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Dry ice to precipitate NMT carbamate out of NP solvent for ACRB extract Options
 
Talkswithtrees
#81 Posted : 11/23/2015 7:43:17 PM
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Has anyone tried this procedure with different solvents? Im specifically interested in doing it with limonene for a few reasons:
1 the dmt would probably not crash out at the same time (like it does with naphtha because of the sharp drop in temperature) because dmt is so soluble in limonene
2 xylene smells horrible
3 limonene is food safe whereas neither xylene or naphtha are
4 xylene smells horrible
5 (if using naphtha) how can you be sure a simple heat bath will pick up the dmt that precipitated while the nmt sublimated? This seems less efficient to me but this is just conjecture feel free to critique this idea I would love to hear it Smile if the sublimated nmt carbonate (carbomate?) is easily penetrated by the warm naphtha this could be a non issue
6 did I mention how xylene smells?
 

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benzyme
#82 Posted : 11/28/2015 2:00:55 PM

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Talkswithtrees wrote:

2 xylene smells horrible
...
4 xylene smells horrible




lies.
"Nothing is true, everything is permitted." ~ hassan i sabbah
"Experiments are the only means of attaining knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." -Max Planck
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1ce
#83 Posted : 11/29/2015 12:39:48 AM

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benzyme wrote:
Talkswithtrees wrote:

2 xylene smells horrible
...
4 xylene smells horrible




lies.



I dunno, alkyl benzenes take some getting used to xD
 
benzyme
#84 Posted : 11/29/2015 3:09:01 AM

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:shrugs:

I like them.
I only use limonene for cleaning rifle parts and sfe parts, in an ultrasonic bath.

toluene smells heavenly to me, better than limo, and xylene isn't too bad.
dmt is soluble in limonene, but more soluble in xylene.
"Nothing is true, everything is permitted." ~ hassan i sabbah
"Experiments are the only means of attaining knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." -Max Planck
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downwardsfromzero
#85 Posted : 11/29/2015 2:05:01 PM

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benzyme wrote:
:shrugs:

I like them.
I only use limonene for cleaning rifle parts and sfe parts, in an ultrasonic bath.

toluene smells heavenly to me, better than limo, and xylene isn't too bad.
dmt is soluble in limonene, but more soluble in xylene.

There's no accounting for taste!

Xylene aroma is intense, but neither good nor bad. Not truly horrible like organic sulphides. Even too much limonene odour can drive one a bit mad.
Ora, lege, lege, lege, relege et labora

“There is a way of manipulating matter and energy so as to produce what modern scientists call 'a field of force'. The field acts on the observer and puts him in a privileged position vis-à-vis the universe. From this position he has access to the realities which are ordinarily hidden from us by time and space, matter and energy. This is what we call the Great Work."
― Jacques Bergier, quoting Fulcanelli
 
1ce
#86 Posted : 11/30/2015 6:51:04 AM

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I never said it was bad, just takes some adjustment. Much the same way you probably never enjoyed coffee or beer upon first taste. For me, I love, love, LOVE the smell of chloroform. I had some shoot out of an alihn condenser once, and unfortunately I can say it taste like alcoholic candy too.
 
Jees
#87 Posted : 11/30/2015 9:40:28 AM

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downwardsfromzero wrote:
... Not truly horrible like organic sulphides...

I had this very odd occasion to have a few inhales of hydrogen sulphide (H2S) at a factory, quite accidental as it is lethal big time in such high concentrations context. I managed to get myself in safer area before it could knock me out. It is known as one of the most horrible smells on earth, but crossing above a certain threshold (from 50 to 100 ppm or 0.005% to 0.01%) that smell is gone! One could think it smells harder with more but not so.

The really stoned period following was actually pleasant and non comparable with anything, it affected mind and body. Even out in fresh air, it continued as if it was "in" my system for a while. Not recommended, but there was that silver lining on that industrial variation of Jenkem.

Sorry for the off-topic.
 
1ce
#88 Posted : 11/30/2015 10:30:08 AM

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Jees wrote:
downwardsfromzero wrote:
... Not truly horrible like organic sulphides...

I had this very odd occasion to have a few inhales of hydrogen sulphide (H2S) at a factory, quite accidental as it is lethal big time in such high concentrations context. I managed to get myself in safer area before it could knock me out. It is known as one of the most horrible smells on earth, but crossing above a certain threshold (from 50 to 100 ppm or 0.005% to 0.01%) that smell is gone! One could think it smells harder with more but not so.

The really stoned period following was actually pleasant and non comparable with anything, it affected mind and body. Even out in fresh air, it continued as if it was "in" my system for a while. Not recommended, but there was that silver lining on that industrial variation of Jenkem.

Sorry for the off-topic.


It's interesting you bring up H2S, a previous occupation had alarms that would sound if the gas leaked, at which case we'd put on respirators and follow our evacuation routine. I was always under the impression less than a few wiffs would kill you. I'm glad you're still with us Jees.

Side note: isn't h2s commonly found in sewers? I've often pondered why it's never killed anyone in all those action movie --sewer-escapes.
 
downwardsfromzero
#89 Posted : 11/30/2015 9:35:34 PM

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Above a threshold H2S paralyses the olfactory nerve (or something like that Big grin) From what I've been taught in a previous job, it sounds as though Jees is lucky to be alive without major brain damage. A few years back some guy was awarded huge damages after being rendered a vegetable in an industrial H2S leak.

Back on the methylated benzenes, I know this guy who runs a paint store for several decades and he doesn't know what day it is. Tragic cognitive impairment from solvent overexposure - but he seems to keep the paint store going ok none the less Confused

1ce wrote:
I never said it was bad, just takes some adjustment. Much the same way you probably never enjoyed coffee or beer upon first taste. For me, I love, love, LOVE the smell of chloroform.

Yeah, that was the other guy. Chloroform ain't too bad either - no matter what I may have said in the past Wink
I rather enjoy a small whiff of nitrogen dioxide on rare occasions, quite refreshing.
Ora, lege, lege, lege, relege et labora

“There is a way of manipulating matter and energy so as to produce what modern scientists call 'a field of force'. The field acts on the observer and puts him in a privileged position vis-à-vis the universe. From this position he has access to the realities which are ordinarily hidden from us by time and space, matter and energy. This is what we call the Great Work."
― Jacques Bergier, quoting Fulcanelli
 
tregar
#90 Posted : 12/4/2015 1:58:59 PM

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Interesting thread,

Has anyone thought to use paintball c02 tanks?

C02 tanks are available from select sports stores for use in paintball or on-line, for example, the 20oz C02 tank with pin valve.

This article has more:

"The Use Of CO2 In The Frog Hobby, Building and Using a Co2 Generator"
http://www.dendroboard.c...sing-co2-generator.html

article:
Quote:
Paintball tank sizes run from 9 oz, 12 oz, 16 oz and 20 oz.

I wanted to calculate how much CO2 a tank would generate to see what size would be most appropriate.

CO2 => Mole Weight of 44g/mole.

1 mole of gas at STP is equivalent to 22.4 liters => 16g will make approximately 8.1 liters and 1 ounce = 28.3495231 grams.

From this I generated the following table.

This will produce the following amounts of CO2

Cylinder…Liters……Gallons
…9 Oz.………129.9……=…34.3
12 Oz.………173.2……=…45.8
16 Oz.………230.9……=…61.0
20 Oz.………288.6……=…76.4

If you have a paint ball tank, refilling it runs between $2.00 - $4.00 at the your local sporting goods stores. If you aren’t into paintball, check to see if any of your friends might have the equipment that you need, as you might not even have to buy a tank or remote, just borrow theirs for a quick squirt into your tank.

If you want your own equipment, the tanks cost from $9.00 - $40.00 and can be purchased online or from almost any sporting goods store or any paintball shop. I did quite a bit of researching for this article and found that the prices at our local sporting good store’s and paintball establishment’s, were quite a bit higher than many of the online sources, even with shipping factored in.

While the most common paintball tank size is probably the 20oz tank, the smaller sized tanks should be just fine for our hobby.
Beyond the cost of a tank, you will also need to purchase what is called a “Paintball Coiled Remote with quick disconnect.” The Remote is designed to power the gun while the tank is located remotely on a belt or backpack unit. The remote is able to connect to the paintball tank’s oddball thread size, it has an on / off valve, a coiled supply line, some standard sized connection fittings, as well as a quick disconnect. This unit is real cheap when compared to the cost of all of the fittings you would need purchase in order to connect to the tank if you went out to buy all of the fittings on your own.

Here is the best price that I have located on line for the pair.

Coiled Remote and CO2 Tank Combo

I also found that **azon.com had some of the best prices for the individual parts, and if you combined a tank and the “Paintball Remote”, you can sometimes get free shipping.

The best prices that I found for both the 20oz. tank and the remote were found online and prices were running between $28 - $49. The paintball and sporting goods stores around here were almost twice that.

Newbies Guide to CO2 / CO2 Tanks.

A google search of “Paintball CO2 tanks” will give you a lot more info.

If you want to adjust or regulate the pressure stream that is ported out of the tank you will need to add a pressure regulator.

A regulator is required if you are planning on using bottled CO2 for euthanizing your frogs and tadpoles. Without it you can eject too much CO2 too quickly which can freeze an animal or stress them out from too high of a volume flow. (More information is posted below.)

In order attach a regulator you should know that the threading on every paintball tank is an oddball fitting. The international ASTM thread standards designation is known as F1750-05. The ASA designation for the paintball threads is CGA-320. I share this because without the proper adaptor, it is impossible to connect to the tank outside of using epoxy as one home brewer did that I read about. The home brewing industry has developed an adapter that can covert the tank’s thread into a standard regulator fitting size so that one can attach a pressure regulator to the tank.
Click the image to open in full size.

BREWER'S EDGE® PAINTBALL REGULATOR ADAPTER

The Adapter" CO2 regulator to Paintball tank Adapter

Regulators are relatively inexpensive and you should be able to use a cheap ¼ inch air compressor regulator.
Cheap 125 PSI Air Flow Regulator

You may need to get a few other fittings to convert the lines to a ¼ inch regulator thread. I have found that Lowes seems to have a larger array of fittings than does Home Depot.

You have the coiled remote, you may not need the home brewers adaptor to connect a regulator as I believe the fittings on the quick disconnects are standard fittings.

Tips on using a Paintball tank with remote.

When connecting the Remote to the tank, make sure that the valve on the remote is in the off position. Otherwise when you make the connection, you will blow CO2 all over as you are screwing the remote onto the tank.
Keep the tank in an upright position or you will vent liquid CO2 rather than CO2 gas.
If you do not run a regulator, turn the valve on very slowly, and only crack it a small amount. You don’t need full pressure. It is after all a high-pressure tank.

Bike CO2 tanks:
Bicycle shops also carry small CO2 tanks little bigger than a pencil which they use to re-inflate bike tires. These are small and relatively inexpensive. The cartridges come in many different sizes, 12g, 16g, 25g, 38g, 40g, 45g, and 88g. The non-threaded cartridges are usually much cheaper than the threaded.

Different Size CO2 Bike Tanks

Here’s kind of a cool video of how these bike cylinders are made.

You can get a Schrader tire valve with an 1/8” fitting at your local Auto Parts store. You can also get Schrader valve at your local tire shop. If you go in and ask how much the all metal screw in Schrader valves costs, they will usually just take you in back and hand you one no charge. These are very easy to install into a chamber by drilling a 3/8 hole and popping it in place with a washer and nut. These valves even have a rubber bushing on the base to seal it up.

The problem that I see with using these non-refillable cartridges is the expense per gallon of CO2 produced. I calculated the volume of CO2 contained in the various size cylinders.

Cylinder ……Liters…Gallons
12 Grams ………6.1………1.6
16 Grams ………8.1………2.2
25 Grams ……12.7………3.4
38 Grams ……19.3………5.1
45 Grams ……22.9………6.0
88 Grams ……44.8………1.8

Because of the convenience, some might find using the bike CO2 tanks appealing so I added the information.
 
Mindlusion
#91 Posted : 12/5/2015 1:14:45 AM

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Here is what the N-methyl-tryptammonium carbamate should look like.

According to the paper you can only have like molecules forming the carbamate, which is great. It also opens doors for methylation of amines, an easier method of separation of the over-methylated products.

The amines the paper was working with were much more volatile than tryptamines, they were actually high MW alkylamines, usually liquid at room temp. The fact that tryptamines aren't as volatile means you can have some decomposition after separation without much issue other then it dissolving itself back into the residual solvent (which might be why you have goo).

Perhaps you've stumbled onto something really great here, those are some nice looking crystals.

But that's not enough to say for sure this process actually works, although it is looking promising.

Has anyone run a TLC yet?
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eastlancsguy
#92 Posted : 1/16/2016 4:07:42 AM
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If you're struggling to source dry ice, invest in a small CO2 fire extinguisher and a pillowcase.

Wrap the pillowcase round the end of the nozzle, squeeze, and hey presto - nice little globules of dry ice :-)
 
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