How do you become a shaman? What makes them so qualified to earn such a name? Seeing how we also go on psychedelic journeys how are they any different than us?

How do you become a shaman?
Easy! You just take a series of high-priced weekend workshops.

What makes them so qualified to earn such a name?
Their fancy certificates of course.

How are they any different than us?
They have far moar disposable income.

LMAO!

Sometimes it just happens somehow when you work with the plants. Idk if I'd call myself a shaman though, maybe some other label would fit better, like student perhaps.

Unless living for sometme and being integrated into a culture that has shaman aspects inherently involved in it I you couldnt properly go by calling yourself shaman.

Of coursse ppl can call themselves whatever they want; hence workshops magicians donald trump etc

shamans traditionlly dont take the role as much as its given them



Terrenc Mckena wrote about this in begining of Invisible Landscapes, pretty interesting. Theres loads more literature and info out there if you look; shamanism manifests itself in multipal cultures and areas so it comes in many forms depending on culture

It's become a huge money thing in South America. Some of these shamans rape women, comment murder, and put poison in their brew. Maybe it's time to drop all the Hocus Pocus.

Same way you get to Carnegie Hall.

I heard that some of these so called shamans are actually evil brujos who will even make a spirit invade the persons being and attach themselves making them weak. Idk crazy shit.. crazy world, and were the crazy ones because were actually sane enough to take shit that sends us either insane or super sane enough to understand the reality... Which is from a normal perspective high risk and insane to some. But to some of us its actually far far more sane than staying sick/insane.


I believe the title shaman should come to someone who is an experienced worker with plant teachers/healers, and no longer needs to ingest them to call on their spirit (whether in wisdom or strength of any kind) and can perceive the dimensions/realities beyond this one and has learned wisdom that would be on par with what an (typical gray archetypal alien) of slightly low intelligence (although could be higher depending on the particular shaman) and power would understand and be able to use their mind for.

Thats just what i reckon. Probably so far from the truth.

But also they would need to understand psychology and mental phenomena, because to heal the mind is needed to heal. A mental scar will leave a mark on the bodies gross and subtle.. Also i believe a shaman would have only good intentions whether they are using purely white or both black and white medicine. But they would only harm if it was either absolutely needed or the quickest way and the way the patient they were treating wanted to be healed.

Shamans are mainly known for working with plants but it is known that they can perceive the spirits without taking any psychedelic after enough years of work with them and their own mind.

Also a shaman would have to have self understanding.. self knowledge.

Moreover a shaman would have done the training to acquire great strength in many areas.
He would need to learn to heal, and would automatically know from that how to harm.

You undergo an apprenticeship with a respected Curandero who has the experience and knowledge.
I'm not exactly sure about the in's and out's, but it involves learning about the jungle plants, doing plant 'dietas' in isolation, Ayahuasca ceremonies, learning icaros, and how to see illness, control the mareacion, how to cure, etc, etc. It roughly takes 2 years minimum to learn the bare basics.

They are different from someone who drinks Ayahuasca, because they have knowledge and ability that a drinker does not have, from the training and plant knowledge assimilated. They can actively work in the realms and manipulate it. A drinker does not have the same ability, and is merely passive.



I seriously doubt that.

I think you mean that 'some' retreat OWNERS might do. They are the ones who are the businessmen running the show, not the Curandero's.

"Singing To The Plants: A Guide to Mestizo Shamanism in the Upper Amazon" by Stephan Beyer, should be on your reading list, if it isn't already. The brujeria is just the same old power-play stuff that bedevils every known community of human beings, but with a supernatural twist on settling scores...

The plant-spirits themselves are reportedly capable of jealousy, anger and fickleness too, and it is not unknown for them to desert one practitioner, in favour of another more powerful personality...

Bringing Western scientific-analysis to bear on the phenomenology of indigenous South American shamanism could one day yield a promising synthesis of the archaic and the advanced, but I think there's still too much lofty contempt in the Western consensus for that to happen any time soon...

Seems like a good opportunity to re-post this too

This is far more to do with the character of the person involved, rather than anything else, IMV. Yes, a person may have a 'calling' to work with Ayahuasca, but the idea that a person is powerless to choose a good or bad path is untrue.

Yes, you should choose your curandero wisely, however since most of this work has already been done by respected healing centres, it is unlikely you would mistakingly use a person with bad intentions, or 'brujo'.

I wonder how long this thread is gonna live
"Shamanism" resurrected once more.

Ganesh, I completely agree, and can't see where I suggested that...?

What is frequently reported (Amaringo, Campos, Beyer et al) is that the "bad path" is considerably quicker and easier to traverse than the "good path" <Insert clunky Star Wars analogy here>...

This is not an Amazonian problem, the same can be said across many different fields, all across the world.

No human activity is without a shadow side. Posts like the OP sometimes give the misleading impression that is not actually the case, IME...

Not specifically suggesting you said that....

I was also responding to 'wannabeshaman' as well, and The Terence Mckenna quoted link, to clarify any possible misunderstandings.

the freebase and the vaporisation are new, western sciences...so aren't we, collectively, in the first world, the privileged few shamans of this new technology?

I don't think so. Consuming Entheogens doesn't make you a Curandero, it requires more than that. Plus Amazonian Curandismo considers the Ayahuasca vine to be of prime importance rather than visual plants, for the most part.

The training ? the art of leaf throwing, chanting and using fire/smoke to manipulate the experience is something we can do to. We don't need them and there are better ways to guide people through that realm.

It doesn't sound to me like you have any idea of what a Curandero actually does. I'm not an expert myself, but i have tried to understand what i can about Amazonian Curandismo. There may be some theatre involved, but for the most part there is a basic framework of serious work involved.

Curandero's aren't here to 'trip sit' people, that's what 'sitters' are for. Curandero's work is to heal sickness.