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DMT crytals melting Options
 
havok
#1 Posted : 10/7/2008 11:34:15 PM
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ok noob swim did QT's tek

and when the naptha was evaporated in a glass pan SWIM got yellow oily subtance that just seemed to not want to fully dry out or turn into crystals.

So Swim did further pulls, mixing the warm naptha back into the pan, this time trying freeze precipitation.

white crystals then formed, naptha was poured off and saved, with the majority of the crystals in the pan

However in the following hours the crystals then melted back into the familiar light yellow goo (which a sample was smoked and was great)

tried again, adding even futher pulls, redissolving the goo, back in the freezer

this time yeilding MANY ever so slightly yellow crystals, very satisfied

But then over night again, they all melted into yellow goo.

WTF

What can I do?
 

Trippy glass for trippy people.
 
endlessness
#2 Posted : 10/7/2008 11:40:04 PM

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how did SWIY take them out of the freeze precipitating container?

seems to me that there are small amounts of solvent trapped with SWIY´s crystals, and when temperature goes up they start redissolving..

if you tell me what technique SWIY used for retrieving them out of the freeze precipitation container, then SWIM can suggest a different technique that SWIY could try and see if it helps
 
benzyme
#3 Posted : 10/7/2008 11:47:54 PM

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do crystals even stay crystallized at R.T.? Confused

was under the impression free base DMT doesn't stay crystallized at ambient temp. converted to a non-hygroscopic salt (i.e. dmt fumarate) will keep it in crystal form
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endlessness
#4 Posted : 10/7/2008 11:56:56 PM

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well yeah it does.. I mean.. SWIM has always kept DMT at room temperature and it keeps as such..

what would you suppose it turns into, benzyme, oil? or maybe powder, and powder is not considered ´crystal´ ?
 
havok
#5 Posted : 10/8/2008 12:34:07 AM
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endlessness wrote:
how did SWIY take them out of the freeze precipitating container?

seems to me that there are small amounts of solvent trapped with SWIY´s crystals, and when temperature goes up they start redissolving..

if you tell me what technique SWIY used for retrieving them out of the freeze precipitation container, then SWIM can suggest a different technique that SWIY could try and see if it helps



Well the first time SWIM tried freeze precip he poured off the naptha into a glass

the second time swim did the precip in a glass , and when he poured off the naptha into a glass he filtered it though a coffee filter as there were loose crystals. However , overnight the cyrstals dissolved into goo as well as the ones in the coffee filter. He took extra effort to try to drain off all the naptha possible. Yet overnight the majority turned into goo.

he is currently making efforts to redissolve the dmt in the filter into naptha, as well the glass.

he would be satified with crystals or powder.. just the yellow stuff didnt seem to dry even after three days sitting out, its so sticky it would be useless putting it into bags as so much would never be retrievable.

 
benzyme
#6 Posted : 10/8/2008 12:37:53 AM

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if it's impure, or course it'll be an oil.
if it's pure, resinous translucent crystals.
figured the intramolecular forces aren't significant enough in free base form to hold a rigid lattice structure at ambient temp Confused
"Nothing is true, everything is permitted." ~ hassan i sabbah
"Experiments are the only means of knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." -Max Planck
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endlessness
#7 Posted : 10/8/2008 1:25:46 AM

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havok wrote:
endlessness wrote:
how did SWIY take them out of the freeze precipitating container?

seems to me that there are small amounts of solvent trapped with SWIY´s crystals, and when temperature goes up they start redissolving..

if you tell me what technique SWIY used for retrieving them out of the freeze precipitation container, then SWIM can suggest a different technique that SWIY could try and see if it helps



Well the first time SWIM tried freeze precip he poured off the naptha into a glass

the second time swim did the precip in a glass , and when he poured off the naptha into a glass he filtered it though a coffee filter as there were loose crystals. However , overnight the cyrstals dissolved into goo as well as the ones in the coffee filter. He took extra effort to try to drain off all the naptha possible. Yet overnight the majority turned into goo.

he is currently making efforts to redissolve the dmt in the filter into naptha, as well the glass.

he would be satified with crystals or powder.. just the yellow stuff didnt seem to dry even after three days sitting out, its so sticky it would be useless putting it into bags as so much would never be retrievable.



might I ask what temperature is where SWIY is located?


there are at least 2 different ways SWIY can do to retrieve the crystals.. Freeze precipitate again, with minimum amount of solvent so its saturated.. Then after crystals formed, to take the naphtha out of the container (most dmt will be stuck to the sides), you can even pass this naphtha through a filter to make sure you catch the ones that are not stuck.. Then, you turn the container upside down on top of some filter (so that any solvent remaining between the crystals will drop away from the glass, not inside), but with some sort of support so that it is not fully turned down, but tilted, so it will have space for air to come in.. Then you turn on a fan, which will be facing the container, so that there is a big air circulation. Then the solvent should drop off and the crystals dry while stuck to the glass.. So hours after, you scrape them, they should be dry crystals which wont melt again. The way SWIY did, by just pouring off the naphtha and then leaving the container standing upright normally to dry, always goes bad for SWIM too.. The solvent trapped between the crystals start heating and melt the whole thing into a goo.. But doing as described above, it works for SWIM

Another possible thing to do is, after you pour off the naphtha, put the container upside down inside the fridge again, on top of some paper towel.. This will dry the crystals (this SWIM didnt try but a trustable person, entropymancer, mentioned this). He also mentioned that its important to use a freezer that has no food, as the solvent will be dropping away and you dont want any liquid or fumes to go to the food.




benzyme wrote:
if it's impure, or course it'll be an oil.
if it's pure, resinous translucent crystals.
figured the intramolecular forces aren't significant enough in free base form to hold a rigid lattice structure at ambient temp


well you know your stuff, I wont argue.. But from experience, SWIM has seen many many times DMT as crystal or powder at room temperature.. Normally it turns powdery in storage (excuse my ignorance, don´t know if powder is simply crystals broken up in small pieces or a different form altogether), but it definitely keeps solid.
 
benzyme
#8 Posted : 10/8/2008 1:30:07 AM

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really?
nah, that was just my impression.
I've rarely heard of free base staying crystalline. Confused SWIY must've had uberpure, dry stuff.
did SWIY convert it to a salt?
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Jorkest
#9 Posted : 10/8/2008 1:37:59 AM

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oh freebase can stay crystallized...its all in the rextalization....but what you CAN do...is get some sweet yellow impure crystals...and hold them in your hand for about awhile...and then it will melt into a puddle...then let it sit in a drawer for awhile..and it will solidify...then you will have super dense spice...all you need is that smallest little chunk...and BAM!
it's a sound
 
endlessness
#10 Posted : 10/8/2008 1:40:46 AM

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SWIM always keeps it as freebase

SWIM does recrystalize his stuff, so its pure white..

but SWIM remembers in his first extraction, when he just kept some of the later evaporated STB pulls, which were quite brownish, they still kept reasonably well, did not turn into an oil (they were mostly solid but sticky, bit oily.. sort of like.. hmmm.. dry-ish earwax or smt hahaha). and SWIM lives in a tropical country and just keeps it in his drawer
 
benzyme
#11 Posted : 10/8/2008 1:47:05 AM

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interesting
does SWIY typically do a/b or stb?

swim has yet to try stb
"Nothing is true, everything is permitted." ~ hassan i sabbah
"Experiments are the only means of knowledge at our disposal. The rest is poetry, imagination." -Max Planck
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endlessness
#12 Posted : 10/8/2008 1:56:04 AM

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SWIM usually does STB with sodium carbonate wash and at least one recrystalization.. and always freeze precipitation of course, never evapping..

SWIM is gonna attempt in 2 weeks to make a side-by-side comparison between an glacial acetic acid A/B and a STB, with exact same amounts and products, see how that goes..
 
stoneyone
#13 Posted : 10/15/2008 1:43:55 PM

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yA swim had the same problem. swim did the lazyman tek but with a freeze precipitaion and lots of litte crystls would form in thejars but when swim takes em out to dry the turn to yellow goo.so what swim has been doing and its been workin real well is after takin the spice out ofthe jar spread them on a plate nice thinlayer and then it seems to melt but after a few hours it drys up and swim can scrape it up and then it holds its form ar room temp. is this a common way to do it?
 
Jorkest
#14 Posted : 10/15/2008 2:18:42 PM

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one thing you want to make sure of....is when you pull it out of the freezer...you want to pour off the solvent...and then CLOSE THE JAR IMMEDIATELY!!! the reason for this is because cold anything..will draw water to it..and make the water condense on the glass..and then you will have water in your spice...

so after you close the jar...turn it upside down..so any residual solvent will run to the bottom..and once the jar is up to room temp...open the jar and keep it upside down and wait for the rest of the solvent to evap..

this is a major problem SWIM sees many people doing wrong...you dont want water in your spice...because it takes forever to evaporate...

so pour off the solvent so that it doesnt reabsorb the spice while the jar warms up to room temp
it's a sound
 
Jorkest
#15 Posted : 10/15/2008 2:23:13 PM

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stoneyone wrote:
yA swim had the same problem. swim did the lazyman tek but with a freeze precipitaion and lots of litte crystls would form in thejars but when swim takes em out to dry the turn to yellow goo.so what swim has been doing and its been workin real well is after takin the spice out ofthe jar spread them on a plate nice thinlayer and then it seems to melt but after a few hours it drys up and swim can scrape it up and then it holds its form ar room temp. is this a common way to do it?



actually SWIM does something similar to this...except with a twist...he puts all the crystals on the flat piece of glass and spreads them out..and then drips solvent on them until it becomes a paste...he then spreads it all out and puts a little computer fan blowing air over the paste

what the solvent does is break down the crystalline structure..and forms a hard layer of spice...what you then want to do...is get a razor blade and scape it up after it is all dry...shouldnt take long...what you then have is a super fine white powder..that is also VERY dense...this helps with dosing because you dont need the same volume of spice to break through...all you need is a couple little scoops...


and SWIM never has any problem with melting..ever...even in the hot parts of the summer...at like 85 degrees...the spice is still powder
it's a sound
 
667
#16 Posted : 5/1/2011 10:29:16 AM

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SWIM keeps having the same problem and no matter what SWIM does the crystals metls.

SWIM is using q21q21's tek 2, everything goes well until SWIM takes the container out of the freezer and everthing melts within a minute or two. Already 3-4 extractions were tried with rather small amounts of MHRB(10-30g).

SWIM tried letting all of the naphtha evaporate in the freezer then taking the container out normaly to let the crystals dry, also tried with a closed container so water won't be drawned, upside down container... Still no sucess. Crying or very sad

SWIM is using a heavy glass container which does condense quite a lot so maybe that doesn't help.




 
endlessness
#17 Posted : 5/1/2011 12:01:58 PM

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Hey!

Weird that the 'upside down' trick doesnt work! Maybe the fact that its so little MHRB and therefore little crystals makes it more prone to melting?

What if you use a bit of naphtha or ethanol or IPA or acetone to redissolve it, and then re-evaporate in a wide container ?
 
psylover101
#18 Posted : 5/1/2011 3:00:10 PM

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Hello SWIM uses a tek like this one https://www.dmt-nexus.me...aspx?g=posts&t=1266
to get glass like crystals. SWIM has been doing this for years and as never had any problemsSmile


peace
 
flowersniffer
#19 Posted : 3/18/2012 3:11:39 AM

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I'm also having the melting crystals problem! I've read the above thread and am not sure how to proceed...My spice now looks like this...
flowersniffer attached the following image(s):
oil.jpg (478kb) downloaded 1,066 time(s).
 
flowersniffer
#20 Posted : 3/18/2012 3:19:57 AM

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My thoughts are that I can either ,

a) dissolve again in naptha and when it's re crystallized pour off the naptha and leave the shot glass upside down on a plate in the freezer for all solvent to run off, then take it out and hope it doesn't all melt again?

b) stick it back into the freezer as is, to see if the cold temp will turn the oil back into a solid, then scrape it out onto a pyrex dish, chop it up with a blade and let it dry out?

c) Dissolve again in Naptha (or IPA) and pour it onto a pyrex dish and evap?

d) Dissolve in IPA and evap onto some herb? This would probably be the easiest option, but for my first spice experience I'd like to be able to weigh my dose...

Any help, much appreciated Smile

Flowersniffer
 
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