We've Moved! Visit our NEW FORUM to join the latest discussions. This is an archive of our previous conversations...

You can find the login page for the old forum here.
CHATPRIVACYDONATELOGINREGISTER
DMT-Nexus
FAQWIKIHEALTH & SAFETYARTATTITUDEACTIVE TOPICS
PREV12
No One Cares What Drug Users Think -- An important discussion Options
 
Entropymancer
#21 Posted : 3/9/2011 7:18:16 PM

DMT-Nexus member

Salvia divinorum expert | Skills: Information Location, Salvia divinorumExtraordinary knowledge | Skills: Information Location, Salvia divinorumModerator | Skills: Information Location, Salvia divinorumChemical expert | Skills: Information Location, Salvia divinorumSenior Member | Skills: Information Location, Salvia divinorum

Posts: 1367
Joined: 19-Feb-2008
Last visit: 12-Jun-2016
Location: Pacific Northwest
FastFourierT wrote:
"No One Cares What Drug Users Think"

Its better for me.


Why is that better for you?
 

Good quality Syrian rue (Peganum harmala) for an incredible price!
 
Enoon
#22 Posted : 3/9/2011 7:32:10 PM

DMT-Nexus member

Moderator | Skills: Harm reduction, Analytical thinking

Posts: 1955
Joined: 24-Jul-2010
Last visit: 29-Oct-2019
EquaL Observer wrote:
I see many people standing at the entrance to my university with stalls and pamphlets about various religions, alcohol awareness, mental health & well-being groups, fair-trade groups etc. I'm planning to start an initiative... a philosophical initiative inspiring looking at the world differently. A part of it will be to raise awareness (non-bias information) of entheogens. If muslims can peddle their ideologies at the entrance to education centres then so can I.

As soon as you say something is controversial you imply that you 'know it is bad' in some way. No tolerance to ignorance. I'm going to ease it in, no persuasion...

Care to elaborate on your technique? Would be interested in what you are planning to say/write and how you will go about *easing in*. Great idea though. Three thumbs up for your initiative!

cheers & love
Enoon
Buon viso a cattivo gioco!
---
The Open Hyperspace Traveler Handbook - A handbook for the safe and responsible use of entheogens.
---
mushroom-grow-help ::: energy conserving caapi extraction
 
EquaL Observer
#23 Posted : 3/10/2011 8:12:06 PM

Ross


Posts: 267
Joined: 22-Oct-2010
Last visit: 16-Oct-2012
Location: Scotland
Going to start some graphic design and check out the best ways to make some glossy pamphlets. It seems as if the best way to win hearts is through media these days - and high quality media is becoming easier and easier to create. But I'm not sure yet altogether - collecting quotes and coming up with simple sentences which inherently make sense when thought about. Creative and informative pamphlets and general creativeness - I reckon it's as simple as saying what I think about the world. I'll see if the university will support my new-found spiritual, non-trepeneurial, philosophical, linguistic excitement.

Comes back to that McKenna quote "If the truth can be told so as to be understood, it will be believed."

If nothing else it will serve as a creative outlet. My main aim is to simply help people unlearn things. Ideology being understood is one massive step towards new-thought. Without being pushy, but just being myself I think I can have fun with it - maybe give out damiana and passionflower tea.

It seems as if culture is changing by itself. I believe that unconscious manifestations of future society are present in our media outlets, retail and general environment. Critical works of philosophy and hardcore academia probably won't lead the way to the future right now - it will be simple and natural cultural evolution. We're probably lucky that we're around at what could very well be the beginning of the best times in history in many thousand years. All the potential for a new era is here now - just waiting to be manifested.

Today I learned in Psychology that it's only been in the past decade or so that the importance of 'well-being' over economic position has been realised by the government... we have far to swim.

If asked how I plead I will say 'not immoral'.
Your depth is your integrity
 
SKA
#24 Posted : 3/15/2011 1:57:21 AM
DMT-Nexus member


Posts: 1104
Joined: 17-May-2009
Last visit: 18-Jul-2023
If CEL could educate the public the scientific side of Entheogens this could dissolve alot of ignorance and unnececairy fear or carelessness.
Showing the public how physically harmless and non-addictive the various Entheogenic compounds are with cold, hard facts.

CEL should defenitely also educate the public on the great benefits of Entheogen use. And in doing so CEL should not fear being at least a little spiritual.
If CEL is ever to become an organisation/foundation who's (worldwide)members can participate in Responsible Entheogenesis practices while being immune to anti-drug legal persecution, I think it at least owes the public and those that press the laws uppon us a good explanation as to what exactly we're doing.

I think we Nexians should put our heads together and see if we can create a "model for responsible entheogenesis" of sorts.
Simply because there is a Law on Religious Freedom, and because it's been done succesfully before by different groups, I still think CEL should follow these groups in using the "drunk", sacraligious approach.

For me there's nothing "drunk" about Plant Teachers that help Humans evolve their consciousness.
I really do regard Entheogenic plants to be Spiritual Teachers of an infinitely greater intelligence than our own.
In what they enable me to do, I strongly feel they have a certain sacred value.
I know quite a number of Nexians share this view with me. I also know quite a number don't share this view at all.
But if those who didn't share this view, would officially state they share this view, we could gather a large group of people who hold Entheogens dear.
If we write down an official manifesto of this view, as being a religious ideology and, once we have enough members we will pronounce ourselves an official new religion.
I've no idea how you get official recognition as a religion. But that's what would have to happen.

Defenitely in our manifesto should be:
-The right to posses, grow & consume everything mother nature gives.
-The right to explore one's own consciousness.
And whatnot. Also note how Religious organisations own big buildings as temples. Somehow they must have easy access to such buildings. I've heard that Krishna people own

I think wrapping CEL in a sacraligious costume would give it most chance of succeeding in legally protecting psychonaughts.
I don't know if the Scientific community can help CEL protect psychonaughts from legal persecution.
So much introspective, healing, creativity inspiring, therapuitical properties have been proven with the use of LSD, Ayahuasca, Iboga, Psilocybe Mushrooms, Peyote and the like by Therapists, Rehab clinics & Scientists. It did for a while bloom, Psychedelic psychotherapy and addiction cessation, but then it was opressed again.
Can the scientific community dare go to the frontier of Psychotherapy with Entheogens again?

The "Drunk" approach might just succeed in making CEL members, nexians and other psychonaughts, around the world able to practice entheogenesis free from legal persecution.
Can the scientific community help CEL to make this freedom available for large groups of psychonaughts worldwide?
 
Enoon
#25 Posted : 3/15/2011 6:30:04 AM

DMT-Nexus member

Moderator | Skills: Harm reduction, Analytical thinking

Posts: 1955
Joined: 24-Jul-2010
Last visit: 29-Oct-2019
I'm sorry, I'm a bit hazy on what *the drunk approach* means. I thought this had to do with introducing wacky theories about aliens, hyperspace and what ever other craziness one could think of (or has experienced), wrap it up in a comprehensive story, put in the positive message of love and sustainability and explain - the entheogens made you understand all this...

What you are talking about is the religious approach I thought.

Can someone clarify this for me?
Thanks
Buon viso a cattivo gioco!
---
The Open Hyperspace Traveler Handbook - A handbook for the safe and responsible use of entheogens.
---
mushroom-grow-help ::: energy conserving caapi extraction
 
EquaL Observer
#26 Posted : 3/16/2011 1:53:39 PM

Ross


Posts: 267
Joined: 22-Oct-2010
Last visit: 16-Oct-2012
Location: Scotland
I see no point in knit-picking. It only creates confusion. Give the public the knowledge of the wide ranging beliefs which come from psychedelic plant users - definitives and absolutes are surely what we wish to break down... we don't want to just put up new ones.

The fact that the plants can teach an individual how to look after their body and how to be happy whilst still knowledgeable, giving us the eyes to see through the illusions which others can not. And how they very much rid a person of their preconceptions to to allow rapid reprogramming thus allow one to become a more reasonable person. More reasonable in-fact than our neurosis-inflicted society could ever hope to make us.

Make leaflets - link to the coalition website (though it really needs done up). And I think it's not just about the plants - it's about the breakdown of economic worshipping which humanity has declined too.

Many of us have a yearning for the world to learn of these plants - not just so we feel more accepted - but so that others can reap the same benefits they do not know of and in many cases, do not care to know of!

Knit picking goes no where. Visualize the outcome of the task at hand and then the beginning is easy.
Your depth is your integrity
 
shoe
#27 Posted : 3/17/2011 1:38:33 PM

DMT-Nexus member

New member

Posts: 1689
Joined: 18-Jan-2008
Last visit: 18-Apr-2015
Equal Observer: one rediculous thing about well-being is that too many people handing out fliers to raise awareness in the world, *IS* a state of ill-health. As always, it's about balance, and I don't just mean stand on one leg and balance, I mean balance of power, balance of creation and destruction, balance in the universal cosmic forces. Balance of giant astral structures. We do need to allow, in our society, people to be grumpy. We need to allow people their own free choice, and we need to allow them to choose what way they want to be. We always have a choice how we will be.

@Acolyite: Thanks for the magnificent post, as i'm sure you're aware the blanket term 'drugs' also blends into those actively seeking spirituality & religion, which is responsible for many things from war to peace to war again. this is part of the problem. Many people enjoy actively seeking religious extacy, and those people are far different from those pressured into drug-use by social situation or political circumstance(?) lol. Anyway, I just wanted to say thanks for work, and point you to http://www.maps.org.uk.
shoe

ॐ भूर्भुव: स्व: तत्सवितुर्वरेण्यं । भर्गो देवस्य धीमहि, धीयो यो न: प्रचोदयात्
Love, Gratittude, Compassion, Fearlessness!
 
SKA
#28 Posted : 3/17/2011 9:00:20 PM
DMT-Nexus member


Posts: 1104
Joined: 17-May-2009
Last visit: 18-Jul-2023
@shoe;
Handing out flyers is making information available without forcing it onto people. The government forcefully feeds lies and fear-myths about drugs to the public. If handing out flyers is a state of ill-health, then how do you suggest we go about dispelling the myths and lies, spreading the truth and making way for the freedom to explore one's own consciousness?

How free are people's choices if their choices are based on lies and propaganda, instead of truthfull information?
Handing out informational pamphlettes with links to the CEL-site is a kind, timid way of trying to wake people up from the lies they've been told and to learn the truth instead.
I think what could also help are Movies about Entheogenesis that become very populair and play in theatres all over the world. I thought the "Inside LSD" documentairy played on international TV by National Geographic was very helpfull too. We defenitely need more such documentairies played on such frequently watched channels such as National Geographic.
If you know other, more effective ways feel free to add ideas.

And then the freedom issue again:
As far as I'm concerned the Drunk approach has the most chance of succes when it comes to providing the freedom to explore/alter one's own consciousness.
We'd need to find the Lawbook's definition of an official Religion. We need to meet certain conditions to be recognised as a new, official Religion. That has to be checked out.
I believe we need some common ideology so we are to write some kind of manifesto/bible. Another condition is to have a certain number of members. I can't remember how much and where I read this.
I think it was in the Dutch online Lawbook. There are more conditions, but we're going to have to look into it. It's alot of organisation and administration work, but it's very well possible.

Our ideology doesn't have to be all wild about Aliens and UFOs and Elfs.
For me the clear basic defenition of Entheogenesis would be "revealing deeper layers of consciousness within oneself". Can everyone here subscribe to this view?
Then this Introspection can be used to Spiritually/Emotionally heal/enlighten/rejuvenate, Creatively inspire, improve social behaviour and bonding and whatnot.
Allthough each person may have different reasons and different intentions with this introspective Entheogenic state, if we can all agree on what Entheogenesis in essence is, we seem to have a foundation for a religious ideology. Our individual views, that may differ and even conflict should be left out of the "scripture" and only our shared beliefs should go in there.
Then we could have a "section" in which we state our shared beliefs, a la the 10 commandments, but different.
Including at least:
- The right to grow, possess and consume everything Nature has to offer.
- The right to explore one's own consciousness.

And maybe we won't have to add more to this list. This could very well succeed, if organised professionally enough.

This plan would be a "Drunk" approach". It's proven a succesful approach by UDV, Santo Daime, The Native american church and several other groups.
If, however, any of you think another, more precice and scientific approach could have equal or greater chance of success in providing the Freedom to perform Entheogenesis then please enlighten us.
 
EquaL Observer
#29 Posted : 3/17/2011 10:34:13 PM

Ross


Posts: 267
Joined: 22-Oct-2010
Last visit: 16-Oct-2012
Location: Scotland
Was reading about Carl Rogers and the humanistic approach today. We are partly human potentialists. I think approaching psychedelic research with the hypothesis of 'psychedelic plants under shamanic preparatory circumstances can be beneficial to human well-being in general'.

In my opinion and many others, these plants allow one to self-actualize, for many it is the first time they've felt the ability to self-actualize. In a perfect world self-actualization would be taught in schools as a fundamental subject. It is a basic principle we should set towards as a species - each of us should have the chance to fulfil ourself as much as possible. Sadly this is rare... very rare... and I want the future of humanity to experience this as the norm!

And handing out fliers is an epiphenomenon of our ill-health - and can indeed reverse the neurosis just as well as it can further it.
Your depth is your integrity
 
SKA
#30 Posted : 3/25/2011 10:58:49 PM
DMT-Nexus member


Posts: 1104
Joined: 17-May-2009
Last visit: 18-Jul-2023
So Equal Observer, any news on your pamphlet-distribution plan? Did you do it allready? And if so how did it go and how did people respond?
I'm very curious.
 
PREV12
 
Users browsing this forum
Guest

DMT-Nexus theme created by The Traveler
This page was generated in 0.040 seconds.