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Caapi Copy Options
 
a1pha
#1 Posted : 4/9/2009 2:31:38 AM


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Can anyone provide information on Caapi Copy?

I ordered some (since just about everything else on FV was out of stock) and should receive it soon. Specifically, proper dose (I think I'll encapsulate 1g into 5 200mg servings to be released in OJ when ready), effects (is this better than making my own combo when THH, harmaline, and harmine are available), and effects versus rue (since this is the only thing I've tried so far, with deep and profound but extremely nauseating experiences).

My end goal is to create a reliable pharma mix and this stuff seems rather promising! I'm highly ecstatic for this weekend! =)

Thanks!
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Good quality Syrian rue (Peganum harmala) for an incredible price!
 
69ron
#2 Posted : 4/9/2009 3:33:36 AM

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SWIM has some right now. You'll need 150-200 mg. No more than 200 mg. It's almost exactly like the real caapi except there's no nausea, at least for SWIM.

It's MUCH BETTER THAN RUE! It seems to be very high in THH. My guess is that it's probably 40-50% THH. Something like that. It has the feel of caapi for sure.

I think you could make your own mix, but looking at the price, I don't know if you'll save any money. Maybe if you put a lot of harmaline instead of harmine, it would be cheaper, but then it would start feeling like rue, so I don't know if that's such a good idea.
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Bill Cipher
#3 Posted : 4/9/2009 4:12:56 AM
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I just saw this too. Ron, is it good for sublingual pre-basing? How does it differ from pure THH? And how much oral freebase would one use for a moderate first timer's (oral) dose in conjunction with 150-200mgs?
 
WSaged
#4 Posted : 4/9/2009 6:13:27 AM

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Quote:
It's MUCH BETTER THAN RUE! It seems to be very high in THH. My guess is that it's probably 40-50% THH. Something like that. It has the feel of caapi for sure.

I think you could make your own mix, but looking at the price, I don't know if you'll save any money. Maybe if you put a lot of harmaline instead of harmine, it would be cheaper, but then it would start feeling like rue, so I don't know if that's such a good idea.

Yeah I was wondering how well it compared too, I opted for purchasing the individual Harmalas & making my own mix.
45mg THH
55mg Harmine
5mg Harmaline
40mg DMT
Put it together in a small veg cap.
Haven't had the chance to try it yet.

It would surely be easier to use the Caapi Copy though. I'd like to check it out in the future as well.
I did try a small unmeasured amount of THH subligually with lovely effect!!

WS
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amor_fati
#5 Posted : 4/9/2009 6:59:28 AM

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SWIM can't wait! He's been sitting on his for a while and has been so anxious about it, as it's been so long since he's done -huasca. SWIM would still probably rather get harmaloids separately and in bulk so that he can experiment with dosage amounts and timing, but it's probably still nice to get as close to the vine as pharmahuasca allows.
 
acolon_5
#6 Posted : 4/9/2009 7:31:52 PM

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That sounds pretty neat.

I'll have to find out who sells it. I still am a little weary of anything that is trying to mimic an actual plant source.

How close to actual caapi vine is it?
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amor_fati
#7 Posted : 4/9/2009 7:50:58 PM

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Same vendor commonly used as a source for fumaric and thh.
 
a1pha
#8 Posted : 4/10/2009 1:05:32 AM


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Thanks for all the input, you guys are great.

I'm hoping it comes in tomorrow. If so, I'm curious to see the effects minus DMT (need to make sure it agrees with my body before adding DMT). I'll keep you guys posted.
"Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored." -A.Huxley
 
Dorge
#9 Posted : 4/10/2009 1:51:54 AM

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acolon_5 wrote:
That sounds pretty neat.

I'll have to find out who sells it. I still am a little weary of anything that is trying to mimic an actual plant source.

How close to actual caapi vine is it?


its extracted from the vine and the alkaliods are isolated purified and combineing in a specific ratio I presume. so essentially it is the vine, just a standardized extract as they would say in the herbal supplement industry... kinda like getting a kava extract at the health food store and it saying it has 300mg kavalactone ect...
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a1pha
#10 Posted : 4/10/2009 5:38:35 AM


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LLB wrote:
its extracted from the vine and the alkaliods are isolated purified and combineing in a specific ratio I presume. so essentially it is the vine, just a standardized extract as they would say in the herbal supplement industry... kinda like getting a kava extract at the health food store and it saying it has 300mg kavalactone ect...


Can you point me towards a tek to do this myself? I have a few pounds of vine I wish to use, however, all previous tea attempts have been unsuccessful. Also, I prefer controlling dose if possible and traditional ayahuasca is just too inaccurate for my taste. Reliability and safety are my prime concerns.

Thanks again!
"Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored." -A.Huxley
 
Bill Cipher
#11 Posted : 4/15/2009 9:02:47 PM
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Sorry to bump the thread, but can anyone advise a good moderate first timer's oral dose (both caapi copy and freebase DMT)?
 
WSaged
#12 Posted : 4/15/2009 10:05:56 PM

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Uncle Knucles wrote:
Sorry to bump the thread, but can anyone advise a good moderate first timer's oral dose (both caapi copy and freebase DMT)?

On FV's site they mention in the write up on the Caappi Copy that:
Quote:
200 mg of Caapi Copy contains the same amount of Banisteriopsis caapi alkaloids as found in 40 grams of a typical batch of Banisteriopsis Caapi.
(also, 1 gram of Caapi Copy contains the same amount of Banisteriopsis caapi alkaloids as found in 200 grams of a typical batch of Banisteriopsis Caapi.)


So 200mg would be around the typical amount found in the average cup of Ayahuasca, which usually calls for 40-to-50g of B.Caapi vine.
I'd start with 30-to-40mg of DMT-fumarate, once again around the average amount of DMT found in the average dose of Aya (50g of Chacruna).
Use 5-to-10mg less DMT if it is freebase. The DMT-Fumarate, or DMT-HCL are easier on the stomach, but freebase works too.

I just ordered 400mg of Caapi Copy to compare it to the Aya caps I made using FV's isolated harmalas.
I read a recipe for "True Pharmahuasca once, it recommended:
45mg THH
55mg harmine
5mg harmaline
Plus 45mg DMT fumarate

It also stated "1 capsule is 1 dose, equivalent to 1 mild dose of authentic ayahuasca. The effects are IDENTICAL but without the nausea."

I can verify this statement!
This produced the most wonderfully clean Ayahuasca experience I've had!!
And it truely was indistinguishable from the 50g Caapi/50g Chacruna brews I've made with vine from Maya, except for the total lack of nausea.
It had all of the spirit of a full on Ayahuasca dose & I was able to communicate just as well, if not better!

I'm curious to see if FV's Caapi Copy has pretty much the same alkaloid mix. I asked the guy & he wouldn't tell me the exact ratios but he said it was the same as a average dose of the vine, without the fibers of the vine.
We'll see, I've been very satisfied with everything else I've gotten from them!!

Cheers,

WS




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mapp
#13 Posted : 4/24/2009 8:46:22 AM
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warrensaged wrote:

So 200mg would be around the typical amount found in the average cup of Ayahuasca, which usually calls for 40-to-50g of B.Caapi vine.

I just ordered 400mg of Caapi Copy to compare it to the Aya caps I made using FV's isolated harmalas.
I read a recipe for "True Pharmahuasca once, it recommended:
45mg THH
55mg harmine
5mg harmaline
Plus 45mg DMT fumarate

It also stated "1 capsule is 1 dose, equivalent to 1 mild dose of authentic ayahuasca. The effects are IDENTICAL but without the nausea."

I can verify this statement!

Wait... so a single 200mg caapi copy dosage is needed for ayahuasca and is roughly equal to 45mg THH, 55mg harmine, and 5mg harmaline..

One 200mg caapi copy costs about $7, and 200mgs of separate THH, harmine and harmaline is about $20 but would supply about 4 dosages if you skimp on the harmine one time (or bump down the dose to 4x50mg harmine - would that even be acceptable?) In turn this would equal 4 caapi copys which would cost about $30.

Plus then, if SWIM is correct, he could just buy THH + harmine for the next 36(!) or so aya dosages because only 5mg of harmaline is required each time.

So does SWIYs think it's worth it or effective for SWIM to mix his own dosage to save money?



 
obliguhl
#14 Posted : 4/24/2009 9:32:09 AM

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This sounds very exciting and it's a real shame that they don't ship to europe and that there isn't an alternative.

Another question is: How "authentic" can a session without vomitting and nausea be ?
 
a1pha
#15 Posted : 4/24/2009 9:12:27 PM


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I had great success with an initial dose of 200mg caapi copy and about 20ml mhrb tincture. It wasn't nearly as 'deep' as my experience with rue, but this could have been from my moderate dose of tincture. This weekend I will try 200mg/40ml ratio and report back.
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antrocles
#16 Posted : 4/24/2009 9:28:26 PM

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awesome research you guys....i have some caapi copy and have yet to try it out.....a1pha- where'd SWIY get that MHRB tincture? sounds quite interesting...especially considering my recent experiences with tinctures...


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WSaged
#17 Posted : 4/24/2009 9:35:33 PM

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obliguhl wrote:
This sounds very exciting and it's a real shame that they don't ship to europe and that there isn't an alternative.

Another question is: How "authentic" can a session without vomitting and nausea be ?


I have not had the time to try the "Caapi Copy" extract yet, but making my own caps with the above ratio's, was exactly like the 50g Caapi/50g Chacruna brews I've made before!!
The purging being a part of the traditional Ayahuasca ceremony was not missed at all, in fact it was like that blockage to the "cleansing" part was not there, so the puking was not necessary.
Whatever needed to be "cleaned out" was able to just go freely instead of clinging to the walls with the fibrous sludge!!

I felt at times like I was outside my body, observing (if I wanted to), while it was cleaned & detailed, inside & out, by an expensive car wash.
Compared to hosing the car down quickly in the front yard with a garden hose & a sponge, to clean it.

Obviously those are just metaphors for the differences, but the differences are so minute I gotta nit pick.

Should really give it a try!!

WS
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a1pha
#18 Posted : 4/24/2009 10:51:41 PM


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warrensaged wrote:
The purging being a part of the traditional Ayahuasca ceremony was not missed at all, in fact it was like that blockage to the "cleansing" part was not there, so the puking was not necessary.
Whatever needed to be "cleaned out" was able to just go freely instead of clinging to the walls with the fibrous sludge!!

I felt at times like I was outside my body, observing (if I wanted to), while it was cleaned & detailed, inside & out, by an expensive car wash.
Compared to hosing the car down quickly in the front yard with a garden hose & a sponge, to clean it.


I'd second WS here. As cleansing as the purge is, I really really don't like nausea or vomiting. It just doesn't agree with me. It's more painful than cleansing for me.

With the aforementioned combination, the nausea was gone with the wonderful aya experience intact. I was able to purge higher levels of myself instead of just the physical. It was as if I could stand back and allow some higher power to do what it does and cleanse my soul and teach me what it has to teach. This is more than welcomed.

antrocles wrote:
a1pha- where'd SWIY get that MHRB tincture? sounds quite interesting...especially considering my recent experiences with tinctures...


I make it myself. I put about 1/4 pound whole mhrb in a jar and fill it about a quarter way up with grain alcohol. Shake shake shake for a week and you're left with some incredible dark purple/yellow tincture. I then fill up a number of 1oz dropper bottles with this, each being two doses. I then repeat the process adding more alcohol until I feel it's exhausted.

Sorry for the poor description but I let intuition, not science, guide me. This method has been working very (very) well. It's also like nothing I've read on this forum or anywhere else. Yes, I am n00b so I don't have much of a reference point. Best I can describe I've found the keys to heaven...
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Saidin
#19 Posted : 4/24/2009 11:05:53 PM

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You can also do it with acidified water. I place 40g of powdered MHRB in ~ 1 litre of cold phosphoric acidified water and shake and shake and shake for a week, then decant, add 1 litre more of 1/2 as acidified water, and shake and shake and shake for another week. Combine and reduce. I find this way that 4-6g worth of water is good enough for a pleasant journey, no nausea and more vidid visuals compared to fumerate/freebase.
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antrocles
#20 Posted : 4/25/2009 7:32:05 AM

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i have a friend with a KANGEN water machine who just made me a 5 gallon jug of 11.5ph water.....i overheard someone somewhere saying that a super-basic water can extract the active alkaloids from kave, marijuana, AND MHRB...

...does anyone of our science-minded family know if this is so and how i would go about doing this? i've got a kilo of beautiful deep purple powdered MHRB and 5 gallons of 11.5 ph water....and a dream.... Pleased


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