Here's a question about the etiquette of sharing, energy, and intentions.

I usually split my collected fumarates into two separate batches of changa whenever I make it. I split the batches into two completely separate dishes, so the only thing they ever share is energy and the same shelf on the dehydrator--zero cross-contamination.

One time, I split a batch this way: 50% tried and true recipe that I know and love and is full of success, and 50% normal recipe + .3g of 10:1 Caapi extract.

When I tried the experimental batch with the extract, Aya was absolutely furious that I burned her bark, and I suffered, rolling around on the floor with tremors and clenching into various catatonic positions. My chest felt heavy and I felt poisoned. Unlike the normal 20 minutes, this abject suffering also ensued for 3+ hours. I was unmistakeably yanked into "FIERCE" Ayahuasca territory and she schooled me so hard for messing with the extract.

Anyway, because that experience was so rough, I've been quite terrified to smoke the sister batch. The other batch contains ONLY the Caapi leaf, ZERO of the extract that caused the problems. I smoked the sister batch once, and it was the usual, beautiful, loving, recalibrating embrace of Goddess that I am normally blessed with.

It sounds very superstitious, but I am basically scared shitless to smoke any more of the good half of this particular batch because of what happened with its twin. It is technically, rationally, logically, perfectly sound changa.

Here is my question. Would it be wrong to give this changa to a friend? It would be given with full disclosure of its history (associated sister batch), and lots of prayers. It would not be given with the intent of just pawning it off on somebody--that seems like BAAAAAD juju--but I'd hate to see it go to waste. The part of my soul that spent 200 hours crafting it knows it is beautiful and deserves a home. It is still perfectly good and safe changa.

But, it is also something that I know my "rational" mind will grab onto during a launch and possibly send me into a panic attack, because my mind has the two energies associated.

God knows I've had enough problems with panic attacks. My unexpected trip down barley lane has definitely thrown a wrench into my normal "letting go" mechanism. Even if this trigger is purely psychological, I have to smoke a new, clean batch from a clean pipe and make sure there is nothing for me to freak out about. I am aware this sounds a bit neurotic.

I have basically become so sensitized to Caapi that I had to weed stimulants from my diet completely. Literally a homeopathic dose of any stimulant--even a bite of cacao--will flip me into a panic attack late at night. I've had a few really terrifying incidents, all unexpected, before I finally figured out what was going on with my body. Stimulants + MAOI = BAD BAD BAD BAD BAD BAD BAD BAD. Even though I used to tolerate things like Cacao perfectly fine... It took me a while to gain my trust back with Ayahuasca, even after I had weeded out the stimulants, because the experience was so gripping. The bad changa experience also went down in the midst of all these panic attacks, and because my mind has developed such a powerful aversion to anything that was a negative trigger in that period of time, I just. can't. smoke. this. particular. batch.

(Otherwise, I have completely recovered, everything else is fine. I'm integrating, my journeys are smooth, everything is back on track. )

So, this whole batch is out, unsmokeable, for reasons of pure ego psychology. The ill-prepared half of the batch is stored to be buried.

Would it be wrong to try and find the good half of batch a loving home it deserves?

Well, if you arent happy with the blend would you be happy passing it on to someone else? Maybe the Changa treats them the same way it treated you.

But, you are very sensitive to the vine, is this person also as sensitive as you? If you do go ahead and pass it on, be sure to be there for the first blastoff, just to help out if they get the same punishment you did.

Personaly I wouldnt give anyone anything that I wasnt 100% happy with.

I agree with gammagore regarding sharing things we're not happy with. The clean batch you enjoyed once though, that sounds like a fine gift. Stay for company, like gamma suggested, just to assuage your conscience?

this "bad batch" did you only try it once? Perhaps it was a fluke occurance triggered by some unknown variable. I would share it with somebody without planting the seed in their head that it could be horrible. That thought in their head could give them doubt and ruin what could have been great. I say take it slow and give it another shot. Bad trips happen. I happen to love 10x vine extract in changa. Just remember a little seed of doubt can grow into a full blown horror show but its up to you to feed its growth. -goodluck

I wouldnae let the heebie jeebies put you off lassie

I know you're a seasoned explorer of these realms, so it must have been a grandesque kicking you received in there. Why not go forth and address this straight up... face the fear, you know this though!

best wishes

Sorry, just to be clear, the experimental batch is not to be shared and will be buried. I would NEVER give ANYONE anything that didn't agree with me 111%!!!

The non-experimental batch, that I HAVE TRIED and IS fine is the one that I was thinking about sharing. I'm just irrationally afraid to smoke it because I made it at the same time as the other one (they were kept completely separate).

^^I guess I could have summed that initial post up in three sentences.

I don't know, I have really mixed feelings about it. Maybe I will either try to obliterate my irrational fears with a few positive blastoffs, smoke it (and then share it) with a sitter/friend... or just do away with it. I'm only irrationally afraid at the moment because I had this changa misfire in the midst of a lot of other bad experiences, so the part of me that jitters when I try to light the pipe is linking all of these experiences together (rational and irrational), even if it's only to smoke the non-experimental batch. Maybe I should pray over it and then smoke it myself... my mind goes in circles.

Well. I will let you know what I decide to do and how it goes. Hopefully I shall return with ecstatic journey reports.

There is a part of me that feels better just to voice the fact, wow, I did have the living daylight scared out of me...

And thank you, everyone, just for the words of strength. It does sound a bit silly.

No it sounds to me more like you're exceptionally respectful, wow! And my .02; if you let them know the history of it and why you don't want to use it, it seems to me that it would be "good karma" or at the very least "neutral karma" to share the clean batch; as long as your lucky friend is in the know, I think you're in the clear as far as juju goes. Oh yeah, and thanks for sharing your journeys.

Share away, I say. As long as you do so with full disclosure (which I know you always would), where's the possible harm? Why test yourself with something that has been somehow tainted for you personally? By the same token, why not share something you logically know is tried and true?

You show a great deal of respect, I think, by even asking the question - but you're good to go, as far as I'm concerned. Go forth and set free a new brain.

Caapi extracts added to changa always add ALOT more for me and alot of similar effects that you speak of. The body load is very veryyy heavy for me and its almost unbearable til I hit that point where mind seperates. n' intergrates.

Compared to past batches of changa whenever i've added caapi extract of any kind it's always been a doozy for me. Seemingly night n day from other batches w/o it.

If you know of any other experienced psychonauts, i'd say go for it!! As long as the cautions are explained I dont see a problem then.

Thanks, everyone. I have concluded to share the batch with a friend--partake together, me first, just to feel it out again--and when all is well , friend may take the extras if interested.

I don't know if I have the guff to meet with this batch alone, again, but a simple hand on the shoulder to ground goes such a long way, and it will be good to know that option is available if I need it.

I think I will feel best if I can kind of put an energy of release into that batch ceremonially, clear myself with the spirit and then make the parting. A "passing of the torch" ritual, so to speak.

--A bit about the bad experience--

What I didn't like about mixing the vine extract with regular changa (full spectrum Mimosa on Caapi leaf) was the feelings of tension in the chest and mental stimulation it produced. With all of my experience with oral Ayahuasca, I have NEVER experienced ANYTHING like this and to such a degree, so that was also alarming. Bear in mind, I am extremely sensitive, and was fully MAO inhibited for probably at least a week straight, microdosing on Caapi tea, prior to this event. I possibly overloaded on harmalas, to boot.

Failure #1: failure of preparation. After the first few inhales of the extract-enhanced batch, I got the feeling that Ayahuasca did NOT want me to take her this way. The first launch was cool, of normal duration, minus feelings of cold, tremors, and nausea--all of which was NORMAL had I taken the vine orally. I should have stopped here.

Failure #2: failure to listen to instruction. I had the distinct feeling that I would never smoke this batch again, something was burning and something was WRONG, but I persisted in smoking. The second launch lasted over three hours. The headspace turned immediately negative, it was a spanking.

Failure #3: failure of preparation. I got the feeling Aya was furious that electronics were still plugged in--I have received EXPLICIT instruction from her in the past not to have any digital music present. Music is normally fine for changa, however, but it seems The Mother wants silence when I meet with purely her. This is otherworldly, BUT, I have done Ayahuasca ceremonies with multiple people where electronics have repeatedly short-circuited, and upon persisting at trying to make them work, doors in the house slammed continuously until I shut everything off. I should have, perhaps, treated this extract-enhanced voyage as a full-blown Ayahuasca ceremony, rather than a changa ceremony. But I didn't.

The experience was nothing visionary. The mood turned ominous, I lit a few candles, ripped all the lights from the wall, and my body grew very hot. There was an alarming tension in my chest and it became difficult to breathe. Tremors intensified.

I felt wired and uneasy, extremely stimulated. I only experienced this once before, early in the days of my experimenting with Ayahuasca, when I overdosed on Mimosa relative to the amount of vine present. This resulted in a restless, constant panic with anxiety. Not even walking would slow my mind. Coupled with the unrelenting tension in my chest, this turned into a huge challenge.

I tried breathing, tried telling myself that at least this was shorter than a full-blown tea ceremony, etc., etc.

This was the first time ever I had to phone someone during a ceremony. My phone line was disconnected.

After an 1-1.5 hours, I finally got a dial tone. I called all of my friends and none of them were available. One girl, I phone three times. She showed me her caller ID the next day, and at the times I called, it listed a different phone number--it showed up on her phone as a guy she was avoiding, and hence, did not answer my calls.

Very very weird and very very scary.

I am all for being psychologically freaked out, allowing my mind to disintegrate, travel to the underworld, etc.--but part of the reason I surrender so easily is because, with Ayahuasca, I KNOW my physical body is safe. This was also a new chemistry experiment (cheers to my chemistry skills...), and I DIDN'T know if I was safe. I DIDN'T know if what was happening in my chest was normal, but it felt GOD AWFUL. The instruction I received was, "WRONG, WRONG, WRONG!" Coupled with idiotic persistence in smoking and bad setup (should have prepared like it was an Aya ceremony), it was a disaster come full circle.

I worked up the guts to smoke alone once since then, and it was not a full breakthrough. This was with the non-enhanced batch that I am going to pass on. I started with microdoses, and worked myself up to a moderate breakthrough, where I felt Goddess hovering above me, and performing energetic calibrations on my body. It was gentle, blissful, loving, good old fashioned changa like I always make it. I tried to smoke it again at another point, but my mind ran amok and kept trying to convince me it was the other batch, even though I KNEW it wasn't, but it's not the kind of mind tricks I want to have to battle while breaking through, all alone (in a house where if I scream, the neighbors WILL hear me).

So, now that I have a new batch that involved no extract, AND cleaned my pipe, my mind cannot play this trick on me. The changa is good. The monkey mind is a ridiculous thing.

Anyway, thanks for letting me share. That was that!

Oh yeah: SET AND SETTING. ASSUME NOTHING... *especially* with new experiments. Even what you assume may be okay or respectful could be wrong.

What is your normal batch exactly? Are you putting 50% by weight of spice into caapi leaf for the normal batch? I am considering making a changa with mullein, caapi copy, and white dmt. I am curious what proportions you are using exactly. I would rather not use too much of the caapi copy so that I don't get a pounding like you are describing.

Normal recipe is 1:1 spice:herb by weight, spice being full spectrum mimosa, herb being 75-80% white Caapi leaf, and 20-25% other herbs, like lotus/calea/peppermint, rose/hibiscus/lavender. This WITHOUT any extracts is a perfect recipe!