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Questions on the Hippe Salad Oil Tek Options
 
deepacceptance
#1 Posted : 1/12/2013 5:21:16 PM

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I am preparing to do the Hippie Salad Oil tek. It sounds really good, using easy to obtain foodgrade items, simple procedure, and getting good yields. Wow! What more could I want?

But I do have some questions (mostly for Jamie, if you happen to read this):

1. The tek states:
Quote:
* Lime can be replaced by sodium carbonate throughout the tek for those who do not have access to lime. Since sodium carbonate can be made from baking soda this should make it a viable option for everyone everywhere.


Is there any disadvantage of using sodium carbonate instead of lime? Should I use the same amount of sodium carbonate as when using lime?

Sodium carbonate is a lot cheaper (through converting bicarbonate). But sodium carbonate seems to be less volume per weight then kalkwasser/lime and I wonder if this is a problem.

2.
Jamie says:
Quote:
I also started with the vinegar acid step like in q21 cus I feel like it helps the solvent pulls somewhat..


So adding a step 1.5 to the Hippie Oil Tek from q21s tek:

Quote:
Note 1:this step does not need to be too "exact"

Step 1: Take 30g-250g powdered MHRB and place in your container. (For first-timers 30g-50g is recommended)

Step 2: Add vinegar to the bark and stir until the bark starts forming clumps. Add enough so most of the bark is wet, red and clumpy.

Step 3: Then slowly and while stirring add near-boiling tap water. Add and stir until it is wet enough to flow when you tip the container to one side or the other. The bark will absorb some of the water over the first few minutes, add more warm/hot water to get it wet enough again as needed (It will be about: 100ml vinegar and 100ml near-boiling water for 100g MHRB)

Step 4: Stir several times as the bark is let to sit for 20-40 minutes. (Longer won't hurt though) YOU DO NOT NEED TO STIR CONSTANTLY, ONLY PERIODICALLY


After doing this we end up with a different consistency of MHRB Goo (more fluid). Will this be a problem later on? Because I quote:

Quote:
but if you overdo it it will make your mixture turn more liquidy and it will be hard separate.


Or can I just continue with step 2?

Jamie, for step 2, Basify. How much lime did you use? The stated amount in the Hippie Salad Oil tek (25% gram of the MHRB grams used) or q21s amount (75%+ gram)

3. Cleaning up.

Jamie advises to clean up at the end with IPA (and skip the in between washes with sodium carbonate). Cleaning up with ISA, this just dissolving your jimjam in IPA, and then filtering it, right?

Thank you for any more light you can shed on this Tek!
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jamie
#2 Posted : 1/12/2013 6:49:03 PM

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If there is too much liquid when you add the oil yes it will be hard to seperate..so if you do the vinegar step make sure that you have a very very thick mixture of bark and acetic acid/water..you dont have to follow the numbers for the q21 tek..you want a very very thick paste.

If you have it too water it might take 2-3 days to fully seperate..but it still seperated for me.

I never tried sodium carb for this tek. I have only used lime. I think maybe dreamer used sodium carbonate. It is his tek that he wrote up so you might want to ask him about that. I would think sodium carb should work okay though as long as the ph gets high enough.

I never did the sodium carb washes becasue I had bad luck with that in the past trying to clean up some limo..so I am not the person to ask about that. I just dont go there..I also did a couple of the pulls with the sunflower oil as hot pulls heated in a double boiler..this seemed to pull more but also pulled some other junk..which is why I cleaned it in iso at the end. I would clean it anyway if your unsure..it cant hurt.

To clean it just dissolve everything that will dissolve in some 99% iso, filter it and then evaporate. I actaully let it all settle some more after filtering and removed the liquid from the rest of the sediments with a glass eye dropper.
 
Parshvik Chintan
#3 Posted : 1/12/2013 9:24:10 PM

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if you want you can toss it in the oven on a low setting (200ºF or below) for a little while till it dries out a bit more.

and it will aid in lysing the cells.
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deepacceptance
#4 Posted : 1/13/2013 8:39:43 AM

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O.K, Thank you! I feel ready to do this Tek (after I get all the supplies). To be on the safe side I will start with using lime.
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dreamer042
#5 Posted : 1/13/2013 5:07:47 PM

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1. Sodium carbonate will only push the ph up to about 11, whereas lime will push it up to 13. Both work fine but lime is more efficient.

2. I personally have always found the vinegar step in q21 to be redundant. This is what accounts for the difference in amounts of base. If you drop the ph by acidifying first, obviously it's going to take more base to push it back up, this is especially important to remember if you are using carb since it is a weaker base. In either case you want to shoot for the consistency of cookie dough before adding your oil, you are basically looking to separate the liquid oil from the fairly solid plant/base dough.

3. The sodium carb wash works just like washing naphtha, it's very easy. The IPA/Ethanol cleanup step is also included in the tek, it is just basically dissolving in alcohol, allowing any solids to settle, then filtering.

A couple notes:
- I think the 9 pulls is pretty redundant and that many is not really necessary, I just wanted to be sure to get every last bit since the oil is less efficient at pulling than other solvents.

- Using heat will be much more efficient as well, and with the wash, defat, and cleanup; you should still get a very clean product. I decided to write the tek without the use of heat because of the inherent dangers of spilling hot oil or having it catch fire. Definitely use a double boiler, wear safety gear, and be careful if working with heat.



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deepacceptance
#6 Posted : 1/14/2013 11:05:34 AM

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This is great, thank you! I have a better understanding of the why's and hows of lime/carbonate basing. I will get some lime for my first extraction and follow the original tek closely. Thank you for adding the amounts (grms etc) in the tek, really helpful for a starting Spice Alchemist Apprentice.

Edit: I think about experimenting with using low heat by putting the container in a pan of hot water
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deepacceptance
#7 Posted : 1/28/2013 12:16:54 PM

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Thank you!
It worked.

I actually thought I failed the extraction because the resulting goo was yellow and not looking like much. I saw no crystals, and looked like yucky sodium carbonate. But I redesolved it anyway and infused some caapi powder with it. Strange, but it smells familiar...

I smoked about 60mg Changa. Wow! This resembled very closely the peak of my previous Ayahuasca experience. Short but timeless.

Yield about 1,40%

Looking forward to exploring this space.
Thank you for this beautiful natural tek!
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