent so that the leaf is well
covered. Place the dish somewhere where it will stay undisturbed for several days. It took
about four days for the Acetone to completely evaporate and the leaf to dry in this example
Once dry, the leaf can be weighed. It should be heavier by the amount of freebase DMT that
it is enhanced with.
69ron – Converting DMT Acetate to DMT Fumerate:
The only salt form of DMT that is not sticky as far as I know is DMT fumarate.
You can easily later convert DMT acetate to DMT fumarate by just dissolving DMT acetate in as little water needed to dissolve it and then add one part more water. Then mix in fumaric acid. Keep adding more fumaric acid while mixing until no more dissolves. Then bring the water to near freezing and most of the excess fumaric acid will sink to the bottom of the water and can be filtered off. Then evaporate the water to get nearly pure DMT fumarate with traces of fumaric acid in it as the only contaminant. There is no need for any toxic solvents. Extras Bits:
the dlimo extraction, the dmt is salted out of the limonene because limonene dissolves dmt way too good even at low temps, so it cant be freeze precipitated, and it doesnt evap clean, it leaves too much residue.. So the solution people found is to salt it out with fumaric acid solution or just vinegar, and then evap that instead (which will be mostly alkaloids, not much gunk anymore), to leave either solid dmt fumarate or gooey dmt acetate... then, if one wants freebase, make paste with sodium carbonate and mix, let dry, and then pull this stuff with IPA or acetone, and this will pick up the freebase alkaloids and leave the rest behind, filtering the IPA/acetone and evapping it (for example any sodium carbonate contamination will stay behind)."Within your heart is a lotus, and within this lotus is a diamond. This diamond is the source of creation, and in all the creation, there is only one lotus."
"Only from the Heart can you touch the sky." ~ Rumi
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 2291 Joined: 26-Mar-2008 Last visit: 12-Jan-2020 Location: The Thunderbolt Pagoda
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Dimitrius wrote:[color=yellow]69ron's Method of removing Excess Fumaric Acid:
Bring the DMT saturated FASW to near freezing and most of the excess fumaric acid will sink to the bottom of the water and can be filtered off; lastly, evaporate to reveal nearly pure DMT fumarate with traces of fumaric acid as the only contaminant.
SWIM hadn't seen this one before. If it works well, it should speed up SWIM's experimentation immensely, as trace amounts won't throw off the weight at all. SWIM may amend this to his tek and throw in another thanks to ron.
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 2291 Joined: 26-Mar-2008 Last visit: 12-Jan-2020 Location: The Thunderbolt Pagoda
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Dimitrius wrote:69ron's Method of removing Excess Fumaric Acid:
Bring the DMT saturated FASW to near freezing and most of the excess fumaric acid will sink to the bottom of the water and can be filtered off; lastly, evaporate to reveal nearly pure DMT fumarate with traces of fumaric acid as the only contaminant.
SWIM hadn't seen this one before. If it works well, it should speed up SWIM's experimentation immensely, as trace amounts won't throw off the weight at all. SWIM may amend this to his tek and throw in another thanks to ron.
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 1538 Joined: 24-Nov-2009 Last visit: 03-Dec-2021
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WOW!!!!! Thank you SO MUCH, everyone, for your time!! Dimitrius, the added notes to the compiled techs in a slightly more explained order was EXACTLY what my brain needed. That was, in total seriousness, my Christmas present!!! I may have more questions to ask, in the near future. Thank you, thank you, thank you!!!! Some things will come easy, some will be a test
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 1052 Joined: 18-Jan-2008 Last visit: 29-Jun-2017 Location: Earth, of course??
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ms_manic_minxx wrote:WOW!!!!! Thank you SO MUCH, everyone, for your time!! Dimitrius, the added notes to the compiled techs in a slightly more explained order was EXACTLY what my brain needed. That was, in total seriousness, my Christmas present!!! I may have more questions to ask, in the near future. Thank you, thank you, thank you!!!! You're welcome. Merry Christmas. "...EXACTLY what my brain needed." ....I know. That's why I gave it to you. "Within your heart is a lotus, and within this lotus is a diamond. This diamond is the source of creation, and in all the creation, there is only one lotus."
"Only from the Heart can you touch the sky." ~ Rumi
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 1538 Joined: 24-Nov-2009 Last visit: 03-Dec-2021
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"Dry iso can easily be created from 91% using NaCl and baked epsom salt." Can someone please explain this in a little more detail, with ratios or measurements as a guide, and some procedures? Thank you! Some things will come easy, some will be a test
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 14191 Joined: 19-Feb-2008 Last visit: 16-Apr-2024 Location: Jungle
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AFAIK just add either of them, NaCl or dry epsom salt or also sodium carbonate, in excess quantities, no need to worry, to IPA, and shake.. None of them mix with IPA, but they do with water, so it forms a bottom layer of water in the iso and you just decant it (or if its already dry the salt/sodium carbonate/epsom will just fall to the bottom and look dry.. just decant/filter and you have your dry iso
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 1538 Joined: 24-Nov-2009 Last visit: 03-Dec-2021
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Wow, so I have spent so much time cruising these forums for informational purposes only, I started having dreams of trying these extractions! I have dreamed recently of using 69ron's MHRB+lime+d-limo tech. I dreamed of using bark that was *finely* shredded. There was mostly powder among a few very fine and fluffy shreds, so I opted for using the bark as is. For future reference, would anyone recommend further trying to powder the bark in a coffee grinder? The mixing of lime went very quickly, and I did not receive any intuitional feedback about whether or not this was "right." D-limo was added: at this point, I "connected" with the bark while stirring, and the procedure felt incredibly right. Just like cooking Aya... The bark was stirred, stirred, stirred, and sat overnight. This morning, bark was filtered through a sieve. Only 150mL (half) of the d-limo was able to be squeezed out. 5 pulls with FASW were done. At first, the fumaric acid would not dissolve in the water, so I ended up shaking it vigorously in a jar until dissolved. The FASW was added to the limo... inspirational music was blasted, and insane joyful dancing in celebration of the opportunity to visit hyperspace commenced... (This made me also contemplate ways to get more FUN and CELEBRATION of spirit into an Aya brew, though one can't easily dance with 4L pots of boiling water. ) I actually broke a sweat, the dancing was a complete and uninhibited release. I am certain elves were watching. For the next pull of bark, I added an additional 150mL of d-limo, since that was what was stuck in the bark. I will press it all out in the end... There was also a bit of powder that fell through the sieve and is in the evaporating FASW (set dehydrator to 111F for mystical purposes ). All in all, how does that sound? It amazes me how the dream world mirrors real life, at times. Was my dream accurate relative to the information here? Thanks everyone. Things also feel so much better, easier, and a little more natural once you actually dream of doing them. Getting caught up in the mental-reading-linear think state is the toughest barrier to break. Edit: Update: I took a nap this afternoon and dreamed that I went to check the contents of my dehydrator. Inside, I found a pyrex dish... JUST COVERED... in pinkish fumarate crystals!!  They were still slightly too gooey to weigh, but the sight of BLATANT SUCCESS... deserves cartwheels. Everyone, THANK YOU and I LOVE YOU SO MUCH!!!! (I will continue to share strange dreams here. ) Some things will come easy, some will be a test
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 1538 Joined: 24-Nov-2009 Last visit: 03-Dec-2021
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Can anyone just elaborate on either of these techniques a little more, please? For example, when it says, "filter," filter through what? How can one know when IPA is formally anhydrous--when no more baked epsom salts clump at the bottom of a jar and the IPA becomes cloudy? Mmmm... things to watch out for? Further descriptions of what to expect? Thanks again. Quote:SyZyGyPSy's Sodium Carbonate/Isopropanol Method For Getting Freebase DMT:
How to get freebase:
SWIM would not recommend ron's method, though apparently it works.
What SWIM does is get dmt acetate (any other salt should be fine as well), then redissolve it in a little HOT distilled water.
Then, in an eyedropper bottle, he has the bottle roughly 1/3 of the way filled with this redissolved acetic salt solution... he adds another 1/3 warm saturated sodium carbonate solution. Then he fills the eyedropper bottle the rest of the way up with isopropanol (isopropyl alcohol). He agitates and the layers separate, iso on top. Using the eyedropper he removes the iso layer which contains the freebase alkaloids, then adds more iso and repeats two more times (3x total iso pulls) then combines iso pulls and evaps. There's still a little sodium carbonate residue cuz it's an incomplete separation, but there's much less that there would be if he just evapped the aqueous layer.
Then he uses anhydrous iso to redissolve the alkaloid goo, using a spoon to crush up the insoluble sodium carbonate residue and liberate any molecules trapped in it. He does this 3-4x, filtering to remove sodium carbonate residue, then evaps the iso onto a small amt. of leaf.
The reason for using IPA instead of ETOH is the solubility of sodium carbonate. SWIM has read that sodium carbonate is slightly soluble in ethanol, but not so in anhydrous iso. If you use 91% iso for redissolving the freebase goo, the 9% water will still dissolve some sodium carbonate. However you can use 91% for the "pulling" phase, but ideally you want dry iso for the "cleaning" phase.
To clarify, it goes like this:
1. Acetic salt goo is redissolved in small amount of water and freebased with sodium carbonate. Iso of any grade is then added, it doesn't matter what %age since it's mixing with water anyway. Ethanol -could- be used for this, but elsewhere on this forum someone posted an experiment that showed that ethanol does not separate nearly as efficiently as iso. Even the iso separation is not perfect, the top layer still contains a little water and hence a little sodium carbonate. But it's a much better separation than ethanol would be.
2. Iso is pulled off and evaporated. This leaves behind freebase goo, and a little sodium carbonate from the little bit of water that was in the top iso layer. If one used ethanol, there would be much more sodium carbonate here.
3. Anhydrous iso is then used to redissolve the goo without dissolving the sodium carbonate. If one used 91% iso for this, the 9% water would dissolve sodium carbonate. Also if one used ethanol for this, some sodium carbonate would be dissolved, even if one managed to get pure ethanol (which everclear is NOT). Also pure ethanol is much more expensive than iso, and is usually denatured (= NOT food grade!). Dry iso can easily be created from 91% using NaCl and baked epsom salt. It can also be purchased online for relatively cheap (compared to pure ethanol), from soap making supply places and such.
69ron's Method For Getting Freebase DMT:
8 - Take your sticky DMT acetate, and add about 2 parts calcium hydroxide and a tiny bit of water, just enough to make it wet. Thoroughly mix it. Let it sit for about 5 minutes or so. Evaporate your freebased DMT in a food dehydrator at no hotter than 110 F to get freebase DMT, calcium hydroxide, and calcium acetate.
9 - Dissolve your DMT (it’s about 1 gram at this point) and other calcium junk in about 25 ml of warm d-limonene (no hotter than 110 F). Filter and evaporate your d-limonene in a food dehydrator at no hotter than 110 F to get freebase DMT,
10 - Repeat step 9 until no more DMT is extracted from the calcium mix. Some things will come easy, some will be a test
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 148 Joined: 06-Dec-2009 Last visit: 25-Feb-2012
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Dimitrius, thank you so much for your post. SWIM wishes he had come across it before he spent the last week trying to collect and compile an overwhelming amount of information. SWIM still has some questions... 1. Can FASW be stored in an airtight container? Quote:Add 300 ml of d-limonene. Mix very thoroughly.. Let sit a few hours or overnight 2. Does the container with this ^ concoction have to be covered if it sits overnight? 3. Would a large plastic bag tilted 45 degrees be ok to use as a separator? 4. When the FA and d-limonene are combined in the separator, how long do they need to sit before they can be separated? 5. After the first separation and subsequent evaporation, where one gets DMT fumerate, by Quote:Repeat steps 4 & 5 at least 2-3 times, Does SWIY mean mix new FASW with the old limonene from the first separation, reseperate and re-evaporate? 6. And by Quote:Repeat steps 2 - 6 at least 2 times. Does SWIY mean take the mimosa mush that was caught by the stainless steel tea strainer during the first straining, mix it with a new 300 mL limonene, continue? 7. Quote:Throw this into the food dehydrator until dry. Once dry, SWIM thinks you forgot to type something here Dimitrius. Is there anything that needs to be done once it is dry? I am here
(1) For increased personal power, intellectual understanding, sharpened insight into self and culture, improvement of life situation, accelerated learning, professional growth.
(2) For duty, help of others, providing care, rehabilitation, rebirth for fellow men.
(3) For fun, sensuous enjoyment, aesthetic pleasure, interpersonal closeness, pure experience.
(4) For transcendence, liberation from ego and space-time limits; attainment of mystical union.
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 148 Joined: 06-Dec-2009 Last visit: 25-Feb-2012
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Quote:Mmmm... things to watch out for? SWIM heard that if you do any dehydrating with an oven, any residue oils on your pan or inside the oven can affect the final product (make it look impure). I am here
(1) For increased personal power, intellectual understanding, sharpened insight into self and culture, improvement of life situation, accelerated learning, professional growth.
(2) For duty, help of others, providing care, rehabilitation, rebirth for fellow men.
(3) For fun, sensuous enjoyment, aesthetic pleasure, interpersonal closeness, pure experience.
(4) For transcendence, liberation from ego and space-time limits; attainment of mystical union.
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Derek
Posts: 1210 Joined: 12-Mar-2009 Last visit: 23-Jun-2011 Location: here there and everywhere
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er it would seem you guys are over complicating things.. i am not sure why or how better to explain it.. sorry "once youve locked yourself into a serious drug collection the tendency is to push it as far as you can..." - hunter s. thompson
~~~~~~~~...You are me and i am you, i will always be with you...~~~~~~~~IAmUsWeYouMe~~~~~~~~
‹maxzar100› YOU are like acid
‹mattimus› dosesdosingdoses
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DMT-Nexus member
Posts: 32 Joined: 20-Nov-2009 Last visit: 21-Jul-2010 Location: Here and Now
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ms_manic_minxx wrote:"Dry iso can easily be created from 91% using NaCl and baked epsom salt."
Can someone please explain this in a little more detail, with ratios or measurements as a guide, and some procedures? Thank you! Purifying Rubbing Alcohol Into 99% IsopropanolEpsom salt is magnesium sulfate heptahydrate (MgSO4 * 7H20) but can be converted to anhydrous magnesium sulfate (MgSO4) simply by heating the dry crystals at 100 degrees Celsius (212F) for two hours. Once in anhydrous form, magnesium sulfate can be added in excess to the rubbing alcohol where it absorbs the water molecules to form various hydrate crystals. The mixture of isopropanol and hydrate crystals is then poured over a filter; the collected liquid below is roughly 99 percent pure isopronanol. peace Phaedris
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