so....this idea sprouted up in a different thread and i figured i'd "re-pot" it here to grow as an individual idea for discussion. i'll simply repost the first couple blurbs as a quote from that thread in the hopes that perhaps it can grow here.... lemme know your thoughts!

quote: i am quite proud of my use of plant medicines and (probably not the smartest thing but completely in line with MY truth) all of my friends know about my beliefs and my respect and love for plant entheogens. if i were to get arrested for exploring my own psyche and my own place in this universe then believe me my brothers and sisters...i would do everything in my power to bring as much attention as my minimal celebrity status could to this disparity.
hey- i'm not joe rogan or anything...but i'm in Men's Health magazine and Bicycling magazine almost every month and i think it would go quite a ways to know that a professional athlete who held a world record for 5 years and is a U.S. National champion and World silver medallist finds that his athletic performance has VASTLY IMPROVED as a direct result of "training" his mind and spirit through the use of plant entheogens.
i'm not a revolutionary....but this is a cause i feel strongly enough about to consider doing SOMETHING....

LOVE AND GRATITUDE!!

so....here's was a brother's reply and my second thought on the matter....now you're all caught up!


antrocles wrote:
i think it would go quite a ways to know that a professional athlete who held a world record for 5 years and is a U.S. National champion and World silver medallist finds that his athletic performance has VASTLY IMPROVED as a direct result of "training" his mind and spirit through the use of plant entheogens.


MalargueZiggy then replied:
Firstly dude I want to say fair play to you, and I'd be quite interested to hear in more detail (maybe in another thread) how this has been the case and also how you feel entheogens could be used as part of sports psychology (professional or amateur). Yet another weapon in the armoury against the war on drugs, because I can blabber all I want about how I'm a changed person, but sporting achievement is more tangible.

Secondly (and sadly), I can see the headline if you got busted: "Champion cyclist's psychedelic shame".


to which i retorted:

that would only impact those who already have a bias against psychedelics...for me, the words "psychedelic" and "shame" have no relationship to one another. like i said, if it were to ever come out i would see it as a moment....an OPPORTUNITY...to champion a very promising cause. people use all kinds of shit to get a performance edge....caffeine, piracetam, taurine, yohimbe, sports psychologists, meditation, visualization......all attempts to tap into a more "limitless source for focus and power"...

...entheogens are RIGHTEOUS!!! i feel nothing but PRIDE in my cultivation, nurturing and communion with the plant kingdom. the fear regarding plant entheogens and their synergy with our collective consciousness NEEDS TO END.

or as dear ol' Rush puts it: ignorance and prejudice and fear walk hand in hand...



LOVE AND GRATITUDE!!

Hey man, I'm glad you decided to start this thread, it's better to have it out here than hidden away at the end of another one.

I'm not surprised to hear that you feel entheogens have helped you, and I'm really glad to hear it because, as I said earlier, sporting achievement gives a tangible quality to the idea of 'self-advancement'.

I'm sure that entheogens have helped me as a person and have assisted my creative/academic development, but there is something extra about sport, because it is a benchmark everyone can measure themselves against. Everyone can imagine the pressure they would feel when faced with the need to perform to a high level in front of other people's eyes, and everyone can get a taste for the dedication that it takes to achieve such a level.

Sporting achievement is a powerful tool in the fight against prejudice, because it goes directly against the public perception that "drugs make you lazy" or that "drugs mess up your mind."

My first question can be highlighted by something you said about Lance Amstrong:



I have had the perception that to be the best at something you need to carry with you a strong ego, you need to believe that you are better than other people. Now, you are obviously a very humble person, this comes across in spades. So, how do you marry this humility with the drive/determination and the knowledge that you are better than other people (a world record obviously proves this)? Do you obliterate the idea of external competition, and turn it into a personal fight? Do you allow yourself these moments of feeling better than others but only in a competitive sphere? How have entheogens affected your desire to win?

MZ

I don't believe this part. While I excel in some areas far beyond the abilities of my peers, I don't consider myself "special" by any means. We are all indivual parts of a universal "One". Our gifts that we are given are meant to be utilized and recognized as a valuable asset in continuing our own personal work towards to etneral growth of Good within Mankind. No matter this field of expertise/excellence, it is there for more than our own personal ego enhancement, but for everyone else who can't have it. My desire to win exists solely in the realm of others. My excellence tends to exist in the intellectual field, but in relation to a purely athletic excellence, I know that, if I win, I will bring spirit to all those who strove for my win. That I am the cause of the resounding happiness within their Being, and, since time exists cyclically, this moment of pure joyful resonance can now be forever reaccessed by any seeking positive reinforcement--thus the entire idea behind one's personal "idol".

That personal fight exists because you wish it to exist beyond personal boundaries.

SWIM has definitely improved his health and body control in general with psychedelics. There were several times when SWIM had trips where he received lessons about becoming healthier, eating better, exercising, etc.. Also his experiences made him get more interested with body control in general, interested in all sorts of sports/martial arts and so on.



the other thing is during the influence itself.. during strong ayahuasca or mushroom experiences SWIM usually just stays put and doesnt move much, but he has already played football (soccer, for americans ) after having taken an intermediate dose of mushrooms, and played very good.

Also with acid he has many times went hiking and exploring nature, and he generally feels even more control over his muscles and senses than when straight.. He has a friend that is like a little ninja, and many times while hiking somewhere in nature with him and both taking acid, SWIM has witnessed this friend making some jaw-dropping jumps and stunts.

For SWIM, psychedelics are about getting more conscious about things, and definitely the body is one of the things we need to get more conscious about, so it makes sense SWIY feels this way, antrocles. and also nice to hear a little bit more about SWIY

Ant,

Nice Topic. Suggestion - If you write for Men's Health (something i've never picked up myself) how about trying to submit a few pieces (to the magazine or others???) on mental health - something that is still often not discussed among men but an issue that effects a lot of them.

Include a section that was to also encompass the benefits of working with the more accepted entheogenic practices (or those that aren't illegal, maybe S. Daime/Aya ceremonies for example) and how people have had positive experiences (emphasising the sometimes negative nature of the experience at the time) that can help people's health mentally and subsequently physically? maybe even a short section quoting entheogen use from a US National cycling champion?

Plant a few seeds and a few shoots will grow.

Similar issues are discussed in Attention All Shipping's thread, but the problem we have is so many people are brainwashed into thinking psychedelics are inherently bad. It's like trying to reason/challenge a christian/muslim etc.. about their beliefs - your pissing in the wind.

The problem with 'outing' yourself, even with your respected background - you'd get lynched no matter how good your argument. People need to find it themselves, and that best comes from some small seed from something they've read or a friend has told them that sets in their mind. If they don't - you can't convince them.

More people will learn. But also some - no matter how intelligent or open-minded, are just not interested in internal/spiritual exploration.

peace.

I will soon be participating in a fundraiser event for AIDS awareness marathon, and hopefully will be going to Amsterdam if enough $$ is raised between myself and my g/f. All will be well enough to participate in the locale city event, but that's not my goal ($4.5grand is). My semester is soon to be at halt and my enthusiasm for this is so overwhelming. Training will begin soon as well as the fundraiser programs. Tobacco use & alcohol consumption has been cut back tremendously through willpower alone and in all my life I've never felt more committed to our world as I do right now. I guess it would be an overstatement to assume that entheogens have put me in my place, but by saying that, I can only think of the past and how much has changed since then.. and more still to come. Even friends who are still on the junk agree that I've changed, a whole lot.. Even still in appreciation for the company we've kept, am in much gratitude to ayahuasca, entheogens, and our earth into commitment with this life even more.

Didn't mean to stray out of the way, just in reminiscent aspiration. Basketball, jogging, fu/ootball () are many wonderful activities to keep the mind in tune. Even with my frequent marijuana use, I still feel that I'm doing something right.

,much respect

BEAUTIFUL you guys....great contributions!! breakMYhead-actually i don't write for Men's Health. i am simply in full-page advertisements that run in their magazine. i'm sure, however, that it would not be difficult to get an article into the proper hands....unfortunately, as the end of your post makes clear- minds are awesome in their power- whether they are set to "closed" or "open"....it would certainly be a daunting task and perhaps one i would be better suited to attempting at the end of my career when i have less to lose (not that that's way far off in the future...i'm 38 now and have this and MAYBE one more decent season in these ol' legs...).
coz42- glad to see you again my man...and even more happy to read about your athletic endeavors! the AIDS Marathon is a noble, worthwhile undertaking and my hat comes off to you. my sister recently did a similar event to raise money for leukemia/lymphoma research (our dad died of this 4 years ago). it was a truly transformative experience for her on many levels.
so- back on topic...
MalargueZiggy- here's my thoughts on the matter re: Mr. Armstrong and the whole ego-element of competitive sports:

when i was young and brash i most certainly saw racing as a pitting of MY self vs. YOUR self. it was always a battle to stand apart. to be the ONE who won....as there can only be ONE winner, right? well....i thought that was right.....
cut to about 4 years ago: my father who was my best friend in the whole world and my coach/mechanic/biggest fan/constant race companion...died....and my world shattered...even NOW as i type these words i get tears in my eyes. i miss that guy beyond anything.
this puts me in, quite possibly, the most unsteady place i've ever been in my whole life to date. i don't know what to do with myself. i always THOUGHT i was my own man and that everything i did (racing included) was for ME....but really....without having my dad there to share it with...i started to question EVERYTHING i did.....did I really enjoy it? was it what I wanted?
i went into a deep depression and, being an extremely "proactive" person, i decided that therapy and SSRI (lexapro) were needed immediately. i also began to use marijuana (eating it- couldn't afford to injure my lungs) AT LEAST twice a day. so, basically, i was high the entire time i was awake....
here's where "the shift" began to take place....i placed absolutely no judgement on my choices at this time. i used marijuana and it helped me tremendously. i used it in conjunction with my therapy. i used it in conjunction with long periods of meditation and introspection. and....to get to the heart of this thread's topic...i used it when i raced. every time. no exceptions.
what is also interesting to note here is that i trained very little during the first two years after my father's death. i rode more for mental clearing than for structured, periodized fitness gains. i just rode my fucking bike because i'd been doing it since i was 11 and my dad was always with me as i did it and when i pedaled i felt him. i felt him now as if he got to know what I felt. as if he was part of me as i flew up mountains and raced down the other side....it was like sharing something in a way i never could before. the marijuana helped me wake up to this.

and i won everything. absolutely everything.

during this time period i began to re-explore a lot of medicines i had approached with more ego in the past. mushrooms, cacti, ayahuasca....i began to work with them all again but from this place of "nothing is more important that anything else....it is all part of ONE...just approach all things with LOVE and GRATITUDE- for YOU are also a part of that ONE". i got those two words tattooed on my wrists in beautiful Japanese Kanji so that i would see them constantly for the rest of my life. i got the green tara and the kincara tattooed on my leg to remind me constantly to have compassion and that "it is only through the thorough understanding and acceptance of death that we see through the illusion of life". i didn't care about winning anymore. i just cared about sharing that feeling of freedom and power and child-like joy that i experienced on a bike with EVERYONE...not just my dad. and i was just as happy when i DIDN'T win as when i did! it was all so fleeting. it just didn't matter. my ego was fractured. it was the greatest gift imaginable.

now- i don't want to go on forever with this post....because i could. i will simply say that only a handful of months ago, my dear friend Uncle Knucles comes to me with a fist-full of research he'd been doing for months about extracting something called DMT from some root bark. from the first union with the spirit molecule i knew i had been given a tremendous gift. one that filled in all of the "gaps" in my cracked ego. it held it together like a type of glue that was beyond pliable. it helped me "work" with this whole "construct" in a way i could never have imgined doing before. when ego was needed, i knew how to use it without it using me. i learned how to not confuse myself with this made-up self. i was (and continue to be) shown the true "god-self" that is what we all are. the self that is never under threat of destruction. the one that never has to prove itself. the one that has no care for "winning" because it can never lose....
i continue to work with it....well over 150 journeys by now...pretty much every day (i call it "going to church" and just notice more and more how my approach to my sport has evolved. it is no longer a quest to "stand apart". it is more of a desire to "feel" the collective energy and to "visualize" and "manifest" in a controlled arena. it is "playtime" and i couldn't be having more fun!
the gift of spice for me as an athlete has been the ability to be SO present.....i have the deepest appreciation for this....the MOST righteous gift ANYTHING can bestow upon a soul....the gift of the PRESENT MOMENT.

and what is capable from standing in THIS place is....well....limitless....

....turns out the ego takes up a LOT of space! LOL!

sorry for the long one guys. felt good to get it all out.

LOVE AND GRATITUDE!!

wow

this post went straight from the heart, into the heart

thanks brother. i can't come from anywhere but the heart anymore.....another "side-effect" of DMT usage....

I think traditional use of botanicals, psychoactives and entheogens used in moderation is extremely positive and healthy.

I think perhaps psychoactives such Ephedra could be very beneficial if used properly.

I had a friend who pumped his bench max from 305 to 385 with Ephedra.

Hey Antrocle's, have you ever done the Race Across America? My dad's friend used to be a professional, or semi-professional at least, bicyclist. We went on the RAM four times because my dad was the crew leader for his friend when he did the race.

have any of you ever ran on dmt?

ho-ly-shit. you can run fast as hell (seen from a sober 3rd party perspective of a race between me before and on dmt racing the same guy)

psychedelics greatly improve the ability to lift your own body too. try climbing a tree or doing some chin ups. flame!

and you can go forever too without geting tired.

eventually you can train your mind to reach that state of consciousness for an athletic event. i beleive every word our silver medalist has to say.

VisualDistortion- no....i never even considered the RAAM to be perfectly honest. i'm a sprinter (my world record was in the Kilometer timetrial...as in....ONE KILOMETER...LOL!) now i race mostly criterium and some track but the longest thing you're gonna catch me doing is about 2 hours long (there's a two-week race in Wisconsin every year called "superweek" that are all 100K criterium races and we do them in 2 hours flat...sometimes even faster!). so....the notion of putting in 17 hours a day on a bike....taping my head up because i can't physically hold it up anymore....running on 3 hours of sleep.....pretty much decimating the poor area between my butt n' nuts.....and overall shaving off around 10 years from my life via DEEP adrenal depletion. the answer is no way jose.

....you really have to be fringing on crazy to even consider a 3,000+ mile "race".... your dad's friend is not completely human as far as i'm concerned and your dad probably recognizes this and enjoys observing this alien/human hybrid in action so he volunteers up as crew chief. that's what i'm thinkin'...

Fuego- i cannot only NOT imagine running on DMT...i can't imagine doing ANYTHING in this physical plane on it. when i'm in hyperspace, this world no longer exists. i don't even know how to begin to process that...

for me, there are plants that i can function (better) while on: marijuana, kratom, rhodiola, cordyceps......and there are the rest that, though i cannot use their wisdom at the same time i am competing, their positive effects on my performance come once i have returned from their teachings. dmt, salvia, mescaline, psyilocyben, kava, aya, etc...

LOVE AND GRATITUDE!

No, my dad's friend was not completely human. He was an athletic freak. He could do fly's with 100 pound dumb bells and bust off wide grip pull ups with 150 hanging from his waist like it was nothing.

And three hours sleep! Lol, he used to run of 1 and 1/2 hours sleep. As soon as he shut his eyes he'd be in REM. You could see the eyes going nuts under the eyelids. He almost won the RAAM to. He came in third once. He was leading in the last 3 miles until his neck finally gave out and he couldn't hold his head up. And then after the race was over and everyone was just trying to get the hell home, him and my dad went to the bars.

Your attitude and approach to your sport, self-knowledge and personal growth are inspiring. Your dad would be proud of the guy you've become. Love you, brother. Truly.

Good thread, I had intended to train my body in an effort to train my mind in the opposite, to please the entheogen non-physical community. In short you're doing psychedelics to improve your body and mind connection, while I do physical activity to improve spice trip lol

I'm going to chime in on the 'necessity of strong ego for optimal performance' bit that was talked about in earlier posts up there ^.

I too often thought that one common bond between the 'elite', the 'best', whatever you want to call it, is the fact that they think they are the best. It always seemed to lead to success. As the creator of their own destiny, they believe they are the best, and thus, make that happen.

However, I slowly began to realize that this is nothing more than an easy route to success (i.e. winning a contest, becoming the 'best' in your league, etc...), one that almost deserves little respect, compared to those with a [humble] internal drive for self-satisfaction in whatever they may be doing. That drive manifests itself towards success, if you truly enjoy what you do for nothing more than the enjoyment you get from it. Success should be a by-product of that. Back to that ego-driven route to success, all too often, well... you're fucking ego takes over... and we all know what happens then... (Lil Wayne comes to mind.... )

But, hell, I've tried the former method before in what I love to do (skateboarding)... and... well... it works. It works because with that ego-driven plan, you are confident. You know you know what you're doing, and it's very hard to half-step, to doubt yourself. You excel. Confidence is key in [my] life, I believe, but what is also key is to always be aware of that boundary, that line from confidence to ego-driven 'cockiness', as overstepping that boundary can really change who you are, and can cause you to lose sight. I never stepped past that boundary, thank goodness, but it's incredibly easy to. "I'm the best... I'm the shit... no one can touch me..." Yes, that is great for producing a pure-bred WINNER... in your sport of choice. Not in life. Far from it.

So, from there... I learned that the exact same level of success, if not higher, can be achieved without that ego... just as antrocles has stated in his experience... at this point in my life it has no bearing on me whatsoever, in respect to... say... skateboarding... in my case. I'm still confident in my ability, as I've done it for 9 years, but that doesn't even cross into my head anymore. And I'm still excelling, at an even faster rate maybe. All as a by-product of pure love and enjoyment in what I do. I have the time of my life every time I step on my skateboard... what more could you want from a hobby? From a sport? You tell me!

Did I ramble here? Too much MJ...

Completely off-topic here, but I just realized enlightened is spelled wrong in my rank. Nice

that's cuz you're THE BEST enlightened member LOL!!!


thanks W&B, as one who is often prone to MJ writing...i got you loud and clear and feel you 100%. beautiful my brother. now go do a backside boneless for me!

LOVE AND GRATITUDE!!