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Is the stylistic aesthetic of DMT world the same for everyone? Options
 
ohayoco
#1 Posted : 4/12/2009 6:42:22 PM
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When people post things lke videos saying how it is the closest approximation to what is seen on DMT, I'm often left thinking that it's nothing like that for SWIM.
I know that the visual content (elves/jesters/gods/demons/ancestors/blobs/squid/snakes etc) can vary from person to person. That has been discussed lots already- I'm talking about the visual STYLE of these things.
What I mean is, that while we can all talk about what things we see, it's hard to convey the style of the 'artist' that drew them. I was wondering if DMT visuals are wielded with 'the molecule's paintbrush' which would therefore be universally seen by all, or if different people's minds create the visions in different styles.
Because although SWIM has been there many times, everything is always 'drawn' in the same style, so I'm guessing we as individuals only get to see visions from one artist each. But are we all viewing the work of the exact same artist who is merely painting different stuff for us, or do we each view our own personal 'DMT-style' painted in our own personal technique?

DMT
For example, smoking freebase, everything SWIM sees is bright and bold, made up of constituent little blocks of colours that can change and mutate. Everything is a bit like my atttachment, but a little more 3D. The banner of this forum is nearly there, if it was turned into the style of the colourful flashing gif I've attached, 'crystallised' into tiny segments, and the people stylised a bit more.

DMT & RIMA/MAOA
Whereas combined with a RIMA/MAOA or whatever (he's only had plants so far this way, not pharmahuasca), the visions look like they're drawn in Illustrator, with artful silver outlines, and more delicate neon lines as infil over a black background, rather than freebase's predominance of solid colour. The visions seem to be less 'weird' when not achieved through smoking too. Pablo's visions are a rough approximation to SWIM, and the Shipibo patterns- I have attached an image for each of these under SWIM's DMT choice. Alex Grey is getting there I suppose, but not quite 'right' for SWIM.
Maybe it's exactly the same as freebase though if more DMT is taken with the RIMA? Let me know if you've found this. SWIM hasn't tried going overboard when it's going to last an hour, and doesn't dare to, to be honest.

So, what does it look like to SWIY? The same as for SWIM, or different?

Please distinguish between freebasing and use with a RIMA/MAOA Very happy

Key for images below:
First image: smoked DMT
Second: Ayahuasca
Third: Ayahuasca
ohayoco attached the following image(s):
Freebase is like this for SWIM- no black, alien shapes.gif (549kb) downloaded 2,177 time(s).
Aya looks like this for SWIM but more exact like Illustrator.jpg (95kb) downloaded 2,155 time(s).
Aya patterns are like this for SWIM but more exact.jpg (53kb) downloaded 2,145 time(s).
Everything I write is fictional roleplay. Obviously! End tribal genocide: www.survival-international.org Quick petitions for meaningful change: www.avaaz.org/en/
End prohibition: www.leap.cc www.tdpf.org.uk And "Feeling Good" by David D.Burns MD is a very useful book.
 

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Espiridion
#2 Posted : 4/12/2009 7:45:59 PM

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Quote:
everything SWIM sees is bright and bold, made up of constituent little blocks of colours that can change and mutate.

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Yes! The 'atoms' or 'pixels' of the visions. The smallest increment. Usually green is the predominant color, then blue then some red. They usually seem to have some 'linkage' system, whereby they are attatched to more and more and so on making long strands of the same color peppered with the secondary and tertiary ones. The strands go on flowing and mutating but if one looks closely enough, one sees these 'links', the smallest iterations.

I just got so excited to read that! I have some pictures as well that somewhat resemble the finer bits of the visuals.

I will say that of late, THH has been an almost essential ingredient to the recipe and that definitely changes the quality of the c.e.v.s. Gives a more plasticy, computer generated appearance to them. Also, the subject matter is much different. But the pics I have attatched have elicited very strong head nods from my GF and another.

Thanks. BTW, I am one of the ones who posted a video link to a 4-d solid. It resembled a device that was offered in trade for my soul and gave me insane euphoria. It is just as close as I could come without actually downloading the experience from my brain to anothers.
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Who looks outside, dreams. Who looks inside, awakens. Carl Jung

 
Espiridion
#3 Posted : 4/12/2009 8:15:11 PM

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oops...
Here. I have taken a few and put them into one with PS. The basic small linky bits. I typically don't see static patterns as cohesive as these, but this isn't too too far off the bat. Just impossibly long strands going off into infinity. Sort of like hanging beads and if you look past them you see other things like 'elfs', pests, etc. running around trying to get behind you. like these are the distraction."ooooh-look-pre-tty!" just my experience.
Espiridion attached the following image(s):
linkybits.jpg (244kb) downloaded 2,138 time(s).
Who looks outside, dreams. Who looks inside, awakens. Carl Jung

 
Bill Cipher
#4 Posted : 4/12/2009 11:00:26 PM
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Can't say as any of those are actually close representations of SWIM's hyperworld, although it's just so difficult to truly conceptualize when not actually in the space (not that he doesn't try to with just about every waking moment), and it really is beyond him to articulate with any degree of accuracy.

Anyway, SWIM would say (if reduced to speaking metaphorically) that his breakthrough place is more of a crisp, hard-candy Wassily Kandinsky-type geometric environment, heavily populated with inscrutable glyphs and symbols, perpetually transforming, collapsing, becoming, etc. (moving in a not unfamiliar, yet much more complicated manner to the 4-d cube representation you posted a few weeks back, Jason), infused with the detail, depth and hectic emotional tone of Heironymous Bosch, and the color, plasticity and overall weirdness of Robert Williams. Of course, the next time he blasts off, SWIM will immediately recognize this description as so much bullshit and reductionist nonsense, but it's all he's got at present.

He also finds that THH alters the visuals (and he is also COMPLETELY hooked on the combo), although he'd be hard pressed to say how exactly. Repeated hits too, taken in conjunction will alter the scene tremendously. He often finds when going 4-5 times in the space of an hour, hour and a half, that the visuals (and overall tone of the ride) will be distinctly different each time.

Finally, and this is a bit off topic perhaps, but has anyone else ever experienced a physical and visual compression of the breakthrough space before it folds up completely, and/or the space turning to liquid held in some kind of translucent vessel? SWIM has had both experiences repeatedly now, where the space compresses towards the end (almost as if the gradual reappearance of the ego is pushing it down), and this transformation to liquid, the last stage of which before the breakthrough ends is the vessel breaking and the liquid spilling out, like some kind of mental and visual orgasm or release.

 
Espiridion
#5 Posted : 4/13/2009 2:53:43 AM

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I love you mr.Van D'lay. Imagine if all we had to communicate were cave paintings. Yes, words are so much fluff. But what else have we. You more than most have the gift of articulation and if you were not here trying with all you have, then this forum would be more than a shade lacklustre. We all are here with the knowledge that our words are insufficient but try we will. Until one day, when the lexicon is brimming, all we will need is a puff and a nod. An oh, so knowing nod.
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Thanks. I can't wait for more reductionist nonsense.
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a myth intrepidly met = dimethyltryptamine. I thought it fitting.
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Who looks outside, dreams. Who looks inside, awakens. Carl Jung

 
ohayoco
#6 Posted : 4/13/2009 3:39:58 AM
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Jason- so with DMT you see the black behind those patterns?
That's interesting how they're all linked for you- SWIM calls it the 'DMT web'. It can be very crystalline like your first attachment for him. Sometimes it is made of circles, sometimes polygons. But always closely knit, never any black showing through between any gaps (black background is strictly an aya thing for him).
As for colours, orange seems to be predominant for SWIM, then red, green, blue, yellow, pink and purple, very neon 'eighties'. When the cevs fade to grey, he opens his eyes to view the world with DMT-neon auras.
The 'style' of the visions is very South American, Peruvian although not so indiscriminately blocky and more elegant, while entities are constructed more like hindu gods/goddesses with many breasts/arms/legs/tentacles, yet they often pose in a dignified way like ancient Egyptians, when they aren't dancing/enticing him with their cheeky sexuality. He has seen medieval but only in the 'DMT style'. This is all straight DMT I'm talking about.

SWIM has just been again to remind himself, hence the update... it's definitely a similar visual intensity as his first attachment, though less frenetic with the colour change. But far more vivid, mathematical and beautiful than that. Don't know how his mind does it. SWIM visits rooms, strange palaces/temples clad in these tiny 'jewels', often with one entity taking centre stage in each room, then he'll walks up steps, across galleries etc. The crystalline geometry may morph to create another 'room', or unfold to 'outside', or maybe SWIM just moves through, he's not sure. That's about as much as I can describe the style. It always looks roughly this way for SWIM, the content may change but the style seems consistent. Will have to try it with THH!
Everything I write is fictional roleplay. Obviously! End tribal genocide: www.survival-international.org Quick petitions for meaningful change: www.avaaz.org/en/
End prohibition: www.leap.cc www.tdpf.org.uk And "Feeling Good" by David D.Burns MD is a very useful book.
 
ohayoco
#7 Posted : 4/13/2009 3:40:55 AM
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So Art, you see something like this, (or a DMT version of?) ...

Kandinski doesn't resonate for SWIM really... it's not 'mathematical' enough.
The freneticness of Bosch he can definitely understand, although not the artistic style. Sometimes he sees lots of entities when he's in an 'outside environment', but when he's in the palaces there's generally only one or two per room.

The girl in the third one is definitely getting there for SWIM! Hotness and wiseness are themes for his entities, whatever their gender, although they are often female. And mutated in a not-unappealing way.

Apologies if I haven't paid attention or have misunderstood- SWIM's still full of vibrations!
Post your 'best fits'... draw your own if you can't find anything to describe it for you! Smile
ohayoco attached the following image(s):
kandinsky.comp-8.jpg (140kb) downloaded 2,039 time(s).
bosch-delightc.jpg (278kb) downloaded 2,031 time(s).
robert-williams-pavilion-of-red-clown.jpg (84kb) downloaded 2,015 time(s).
Everything I write is fictional roleplay. Obviously! End tribal genocide: www.survival-international.org Quick petitions for meaningful change: www.avaaz.org/en/
End prohibition: www.leap.cc www.tdpf.org.uk And "Feeling Good" by David D.Burns MD is a very useful book.
 
Bill Cipher
#8 Posted : 4/13/2009 6:29:21 AM
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Thanks for the nice words, Jason. You've always got a pretty unique point of view yourself. I always enjoy your posts.

Ohayoco - SWIM references Kandinsky because of the geometric/mathematical themes - Picasso too in this respect (especially in his portraits, as they often feature multiple physics-defying points of view of the same subject), but understand that he's struggling as best he can to paste together a reasonable composite - these are the cats who come to mind for him. As we all know, words and descriptions fail miserably - the space is simply inexpressible. But I would say that later Robert Williams pieces (such as the one shown on his home page) http://www.robtwilliamsstudio.com/ come as close as anything can (and I'd be surprised if he wasn't a spiceophile quite frankly), and the Bosch painting you downloaded is a pretty good example. Put em all in a blender, give em a multi-armed Hindu spin, throw in a couple of lapping tongues and some very weird alien music, and we're probably no closer to arriving at a consensus or anything approaching the truth... but hey, it's always fun to try (if not more than a little crazy making).

SWIM's love affair with the spice definitely makes him yearn to paint. Now all that's missing is the talent...
 
shoe
#9 Posted : 4/14/2009 12:01:25 AM

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For SWIM, His DMT Experiences generally have a very rounded, feminine, "chunky" or "chubby" feel to them.
And of course, are very colourful.
He's very thankful that he managed to find this fractal, because he's been searching or trying to get people
to post pictures of their experiences for months, without luck. (check a thread out called "prises for drawing the elves"Pleased

But Anyway, SWIM's trips all look very simmelar to this, with this kind of rounded colourful chubbiness to them.
Observe!



shoe attached the following image(s):
artgallery-psion005-abstract-digital-art-fractal-Psytrip.jpg (176kb) downloaded 1,958 time(s).
shoe

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Love, Gratittude, Compassion, Fearlessness!
 
shoe
#10 Posted : 4/14/2009 12:11:58 AM

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p.s Thankyou SO much Uncle Knucles, ive just discovered robert williams and I LOVE IT. Smile
shoe

ॐ भूर्भुव: स्व: तत्सवितुर्वरेण्यं । भर्गो देवस्य धीमहि, धीयो यो न: प्रचोदयात्
Love, Gratittude, Compassion, Fearlessness!
 
Bill Cipher
#11 Posted : 4/14/2009 3:54:53 AM
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You bet. He's the coolest, and he's only gotten better over the years - his recent stuff is just on a whole other level. There's not a huge amount on his website gallery, but if you hunt around the net you'll find plenty. And I highly recommend Robert Williams' Dream Detective on youtube, for all weirdo psychedelic cartoon afficiandos.

The four I've attached here come as close as any single artist I've found to capturing both the tone and visual style of SWIM's personal hyperspace. I'd bet dollars to doughnuts that he's intimately familiar with our communal obsession.
Bill Cipher attached the following image(s):
robert-williams-1.jpg (114kb) downloaded 1,912 time(s).
robert-williams-12.jpg (106kb) downloaded 1,889 time(s).
rwilliams.jpg (136kb) downloaded 1,886 time(s).
robert-williams-5.jpg (114kb) downloaded 1,873 time(s).
 
Bill Cipher
#12 Posted : 4/14/2009 5:27:38 AM
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Okay, hold the phone. This one is ringin' some bells...
Bill Cipher attached the following image(s):
TheVirgin_web.jpg (180kb) downloaded 2,415 time(s).
 
Fatcat
#13 Posted : 4/14/2009 4:26:36 PM

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on Low doses I see things like what is in my signature (I actually made that to replicate something I saw), and on high doses my vision really turns in to the images like what Uncle Knucles is posting.
By allowing this message to pass through your cornea, into your retina, you accept it as is and agree to my disclaimer regarding my posts that they are a complete falsification by doing so freeing me of all liability, direct, indirect, consequential or incidental that may arise from the instillation of this post in your memory bank.
 
obliguhl
#14 Posted : 4/14/2009 4:46:17 PM

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ohayoa, the third pattern does not seem to be exclusive to ayahuasca experiences. For reference:

http://www.dmt-nexus.me/...aspx?g=posts&m=18916
 
worwalkerlds
#15 Posted : 4/14/2009 7:01:43 PM

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I see pesky 'elves' behind the strands. They try very hard to elude my gaze. They zip, zig and zag and love to get behind me. Anyway, this link is a wonderful resource if you like surreal art. We all know Alex Grey. I hope we know Luke Brown. But check out Gil Bruvel. Art, I REAAALLY think you will like him! Here is the link to beinart, surreal at its finest.

http://beinart.org/artists/

This one by Luke Brown is a decent empirical example of what I see. Things behind things behind things.

Everyone please post any and all pics that 'best' represent your visits. A picture is worth a thousand words. And know that interpretation is, of course, personal, but I think this may be one of the most thought provoking threads we will have, so lets blow it up!

Enjoy!
worwalkerlds attached the following image(s):
spectraleyes_001.jpg (134kb) downloaded 1,831 time(s).
You would have to be CrAzY to believe anything I say.
 
Espiridion
#16 Posted : 4/14/2009 10:10:45 PM

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Let me give some examples that I believe are in the same vein. These are the twisted worlds of some artists who I cant help but suspect have had their world skewed by chemical means.
Espiridion attached the following image(s):
Bewegung.jpg (30kb) downloaded 1,795 time(s).
jussi-lof-4.jpg (86kb) downloaded 1,810 time(s).
dan-seagrave-5.jpg (173kb) downloaded 1,822 time(s).
Turm06.jpg (49kb) downloaded 1,785 time(s).
Who looks outside, dreams. Who looks inside, awakens. Carl Jung

 
Bill Cipher
#17 Posted : 4/14/2009 11:10:21 PM
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worwalkerlds wrote:
Check out Gil Bruvel. Art, I REAAALLY think you will like him! Here is the link to beinart, surreal at its finest.


Thanks for the tip - cool stuff indeed. And I love the beinart site. That's where I commandeered my Mickey in utero avatar.

Another one I'd have to throw into the soup would be M.C. Escher (of course), for the twisty-turny, how can this be-ness.
Bill Cipher attached the following image(s):
MC Escher - House of Stairs.jpg (96kb) downloaded 1,786 time(s).
 
Garulfo
#18 Posted : 4/15/2009 1:54:22 AM

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Thanks for ginving some links. I did'nt know most contemporary artist.

My friend said me that the 'closest' to his visions would be a mix of Escher and Mark Ryden (great artist !)

http://www.markryden.com/paintings/index.html

 
Bill Cipher
#19 Posted : 4/15/2009 3:37:34 AM
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I can definitely see it. Thanks for the tip.
 
Garulfo
#20 Posted : 4/15/2009 11:57:47 AM

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What do you think about this one (Ryden again) ?:

http://www.wondertoonel....intings/magiccircus.html
 
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