What are peoples thoughts on dropping-out?

I mean the work/life balance (a term I love because it shows the prevailing modern attitude that WORK is not LIFE, as much modern work isn't!)

My personal thoughts are these. I have studied for many years to become a professional. My work is reasonably interesting, but I spend far too much time doing it in my eyes and there are far more interesting things I could be doing.

I'd love to just be travelling the world ALL the time, I have such a great time when I'm doing that, or living in a commune somewhere although this is something I've never tried. I love new experiences, that's what gives me a thrill. Well, my actual goal is to find a nice girl, build our own home, and grow food and other plants, and have two kids to hopefully help us out when we're past it (the 'trade'- we look after you while we can, then you look after us when you can, and a tenuous trade because the kids don't get a choice in the matter when the trade is struck so are entitled to back out on their part of the deal), but that requires quite a bit of work to make the money for the land/house, and non-financial work to find the girl which requires time that the work-work restricts you from.

My main issue with dropping out is that I don't want a horrible old age- I feel I need money/property so I can support myself when I'm old. To do this, I waste much of my youth working, what a nutty trade-off! I guess I am still ruled by fear, this fear of an uncomfortable and untimely death. I see the 'drop-out' life (hippy words not mine) as great until you get too old to fend for yourself, then you're screwed with no money, and you probably end up in some awful state-owned old people's home being tortured by cruel 'nurses' treating you like cattle (seen the hidden camera videos). Or just die of cold one winter age 50, in a miserable ghetto (at least they're miserable in my country) or of the first illness you get that you can't afford financially to battle.

Some may say the answer is to find a job you love doing, so it's doesn't feel like working. Well, I think at least for me these jobs are few and far between. I liked working in a bar because it's basically getting paid to hang out. But the money's terrible, only enough to survive where I am so there's little left for when you're too old to work, and the hours aren't sociable/conducive to having children one day, which is a problem when in that kind of environment your partner usually keeps similar hours (who looks after the kids every night?). Of course I'd love to be a successful photographer photographing models all day long, but it's a long shot and I have no photography experience nor the inclination to risk all that education for the miniscule chance of payoff!

Anyone here dropped-out? Or went the other way? Tried both? Found a happy compromise? Please share your experiences!

well SWIM was going to college..had an apartment..going to parties..classes..and slowly..he just stopped going to class...it felt like highschool again for him..and hes like.."why the hell am i paying all this money?" so after about 2 years of college he decided that he was going to go live in a cabin in the woods...NOW SWIM has a place to live..a place to grow his house..because its tiny now..but it will get bigger..slowly..AND..here is the huge part..which most college students can feel a little envious for..

he has absolutely NO debt...not one penny...and a lot of people he knows owe something like $120,000 for college loans!!!!! thats enough for a house..and then some..if you are in the right place...and now..they have to work their asses off..to pay that off..while also supporting themselves.. just because you are done college doesnt mean you are going to stop paying rent..insurance on you car to get to work...car payments...food...medical bills...

so you will be paying off these college loans for something like THIRTY YEARS!!! most college grads arent even 30!

can you really imagine paying off four+ years of your life for the next 30!?!?!

so while SWIM doesnt have a degree...hes been able to spend the last five years studying EXACTLY what he finds interesting..most of which has been alternative healing with herbs and also shamanic practices..using some of our favorite psychedelics...for a FRACTION of the cost of being in college...

now heres the kicker! hes happy! his friends and parts of the community he lives in..trust his ability..recently an older friend of his..who is 40 something came to him with a problem he has been facing...his son of 11 or 12 has been struggling very very much socially..this older friend of SWIMS has taken his child to psychiatrists who are probably gonna come back with a medical answer like...oh well your son is suffering from this or this disorder..so we are gonna put him on this medicine to see if it helps...which SWIM finds appalling...so anyway...this child is extremely smart...he doesnt want to go out and play..he wants to be doing stuff..he wants to be reading fantasy books that most 30 year old wouldnt be able to finish..he wants to be working on models and shit like that..

SO SWIM tells his friend that he had some of the same problems when he was that age..and if he wanted to bring his son over..he would talk to him..give him some books to read..and just try to show him that its ok to be who he is..and that there isnt anything wrong with him...

now that may sound like its not going to do all that much..but..the 40 something year old dude..and his wife are really worried..and who better to take their unhappy child to..than somebody who has been working for 5 years on keeping himself and family HAPPY!!

so on one side...is a psychiatrist who has years of formal training..is probably really smart...and there is the other side...a drop out..with only self training..who is also fairly smart..but may have a better chance getting through to this kid because of how sensitive he has trained himself to be..and because he can truly connect with what this child is going through..

and SWIM is pretty positive the father knows he likes to dabble in the taboo arts of psychedelics and dream states...but hes still more comfortable bringing his child to SWIM than to some doctor who will charge and arm and a leg..so he can pay off his student loans..instead of truly being interested in helping this child be comfortable and happy with himself...

and personally...SWIM feels that studying psychedelics the way he has..has enabled him to really and truly connect with people..and help them figure out how to make themselves happy...and confident...and powerful..



now..doesnt mean SWIM is going to stay where he is forever..but right now...hes having the time of his life...learning things that very few people get to learn..and experiencing a lifestyle that very few people can even understand..but like i said..its been the best time hes ever had in his life..

its quite something

The 'drop out' lifestyle was great through my twenties. Living in a big ole flop house in western Oregon with 10 other people. Working occasional odd jobs to pay the rent and keep food and grass coming through the door. I got really good at playing guitar and met some really amazing people and formed some excellent memories. This lifestyle is dominated by personality. It is a world of people. For me this is the best part of this kind of lifestyle. I think humans are best when we are constantly interacting, we are an intrinsically social animal that can only exist in the wild as tight knit groups.

I became dissatisfied with this lifestlyle though. Very hard to describe but I felt my life somehow lacked meaning. I had some potential that was being wasted. Some of this was guilt. IME, most traveling/squatting type communities haven't really dropped out. They've just quit contributing. Dumpster diving is awesome and uses only the waste of society but collecting state foodboxes and taking food from christians is parasitism.

After several years I returned to college as a non-traditional student and did better than I ever had. I fell in love with embryonic development and now I capitalize on this to get my resources. Work is stressful. This is true even if your only work is keeping yourself stocked with food fuel and grass.

Jorkest is awesome! I admire that he made a decision and then went balls out. Maybe this is the best anyone can do. Be really honest with ourselves about what we want and go balls out to the max to get it.

And stop and appreciate how freakin lucky we are to be having this conversation at all. Most the humans on the planet do not get such freedom. People are born into social-family situations that can really dictate the extent of their self determination. Had we been born in tribal Pakistan becomming a Tai-Chi master would just not be an option.

Here in the west we have total self-determination. You could even go become a tribal pakistani! This is part of the problem in a way because their are so many possible paths that it is impossible to properly sample them all. How do you figure out what is best for you? idk. I think about this sometimes. What if the best possible path for me was to drive monster trucks. The first time I climb up and get behind that wheel it just clicks. Maybe I am a monster truck genius. The best there ever was, natural born. The Tiger Woods of monster trucks. How would I ever know? It would take an extreme effort for me to ever have the opportunity to try.

I think worrying about old age is a terrible way to spend your youth. You can do plenty of that when you get old Just get good at some things that some other people care about and the resources will work out.

Awesome answers already! Haha people on here are so loveable! I love hearing all your perspectives on these things, keep it coming

(My biggest stress is always that I find something more interesting to do and have neglected my work... such a procrastinator... life is just too interesting...)

Deedledoo, you raise the concept of 'contributing'. Most people define this as financial contribution... even though MONEY ISN'T REAL. Imagine if people stopped doing all this pointless moneymaking work and only did truly meaningful work. Things that enrich life for others... what about art (I'm not arguing FOR art here, I have little interest in it personally unless it's some sort of protest/enlightening message), or trying to turn people onto something they don't want to hear but maybe they need to (think the psychedelic movement, they think we're wasters, but we challenge society, Drop Out City was a huge statement).
And while I completely agree that it's wrong to be a parasite... what about someone who dodges their taxes because the money funds wars, yet channels this money into positive things instead? Not talking about myself there, but I do wonder about that... is it ethical to pay 'murder tax'? There should be a tick-box for 'wars on foreign soil' on your tax form, that'd end them overnight...

Flip a coin.

its still a whole coin!

no matter which side lands up!

I concur.

I'm a little put-off by their name, the 'crime' bit of it... are they the types who murder scientists in the name of animal rights? I'm more flower-child-beatnik-activist than black-and-skulls-masked-rioting-anarchist...

Human beings have only been able to achieve all the things they have through our highly developed ability to form societies and that is a good thing. The problem is when members of society try to force on people what they think society should be instead of letting people freely interacting with one another do it themselves. This is the source of many evil's in society. I think this is why so many people desire to drop out of the mainstream society we are led to believe is what society should or must be.

I have often noticed many people through out my life that seem to have a hard time figuring out who they are and what they want from life especially when confined to the context of western "mainstream" society. I understand this because in many ways it can suck and for many people it does suck for many different reasons. So often they people get trapped in whatever society thinks they should be. If it doesn't work out they get angry at society or worse themselves.

For me I think one of the most important things I learned in life is who I am and what I want out of life. It has always been a recipe for freeing myself of the burden society places on us all in some form or another and its my only advice. I can thank psychedelics for making that process much easier for SWIM and clearing it all up for SWIM many times over and over and wow it makes me remember what a trip this really is and its fucking awesome.

very well said burnt..and its good to see you back

This website is too addicting

I'd say if your going to drop out, do it now and ride the rails for a couple of years. The old generation of rail workers is moving on and the new generation of rail workers does not take kindly to train hoppers. They say the trains will be unrideable in four or five years. It's a shame really.

I dropped out as well.

When I had the age of 16, school became more and more some sort of prison for me. I wasn't allowed to form my own thoughts and do the things the way I wanted to, the more I resisted this "prohibition" the more the teachers tried to model me in some sort of being I just wasn't, a vicious circle had started. After a while even the best teachers couldn't explain to me anymore why I should attend school. A few months later I just stopped attending school, I didn't go anymore.

For over a year I spend my free time with the computer, playing games and programming. As it turned out, I had a great gift for computers. I started a short ICT study for 9 months which I attended only for about 4 months since again I thought being there all the time was pretty useless. I finished the study with good grades and at the age of 18 I started my career in the ICT. On this moment I have my own company and we are doing pretty good, even with the credit crunch.

Did I ever regret dropping out? No, I found out that I'm an autodidact. Just a few months back me dad told me that in kindergarten I didn't learn writing the normal way, I just wouldn't do it, I plainly refused to be teached to read and write (I was a REALLY stubborn kid). Somehow a year later I could just read and write like a normal kid but nobody knew how I learned it, the teachers thought I was a strange kid though .

Later when I reached the age of about 10, because of my refusal to do things the way the teachers liked me to, one teacher thought I was mentally retarded and ordered an IQ test for me to take. The person with who I took the IQ test was really nice and understanding so I could be myself with this person, that helped greatly to estimate my mental performance. It turned out I was a gifted child with a very high IQ, I was a textbook example for an under performing kid who got quickly bored with the normal lessons. Too bad they hadn't had the special classes for gifted children back then like they have now, so that's probably how I ended up as a dropout at the age of 16. (oh, the irony )

Good thing you did what you did Traveler, or the Nexus wouldn't be here!

I guess I'm a kind of semi-dropout. I have a little 3d graphics company and make just enough money to survive. Last year I had to pay ZERO income tax. Low consumption can only be achieved by low income! A good way to justify my lack of entrepeneur skills and disciplin

http://submedia.tv/stimulator/tag/work-less-party/

Yes, becoming a Green was great for me... immediately I became happy for all the things I DIDN'T have. No packaged foods, no big house, no sports car, no private jet... no waste, and lots of happiness from living unselfishly! I read in a book called 'consumption theory' about how property isolates people from each other, how we don't have much community like African villagers do, because we're all walled in with our private driveways and televisions etc. The work situation is the one thing I haven't worked out yet, hence this thread...

Traveler, your story is really touching and inspiring. However frustrating it was back then, it must make you really happy to feel that you have achieved despite the system was geared against you. It's great to have a STORY. That's why I try to live my life with interesting new experiences- I want to feel like I really LIVED.

I've always thought of dropping out, but I never do anything with out a back up plan. I've decided that I'm going to get my doctorate in something before I leave society, just so I can re-integrate easily if I choose too. High School was probably the worst time in my life, not because of the social aspect of it, but just being forced to be some where a majority of my day and then having to spend even more time thinking about it (home work) was just horrible to me. I graduated with the least amount of classes and the lowest possible amount of credit's. But now that I'm in college I'm extremely happy, but i still have the dream of running away.

I personally don't really define it materially, although that'll do if that's the kind of contribution you find meaningful. If someone builds or discovers something that make us all have an easier time acquiring necessary resources I'd call that a meaningful contribution.

For me personally the most meaningful contributions are those that enrich intellectual/emotional/spiritual life. I prize teachers, artists, philosophers and basic researchers way more than bankers and brokers.

I'm not saying that all traveling squat kids are parasites either. Just that a lot of the ones I knew in western Oregon were. We did not make much effort to create art or knowledge that enriches the lives of others. We mostly just wanted to crash parties to get free booze and grass. We took food from christians that was supposed to go to those who couldn't feed themselves. (We could but getting the foodbox was easier.)

..I agree with you jorkest...I was going to college studying anthropology and working every day and struggling to get by while trying to battle a minor illness brought on in-part by all the stress of modern life anyway. I was tried, irritated, and tried to compensate by drinking wayyy to much coffee and smoking rediculous ammounts of cannabis even while at work and school..

Finally I dropped out and was able to save up a small ammount of money at some other crappy job repairing flooded homes with an old frined from high school. I am still far from where I hope to get someday, but I seriousily cant see the educationsystem giving me what I want right now. I went to school to study psychedelics through anthropology, and I learned quite abit in my time there..I jsut saw so many flaws in the education system and how the fears of society really do limit the level of teaching that goes on. I was taking a class in environmental philosophy, and part of what attracted me in the first place was the section of the course on eco-feminism. Too my dismay, about 2 weeks or so in, we were told(angrily i might add) by our instrustor that the board of education or whoever had decided to write it out of the curriculm for political reasons...bullshit like that made me completely loose faith in our current education system..

Like you jorkest, I am just taking life more slowly now and exploring the things I really want to explore inthe way that I feel fit to explore them. I live in an are with 3 nature reserves in a 10 minute radius, one just a few minutes down the road, its a giant bog, the whole thing preserved, miles and miles of thick forest, trails and lakes..I have been hiking lots and reading/learning how to harvest and use the local plantlife..If I was to go back it would proabily be for more of an outdoor guide sort of thing, which would fit the location well anyway and I was raised camping basically..