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Hybrid-Hybrid Tek Options
 
Alev-Kev
#1 Posted : 4/16/2018 2:48:59 PM

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Hey Family!
I got a crazy idea to take elements of a couple Teks and throw them together to see what kind of % yield and how fast the bark gives up its contents.

Hybrid-Hybrid Tek
1. 400 g MHRB ground in a blender. Some powder, some shredded
2. Put it in a stainless pot. Covered with purified water until all bark is wet; water just above
level of bark.
3.Brought to a boil, then heat reduced and allowed to simmer until barely any water moves when you tilt pan. Took a little over 2 hours to stew down.
4. Set pot aside to come to room temp.
5. Put pot in 4 degrees F freezer until fully frozen (a la CYB's Max Ion)
6. Thawed on stove; prepared for Acidification
7. 400mL 5% acetic acid added to hot pot, increased heat to simmer.
8. 400mL purified water added within minutes to increase to Soupy consistency
9. Simmered the acid soup for a cpl hours until it reduced.
10. Almost forgot to salt!! ( I added another 400 mL purified water and 70g of sea salt) turned the heat up a little and stirred constantly for about 5-6 mins
11. Set heat to low, after simmer was achieved and went to bed. 7 hrs at low heat.
12. Woke to find a layer of SOMETHING congealing at the top of my stew. (fats?tannins?)
13. Increased heat to bring back to simmer. Almost 3.5 Qts in pot reduced to just over 2 Qts.
14. Decanted to base and pull vessels.
15. I have 1250mL of sludge in one, and 550mL of sludge in another.
16. They are currently sitting to come to room temp.; I will test pH and then calculate the amount
of NaOH (lye) to add, and test again to make sure I achieve at least 11 or 12. (will update
amounts used aft tek)

17. The plan is to warm bathe them and agitate every hour or so all day today and pull this evening
with Naptha.
18. Freeze Precipitate
19. Scrape up the Goodies
20. Decide if Re-x is warranted.


So, I will definitely be back to Update this one.... Just thought, if freezing can snap cell walls, why not get them SATURATED in hot solution, then Freeze? THEN acidify, salt, base, and pull my way to Kikkers Glory!!


**Any tips, critique points, or discussion is GREATLY APPRECIATED !!

Love & Light,
A-K
 

Trippy glass for trippy people.
 
Alev-Kev
#2 Posted : 4/17/2018 1:43:37 PM

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Here's some pics of the 1st pans.
Alev-Kev attached the following image(s):
20180417_071956.jpg (1,388kb) downloaded 419 time(s).
20180417_072906.jpg (1,316kb) downloaded 418 time(s).
 
Alev-Kev
#3 Posted : 4/17/2018 8:37:56 PM

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Update: I used 200g of NaOH to get solution basified
Agitated every half hr or so for 3hrs. A small emulsion started, so I assume there wasn't enough salt and/or lye. Not terrible tho.
Then I recanted into a metal strainer over a large glass bowl. Pressed all bark for liquid and discarded. (hindsight says maybe it STILL had some...)
I did 5x pulls with naptha. 1 & 2 w/ fresh, 3-5 reused from older extr..
Pan 1 is pic 1 with clean nap. Pan 2 is pic 2 with re-use nap. Pulls were 80, 60, 60, 60, 100 mL in that order.
Freeze precip'd to these totals.
First 2 pulls : 1.64g
Next 3 pulls: 2.31g
Plus the catch in the coffee filter n some oils: .77g

All dry n weighed 4.76g
Just got my pans cleaned and about to do some more pulls.
Here's some pics for you all.
Alev-Kev attached the following image(s):
20180417_094350.jpg (1,406kb) downloaded 407 time(s).
20180417_094907.jpg (962kb) downloaded 404 time(s).
20180417_101130.jpg (1,673kb) downloaded 403 time(s).
20180417_101922.jpg (955kb) downloaded 399 time(s).
20180417_100923.jpg (823kb) downloaded 398 time(s).
20180417_141651.jpg (1,032kb) downloaded 402 time(s).
 
Sunnyside
#4 Posted : 4/17/2018 8:47:59 PM

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That surely brings a smile, looking at the fluffy white goodness.

Very nicely done.

Thanks for sharing.
" Enjoy every sandwich." - Warren Zevon
 
downwardsfromzero
#5 Posted : 4/17/2018 8:55:08 PM

Eggnogstic - warning! Self-irony levels: high!

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Mouthwateringly nice pics Thumbs up Thumbs up
Alev-Kev wrote:
12. Woke to find a layer of SOMETHING congealing at the top of my stew. (fats?tannins?)

The solubility of mimosa tannins decreases incredibly sharply dropping down from 100°C - don't ever be tempted to try filtering a hot mimosa tea!
Ora, lege, lege, lege, relege et labora

“To be GOVERNED is to be watched, inspected, spied upon, directed, law-driven, numbered, regulated, enrolled, indoctrinated, preached at, controlled, checked, estimated, valued, censured, commanded, by creatures who have neither the right nor the wisdom nor the virtue to do so. To be GOVERNED is to be at every operation, at every transaction noted, registered, counted, taxed, stamped, measured, numbered, assessed, licensed, authorized, admonished, prevented, forbidden, reformed, corrected, punished. It is, under pretext of public utility, and in the name of the general interest, to be place under contribution, drilled, fleeced, exploited, monopolized, extorted from, squeezed, hoaxed, robbed; then, at the slightest resistance, the first word of complaint, to be repressed, fined, vilified, harassed, hunted down, abused, clubbed, disarmed, bound, choked, imprisoned, judged, condemned, shot, deported, sacrificed, sold, betrayed; and to crown all, mocked, ridiculed, derided, outraged, dishonored. That is government; that is its justice; that is its morality."
― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
 
Alev-Kev
#6 Posted : 4/18/2018 3:18:32 AM

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Oh, man, that could've been painful! Thanks much for the kind words. Second round of pulls are in the freeze, awaiting the morning 'harvest'. Laughing
 
Alev-Kev
#7 Posted : 4/18/2018 3:21:27 AM

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downwardsfromzero wrote:
Mouthwateringly nice pics Thumbs up Thumbs up
The solubility of mimosa tannins decreases incredibly sharply dropping down from 100°C - don't ever be tempted to try filtering a hot mimosa tea!


I almost had a similar problem in the decant... funnel clogged. lol
 
blue.magic
#8 Posted : 4/18/2018 5:20:54 PM

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Alev-Kev wrote:
downwardsfromzero wrote:
Mouthwateringly nice pics Thumbs up Thumbs up
The solubility of mimosa tannins decreases incredibly sharply dropping down from 100°C - don't ever be tempted to try filtering a hot mimosa tea!


I almost had a similar problem in the decant... funnel clogged. lol


I always leave the tea to sit few hours or overnight, then vacuum filter through cotton.

Then reduce, let it sit until cools down, perferably overnight. There is a fine layer of gunk and perfectly clear tea above, filtering was not even needed, just decanting.

To get most stuff out, I sometimes mix the residual gunk with a little water and squeeze it through twice-folded cheesecloth.

Filtering is almost impossible with powder though. I use partially powdered/shredded bark instead. The yields are good still Smile
 
Alev-Kev
#9 Posted : 4/18/2018 5:21:32 PM

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Followed up with a few more pulls... only the 1st pan had any xtals. I disposed of solution and am beginning another batch.
Alev-Kev attached the following image(s):
20180418_103253.jpg (1,099kb) downloaded 367 time(s).
 
Alev-Kev
#10 Posted : 4/22/2018 3:28:45 PM

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Eureka, Nexians!!!

UPDATE: So in my previous batch of 400g MHRB I discarded the bark after boiling, acidifying, and reducing.... I believe that was as MISTAKE!! I've just completed the SAME HYBRID-TEK on 300g MHRB, leaving the bark in for entirety and lo and behold : 2% yield was achieved in 6 pulls with naptha + freeze precip!!!

I want to thank CYB for the Teks, all Nexians for your research and experiments, a special thanks to Trav for giving US a Home to come to seeking Knowledge!! Very happy Very happy


I will use this HYBRID-TEK from here on, due to its ease and yields!!
 
Alev-Kev
#11 Posted : 6/3/2018 4:41:43 AM

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Love and Light to All!

I've hit the HOLY GRAIL!! My combination HYBRID-HYBRID TEK has produced beyond any Tek used to date! I GOT 2.86% YIELD in 7 pulls from 250 g blended mimosa bark. A total yield of 7.17g and still some scraps in a cpl pans... Without question, this is My Path to extraction!!

Credit: Boil, Base n Go, Cybs Max ION Tek, and Cyb's Salt Tek
 
motorbit
#12 Posted : 6/3/2018 5:25:29 AM

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nais!
why no defat tho? i just put the pulls from my 100g bark extract into the freezer.
during that cool i extracted a lot of fat in the defat step.

aside of this, i did it very simmilar to the op. i used less vinegar tho. i thought if i used so much i would need so much more lye to basify it.
and yes. the op used a lot of lye. still, if it increases the yield i think this is very very well wroth it. lye isn't extracted from the mimosa after all.
anyway no yield yet but it looks realy promizing.
i think the freezing and tawing helps so much. frezing, boiling, frezing, boiling might even add more, especially when slightly acidified.
FASCINATING
 
downwardsfromzero
#13 Posted : 6/4/2018 9:51:13 AM

Eggnogstic - warning! Self-irony levels: high!

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Astonishing yield, Alev-Kev!

This was with leaving the bark in, I gather?

motorbit wrote:
why no defat tho?

MHRB typically doesn't require a defat.
Ora, lege, lege, lege, relege et labora

“To be GOVERNED is to be watched, inspected, spied upon, directed, law-driven, numbered, regulated, enrolled, indoctrinated, preached at, controlled, checked, estimated, valued, censured, commanded, by creatures who have neither the right nor the wisdom nor the virtue to do so. To be GOVERNED is to be at every operation, at every transaction noted, registered, counted, taxed, stamped, measured, numbered, assessed, licensed, authorized, admonished, prevented, forbidden, reformed, corrected, punished. It is, under pretext of public utility, and in the name of the general interest, to be place under contribution, drilled, fleeced, exploited, monopolized, extorted from, squeezed, hoaxed, robbed; then, at the slightest resistance, the first word of complaint, to be repressed, fined, vilified, harassed, hunted down, abused, clubbed, disarmed, bound, choked, imprisoned, judged, condemned, shot, deported, sacrificed, sold, betrayed; and to crown all, mocked, ridiculed, derided, outraged, dishonored. That is government; that is its justice; that is its morality."
― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
 
Alev-Kev
#14 Posted : 6/6/2018 9:07:38 PM

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downwardsfromzero wrote:
Astonishing yield, Alev-Kev!

This was with leaving the bark in, I gather?

motorbit wrote:
why no defat tho?

MHRB typically doesn't require a defat.

Yes, leaving the bark in instead of straining.
Yes, again, MHRB doesn't need a defat, especially with the saltin
 
Alev-Kev
#15 Posted : 6/19/2018 2:48:23 PM

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BACK AGAIN, UPDATE!

This HYBRID-TEK is by far my highest yielding extraction path that I've used. I'm not versed on FASA or any other attempts except STB, Salt-Tek, A-B, Cyb's MAX ION. That being said, the combination of these elements together makes for a VERY EFFICIENT and High Yielding extraction path on MHRB. I would like anyone else to try these combined elements and let us know if you are as happy with it as I am. Until then, Love & Light, Family!
 
Alev-Kev
#16 Posted : 7/25/2018 2:51:24 PM

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Hello again, Family!

Not looking for any kind of "credit" here at all, as all my elements came from others' work. I just wanted to EMPHATICALLY suggest that this HYBRID-HYBRID TEK yields close to the "THEORETICAL" 3% in every batch that I've done. This has been between 2.62 and 2.8 % out of MHRB. Small batches (35-50g) and larger (400g largest) have shown the same with slight tweaks of the salt content and NaOH to find the "sweet spot". Those being 25-30g salt/ 50g bark; and approx. 3/4 the amount of bark in sodium hydroxide, i.e. 100g bark = 75g NaOH.

I'd be very interested in knowing if anyone else has yields over 2.5% or if anyone has combined these elements and to what success. Any and all, please comment!

Peace,
A-K
 
JefFlux
#17 Posted : 7/31/2018 5:40:03 AM

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Hi Alex-Kev,

First attempt at an STB (Cyb's hybrid salt tek) yielded exactly %3. Have been looking to see if it is possible to improve on this, as using 'max ion' bore no discernible increase.

As one more familiar with A-B on acacia, I have often wondered if the acidic heat bath stage of Cyb's teks could be improved by simmering the acidic bark-solution in a pot over an element on low heat (60 degrees Celsius) avoiding evaporation ..rather than the standard heat bath method?

Or even just 3 acidic boils and then discarding the bark as one would do for ACRB. This would reduce the volume/number of jars needed to process amounts of MHRB over 100-200g.

Also Ive found much less Lye is needed to achieve pH 12.5-13 than the 1:1 recommended for MHRB...but I guess the function of surplus Lye is to dissolve the bark ?

Love your approach and seems to work, thanks

FLux
 
tseuq
#18 Posted : 8/6/2018 7:22:56 AM

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Ahoi Alev-Kev,

while performing an A/B on HM, I was reading through your thread and asked myself how you did the pulls.

--> Warm naphtha into a warm solution or warm naphtha into cold solution or cold naphtha into warm solution or cold naphtha into cold solution?

Thanks and congrats to your results, tseuq

[edit: Meanwhile I did the first pull with warm nap in warm solution and the second pull with cold nap in warm solution. I guess I have to re-x the first pull and will stay with cold nap in warm solution.]
Everything's sooo peyote-ful..
 
Alev-Kev
#19 Posted : 8/8/2018 2:44:48 PM

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JefFlux wrote:
Hi Alex-Kev,

First attempt at an STB (Cyb's hybrid salt tek) yielded exactly %3. Have been looking to see if it is possible to improve on this, as using 'max ion' bore no discernible increase.

As one more familiar with A-B on acacia, I have often wondered if the acidic heat bath stage of Cyb's teks could be improved by simmering the acidic bark-solution in a pot over an element on low heat (60 degrees Celsius) avoiding evaporation ..rather than the standard heat bath method?

Or even just 3 acidic boils and then discarding the bark as one would do for ACRB.

FLux


Hey, Flux
Thx for taking the time... I do, almost boil the whole time, simmering for reduction with water,and then white vinegar. I did strain a cal times, but I noticed that by removing/straining bark that my yields went down. When I leave it in, yields increase. So, I guess moving to the basing of the solution, some alkaloids are still trapped in the bar. I, also, go under the 1:1 ratio for lye, but I don't have a pH meter. The trial n error method produced a seeming 'sweet spot' for enough to keep emulsions to next to nothing, while releasing & binding all the D effectively. I should probably get a tester just for accuracy sake, but all $ has been put into good glass for my experiments, at this point. Thanks again for stopping thru...
A-K

 
Simply_Me
#20 Posted : 8/9/2018 3:47:22 AM

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Alex-Kev, what a great picture! Drool

I have the same question as Tseuq, I am under the impression that Warm Naphtha room temp basified solution is the way to go.

Tseuq,
Why the edit and the change to cold Nap in warm Solution?


I have 250g MHRB and will being embarking on my 3rd extraction in a couple days. I think I will split it 125/125. (just in case something goes wrong, my first extraction had a glass break and I lost nearly everything.)
I realize that no one book, one person, or even one ideology will have all the answers. I believe my job is to remain open yet discriminating. My intuition helps me discern truth, and wisdom helps me identify malicious intentions.
 
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