And if so, how would you say that the experience compares to mushrooms?

I have only experienced the fungi, personally. I have heard both sides of this argument with some saying that there is a big difference and others saying that there is none at all. I'm inclined to think that there must be some difference. Even if neither baeocystin and norbaeocystin or their dephosphorylated derivatives have direct psychedelic properties, I find it pretty hard to believe that they would have no pharmacological properties whatsoever, especially considering that they are technically even more similar in structure to serotonin than psilocybin and psilocin are, respectively.

The biggest differences that I have ever heard people describe between pure psilocin and mushrooms as well happens to be that the former is much more lucid and controllable, and possibly more visual as well. I cannot speak for this last part, but I can say that every synthetic 4-substituted tryptamine that I've tried, including some like 4-HO-MET which are pretty darn close in structure to psilocin, has been remarkably lucid and manageable, while mushrooms on the other hand have consistently given me the most powerful mind warping of any psychedelic I've used. This just gives me more reason to think that the two experiences might indeed be quite different.

Of course, this question will never be truly answered for myself until I have the chance to weigh the two types of trips myself, but it doesn't hurt to ask for outside opinions as well, right? So, have you ever gotten to try psilocin by itself?

I don't know of anyone who's tried pure psilocin. basic extractions never yield it, and its synthesis is no simple task. 4-AcO-DMT
is reportedly the pro-drug.

I'm unsure if O-Acetylpsilocin fits under this section, however it is well known to convert into psilocin.. making it pure psilocin within the body. This is only still theorized and may have actions dependent on its own.

Ime, it is clearer, smoother and typically more enjoyable physically speaking than that of mushrooms.

Yes, unfortunately I'm not expecting many people to have had the chance.... I do know someone who has obtained some before, but only used it rarely in combinations and is still saving the rest. There was some that managed to slip out from the research chemical market somehow within the past few years, but I'm not sure how long that was really around for and if many people got hold of it. However, I know some have to have.... At the very least, I do intend to find some myself one day despite the obstacles!

I do believe that 4-AcO-DMT is a prodrug, but I have used it before and I don't believe that to be all it is. I will elaborate on this below the following quote.


I am almost certain that the O-acetyl tryptamines metabolize into their 4-hydroxy counterparts once in the body, but I am almost certain that they have effects of their own as well. While not being able to speak for psilocin, what I can say is that I have used both 4-HO-MET and 4-AcO-MET to be markedly different, and I have used 4-HO-MET at both lower and higher doses than I have used 4-AcO-MET. I actually found qualities shared by both 4-AcO-MET and 4-AcO-DMT which I have never noticed on mushrooms or any synthetic 4-hydroxy tryptamine before, and I have heard many others repeat this sentiment.

I can say though that there was a delayed part of the experience where it suddenly felt like there may have been influence by 4-HO-MET produced by metabolism, and this delayed response was something I noticed in 4-AcO-DMT for mushroom-like effects as well. But, the effect was similar to mushrooms except that I felt downright sober in the mind and body, except for a very positive energy. I agree that it was much easier to cleaner trip than mushrooms is essentially every way. So, I suppose that could still say something about this. Once I have tried 4-AcO-DiPT and 4-AcO-DET as well which I intend to before too long, I'll feel even more confident in making these kinds of comparisons.

One thing I can say at the moment though is that while 4-AcO-DMT was indeed smoother than mushrooms, I feel that psilocin would probably be even smoother than 4-AcO-DMT, as this is undoubtedly the case for me when transitioning from 4-AcO-MET to 4-HO-MET for reasons that I have observed on the 4-AcO-DMT as well. If it means anything, I was able to find one trip report by an author with a fairly decent amount of experience with different psychedelics who claimed that pure psilocin was much better than either mushrooms or 4-AcO-DMT for him. Make of that what you will.

I'd also like to share that although 4-Acetoxy-DMT shares similarities with other drugs, as well as psychological and emotional effects of mushrooms, it certainly contains a vast network of subjectively different effects than that of mushrooms.. or other tryptamines.

4-Acetoxy-DMT is also very DMT-like and is compared as such in terms of effects.. this I can firmly justify.

I'll back that up as well. I actually have found 4-AcO-DMT to be the most similar drug to DMT for me so far, especially at the onset, though still with some of the flavor of psilocin. 4-AcO-MET was actually more like DMT than any 4-hydroxy tryptamine I've tried as well, though in a more synthetic way than 4-AcO-DMT. Just another reason that I'm even more excited to try out other acetylated tryptamines!

Yes! Quite exciting.. I am preparing for another trip this weekend with 4-Ace in knowing all will be well at 20mg. My last experience with 15mg was amazing.. quite a breakthrough of kinds.. very eager to plop myself within there again.

I had a buddy that claimed to have pure psilocin, although i never tried it myself nearly everyone one I know did. Ill try to get some reports but sadly most of my friends dont really question the deeper side of things, its just one trip to the next for them.Some of my friends were even doing big lines of it and probably having amazing experiences, but only in preperation to go party at a festival I never saw it get tested but apparently it did test positive for psilocin but we'll never know.
My reason for not trying them is that my buddy would make cook the psilocin into "Mushroom" chocolates, but hearing that he was drunk and eyeballing doses I never wanted any of it, if i had control over dosage or the substance myself it would be a different story.IMO on a spiritual level I would just imagine that the pure substance lacks the "spirit" of the mushroom, which can mean alot of things, or nothing, to some people. Thats another big reason for me not wanting to try it.

I'm sure someone here can dismiss this theory with proper chemistry knowlege but there is speculation that the lemon tek will dephosphorylate psilocybin to psilocin. That may not be the case, but ime when you lemon tek the medicine hits really really fast and really hard, bowls you over like a freight train, leaves you giggling on the floor, and is completely gone in the space of about 2 hours. Very DMTesque in it's presentation. This does seem to vibe more with the action of psilocin than the slow onset and rather prolonged effects of eating the mushrooms or a simple tea which seems to fall somewhere in between the two.

Isn't psilocybin readily dephosphorylated into psilocin in the body just like 4-aco-dmt and O-Acetylpsilocin anyway? I also suspect these compounds have some effect on their own, or create active metabolites that would not be experienced with pure psilocin ingestion.

Isn't psilocin remarkably unstable? Wouldn't it need to be held in some sort of solution to prevent oxidation and degradation? I question whether pure psilocin would be stable enough to make it around rc markets and be put in chocolates and the like, perhaps psilocybin would be stable enough for such things, but I was under the impression psilocin was not?

I think everyone who's ever taken shrooms has experienced pure psilocin. Psilocybin is de-phosphorylated during first-pass metabolism. I don't think psilocybin itself can get across the BBB -- it's too water soluble and I seem to recall reading that zwitterions aren't great at distributing into the brain.

I think the thing that makes the lemon tek such a rush is that, there's no extended period of de-phosphorylation, since it'll all be converted, you get a big rush of psilocin, instead of a gradual release of psilocin as it's metabolically converted from psilocybin.

Someone with a great knowledge of biochemistry might be able to weigh in on this more
~ND

I have never ever experienced a lemon tek tea only lasting 2 hours..4-6 hours is common for me..sometimes it does not fully hit me until the 2 hour mark.

There is more in mushrooms than just psilocybin or psilocin, so taking mushrooms does not = pure psilocin.

I’ve had pure psilocybin on 2 occasions – 25mg each time.
Unfortunately, I’ve never had mushrooms, so I can’t compare the two.

My two experiences were very similar to pharma experiences I’ve had, except without any nausea and with fewer/less intense visuals. Intensely emotional and introspective (in a positive way).

They were both very positive, life-affirming experiences.

(Lasted 5+ hours.)

You have never had mushrooms but you where able to get hold of pure psilocybin!

Usualy it would be the other way round


Peace

Are the other trypatmines (baeostycin, etc) determined to be psychoactive? I thought the jury was still out on that.

Blessings
~ND

depends who you talk to I guess.

John Allen(I think) and other researches tested baeocystin long ago and claimed it was an active psychedelic. Why wouldn't they be active? NMT is active...

"Little information exists with regard to human pharmacology, but in the book Magic Mushrooms Around the World, author Jochen Gartz reports being aware of a study in which "10 mg of baeocystin were found to be about as psychoactive as a similar amount of psilocybin."[citation needed] Gartz also reported in a research paper that a self-administered assay of 4 mg of baeocystin caused "a gentle hallucinogenic experience".[5]"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baeocystin

That's interesting, sounds like a nice experience. I wonder what harmalas might lend to the experience?

Bit of an old post I'm unearthing here, but better that than start a new one I thought.

Earlier today I sampled 30mg of pure synthetic lab made psilocin fumarate. This was a powerful dose more than enough to produce powerful psychedelic effects, and it was a beautiful experience. While it obviously induced a state very similar to the bemushroomed one, I definitely felt it to be slightly different to mushrooms...the psychedelic visuals were in some way slightly muted I found...the experience with mushrooms I find to be in some way richer, fuller, more lively and voluptuous and to have more energy and sparkle. It's hard to describe in words. It felt like there was a hint of sterility to the experience, compared with mushrooms. I'm trying to be as objective as I can when I describe this (I certainly don't have an organic vs synthetic agenda or axe to grind), but bear in mind this is highly subjective terrain, and just my individual take, and so should be taken with a pinch of salt. With that said, I prefer the state mushrooms induce, and I definitely feel that secondary metabolites in mushrooms have an effect on the experience they produce, and this is what gives rise to the perceived experiential qualitative differences people commonly report in association with different species. All my experiences with Panaeolus cyanescens were far more colourful and light filled than this pure chemical, which is interesting, and is suggestive to me at least that other compounds in the mushroom modulate the psilocin experience they produce to some degree. I had a prior experience with 15mg psilocin, but wanted to have a deeper high dose experience before giving my verdict on it. Would be good to see more research on the biochemical make-up of the various psilocybin mushroom species.