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how can swim get his spice to be pretty crystals? Options
 
Dwhitty76
#1 Posted : 6/23/2008 11:11:44 PM

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Het all,
swim is new to the world of dmt (he did his first mhrb a/b extraction 1 month ago).Swim just did his second extraction and on both occasions,although the end product was good and stong; it ends up as a white powder.As long as it does th job,he's happy. but seeing beautiful pictures of clear fluffy crystals, one has to wonder the artistry behind yielding such purty crystals.Can anyone shed some light on the technique used to get crystals?
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burnt
#2 Posted : 6/24/2008 8:48:48 AM

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recrystallize slowly.
 
69ron
#3 Posted : 6/25/2008 4:02:07 AM

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Crystallization techniques are pretty much the same no matter what you are crystallizing. Slow crystallization leads to larger crystals. Fast crystallization (also called precipitation) leads to very small crystals. The faster, the smaller.

Slowly evaporating the solvent to allow the crystals to grow very slowly works the best. But with DMT, this approach sometimes allows DMT N-Oxide to start forming if the solvent is exposed to open air, or especially if a fan is used.

Another option is to freeze precipitate the crystals for about 2 hours, then put in the refrigerator for about 1 hour, then freeze again, then frig again, etc. This constant altering of temperature causes the crystals to form and some to re-dissolve. Each time they re-dissolve and reform, they reform on the existing crystals instead of forming new crystals. This quickly produces large crystals. If done in an air tight container, the risk of forming DMT N-Oxide is minimal.

Another freeze precipitation option is to put the dissolved DMT in the naphtha/heptane into the freezer. Check on it every 15 minutes or so. As soon as it looks cloudy add a big piece of freezer cold DMT to it. This is called seeding. Put it in the freezer and leave it there. The piece of DMT you put in the container will have grown into a much larger crystal because the dissolved DMT will be attracted to it like little magnets. If you are lucky the next day you'll have a single large DMT crystal surrounded by a few powdery ones. This doesn’t always work that well.
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All my posts are hypothetical and for educational/entertainment purposes, and are not an endorsement of said activities. SWIM (a fictional character based on other people) either obtained a license for said activity, did said activity where it is legal to do so, or as in most cases the activity is completely fictional.
 
notapillow
#4 Posted : 7/18/2008 2:40:10 AM
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wow




seeding eh

sounds badass

so that meands tou have a plate with already semi larde crystals in the freezer waiting i would guess




all these methods are very interesting thank you



also i was unaware of the nesesity of covering your jars during the persipitation freeze prosses

thanks for the tip
 
Dwhitty76
#5 Posted : 7/18/2008 3:15:58 AM

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69ron wrote:
Crystallization techniques are pretty much the same no matter what you are crystallizing. Slow crystallization leads to larger crystals. Fast crystallization (also called precipitation) leads to very small crystals. The faster, the smaller.

Slowly evaporating the solvent to allow the crystals to grow very slowly works the best. But with DMT, this approach sometimes allows DMT N-Oxide to start forming if the solvent is exposed to open air, or especially if a fan is used.

Another option is to freeze precipitate the crystals for about 2 hours, then put in the refrigerator for about 1 hour, then freeze again, then frig again, etc. This constant altering of temperature causes the crystals to form and some to re-dissolve. Each time they re-dissolve and reform, they reform on the existing crystals instead of forming new crystals. This quickly produces large crystals. If done in an air tight container, the risk of forming DMT N-Oxide is minimal.

Another freeze precipitation option is to put the dissolved DMT in the naphtha/heptane into the freezer. Check on it every 15 minutes or so. As soon as it looks cloudy add a big piece of freezer cold DMT to it. This is called seeding. Put it in the freezer and leave it there. The piece of DMT you put in the container will have grown into a much larger crystal because the dissolved DMT will be attracted to it like little magnets. If you are lucky the next day you'll have a single large DMT crystal surrounded by a few powdery ones. This doesn’t always work that well.
" Freedom from the desire for an answer is essential to the understanding of a problem." - jiddu Krishnamurti
 
Dwhitty76
#6 Posted : 7/18/2008 3:23:27 AM

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please disregard that last post i didnt mean t copy or quote 69 whole post.
Thank yo 69 for you feedback. I HAVE MUCH TO LEARN
Slowly evaporating the solvent to allow the crystals to grow very slowly works the best. But with DMT, this approach sometimes allows DMT N-Oxide to start forming if the solvent is exposed to open air, or especially if a fan is used.
-69ron This is what swim has been doing and it works pretty well,so long you cover it w. cheasecloth,while its fanning and plastic wrap ,while in the frig.I would like to get some nice crystals,so i might try that frig to freez method. thanx


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69ron
#7 Posted : 7/18/2008 9:09:25 AM

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To make life really easy, get one of these MR138 digital cooler warmers for about $100 US:



With that you can slowly adjust the temperature from hot to cold over the course of a week. That will grow the best crystals possible without any contaminants. Put some naphtha or heptane in the cooler/warmer and set it to 120 F (48.8 C). Leave it for about 30 minutes. Once its nice and warm, you pour just enough naphtha on your spice to dissolve all of the spice and no more. Then put a cover over the dissolved spice and put it in the cooler/warmer on the warm setting of 120 F (48.8 C) and then slowly adjust it down to 39 F (3 C) over the course of a week and you'll have really beautiful large crystals!

SWIM would LOVE to get one of those but he doesn't have the space for it at the moment.
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All my posts are hypothetical and for educational/entertainment purposes, and are not an endorsement of said activities. SWIM (a fictional character based on other people) either obtained a license for said activity, did said activity where it is legal to do so, or as in most cases the activity is completely fictional.
 
Dwhitty76
#8 Posted : 7/19/2008 4:46:36 AM

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this device could take care of all your freezer needs and can adjust the temperature.I want one.They cant be much bigger that a microwave (i looked at some specs)
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69ron
#9 Posted : 7/20/2008 2:40:41 AM

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I want one too. As soon as I clear up a place to put it, I'm getting one!
PLEASE DO NOT PM ME.
I do not answer PMs! I delete all PMs no matter who they are from, even from a good friend. I don't have time for the PMs. I have very little free time. If you have a question just post it in a threadSmile


All my posts are hypothetical and for educational/entertainment purposes, and are not an endorsement of said activities. SWIM (a fictional character based on other people) either obtained a license for said activity, did said activity where it is legal to do so, or as in most cases the activity is completely fictional.
 
mayahuasca
#10 Posted : 7/20/2008 3:36:29 AM

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hey 69ron,

do you sell these coolers or can you tell us where to find one?

this just sounds like something i can´t live without.

:-)
 
Dwhitty76
#11 Posted : 7/22/2008 10:22:18 PM

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swim just purchased a MR138 digital cooler warmers only 89 usd ! Very happy
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Dwhitty76
#12 Posted : 7/22/2008 10:39:23 PM

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Another interesting thing is when i bought it,i spoke w/ a guy on the phone and he said last week they had 80 of them in stock and now currently have 7 in stock.I wonder if 69ron's post increased their sales Laughing
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WSaged
#13 Posted : 7/23/2008 2:51:18 AM

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Hey Dwhitty76, you should also make sure you are keeping your entire extraction as clean as possible!!

You mentioned that you did an A/B extraction, thats a good start.
Did the tek you used have a defatting step in it? You definitely want to do that before basifying if you want clear-to-white crystals!!
Look up "Vovin's tek" for a really thorough tek with a defat in it.
Actually, if you follow "Vovin's" to the letter, doing a freeze precip (no evaping if you want clean, clean!!), you should end up with super pure crystals right out of the freezer!! No recrystallizing nessissary!!
At least I do!!
Not the first time, mind you, but after the second extraction, I've gotten clear/white shards of crystal ever since!!!
I just finished #5!! One jar has large, round, flowery looking crystal boulders in it!! Beautiful!!

Other suggestions:
- Keep the size small. Don't try to do a whole pound of bark all at once.
- use only distilled water
- watch Your pH! Get a digital meter! (I use Acid-pH2 / Base-pH14)
- get a real seperatory funnel (makes it all soooo much easier!!)
- Filter out all of the bark material (get a real Buchner filter/funnel if you can afford one!! You will not regret it!! EBAY!!).
you should have a deep red yet transparent bark solution before you defat it.
I do 3 acid soaks, filtering after each one. (with a Buchner setup) Then filter it all once more.
Then into the fridge overnight, to let any silt thats left over, fall out to the bottom.
In the morning, filter once more before slowly reducing the volume down to a workable size (400ml or less) in the oven.
Sometimes I even filter once more before the defatting step.
Then finally defat, basify, Naptha pull, Sodium Carbonate wash the Naptha & freeze your crystals out slowly like someone said previously.
- Above all, TAKE YOUR TIME!! & Keep it Clean

I really enjoy doing the whole extraction process!!
I like seeing the different stages and reactions it goes though.
Taking a hand full of dirty sticks and over the course of a weekend, turning them into clear/white crystals of the most powerful Psychedelic on earth!!
And I don't have to buy it from some schlub I don't trust!!
I know exactlly how clean it is!! (I like mine as close as I can come to pure, doing it in my kitchen!!)
And I get to share it with all my good freinds!!
I love making this stuff!!!
So I don't mind spending the time.
Or spending the $$ (when I have a little extra) to get the real deal equipment. Makes the jobs a lot easier IMHO.

Good Luck!!

WS

All posts are fictional short stories depicting the adventures of WSaged!! None of these events have actually happened and any resemblance to any real persons or incidents is totally coincidence!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
Dwhitty76
#14 Posted : 7/23/2008 3:43:24 AM

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swim really enjoy's the process to,i feal like some sort of alchemist.From root to crystal.To be quite honest swim has developed a more than a mild obsession.swims girlfriend thinks he's crazy.Laughing Swim started w/ the marsfold tek (it seemed the easiest,shortest snd most straight foward plus other psyconauts gave it some praise),although it did not have a defatting process.On 500g of mhrb swim yielded a little over 2g of spice and it was white but more powdery as appose to crystally (swim was careful not to get that black/red juice into the naptha pull).Swim didnt even recrystalize "he" posted pics of the goods and the consenses was to leave it alone so i did.Now swim wants to yield some crystal rather than powder.There is basic lab equipment coming in the mail (glass,harware,tools &sep funnel)along w 2 kg's of freshly cut mhrb from mexico.Very happy Even purchased digital cooler warmer (a little obsessed)Laughing With this next batch of root bark he wants to test a few different teks to see what gets the best results.Swims been doing a little research into a soxhlet extracter.Someone on this forum stated that it extracted 99.9 % of the alkaloids and it makes the process easier because eliminates the need to boil and filter (it does it for you) and supposedly it will increase your yield by 20-30% (so i hear).I'm still doing some homework on it though.if you have any info on it please share. Thanx -dw
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WSaged
#15 Posted : 7/23/2008 5:28:56 AM

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Yeah I got a bit obsessed at first too!!
Now I have a large drawer full of Chem equipment, another full of solvents and I've my methods down to a tee!!!

Seriously, check out "Vovin's tek"!!
Even if you end up following another tek, "Vovin's" is extremely detailed and explains not just what to do, but why your doing it. Which helped me a ton!!
Reading as many teks as you can stomach to get the processes down pat in your head helps too!! (If your obsessed with it, this part should come easy!!)

Also I forgot to mention doing a wash with Sodium Carbonate (Arm & Hammer - "Super Washing Soda"Pleased too!! Also documented in "Vovin's tek"
To help clean up the "alka-loaded" naptha before it goes into the freezer.
This is a very fast step!! 3 washes takes about 20 to 30 minutes including separation time.

Sounds like your willing to go the extra mile so I'm sure you'll get some clean ass, crystal shards before too long!!

Cheers!

WS


All posts are fictional short stories depicting the adventures of WSaged!! None of these events have actually happened and any resemblance to any real persons or incidents is totally coincidence!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
Dwhitty76
#16 Posted : 7/23/2008 5:43:39 AM

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I appreciate the feedback.When the goods come in the mail,i will certainly be giving progress reports.If i run into any challanges,i hope you dont mind me asking for help.Smile -dw
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rumplestiltskin
#17 Posted : 7/31/2008 12:57:33 AM

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69ron wrote:
To make life really easy, get one of these MR138 digital cooler warmers for about $100 US:



With that you can slowly adjust the temperature from hot to cold over the course of a week. That will grow the best crystals possible without any contaminants. Put some naphtha or heptane in the cooler/warmer and set it to 120 F (48.8 C). Leave it for about 30 minutes. Once its nice and warm, you pour just enough naphtha on your spice to dissolve all of the spice and no more. Then put a cover over the dissolved spice and put it in the cooler/warmer on the warm setting of 120 F (48.8 C) and then slowly adjust it down to 39 F (3 C) over the course of a week and you'll have really beautiful large crystals!

SWIM would LOVE to get one of those but he doesn't have the space for it at the moment.



This thing looks pretty cool. I'm a bit apprehensive about putting Naptha in there and heating it up to 120(!) though. Seems like a potential bomb but maybe I'm just ignorant. I'm very close to buying one of these but would feel a lot better if a few members would chime in on the safety aspects of heating up solvents in one of these....
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Dwhitty76
#18 Posted : 7/31/2008 1:43:11 AM

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Swim just bought one but hasnt used it yet.Swim is used to putting glass baking dishes in the freezer for the freeze precipitation.This isnt big enough for that so,swim is gonna have to tweek his tek and use mason jars.Its pretty small.
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69ron
#19 Posted : 7/31/2008 9:27:35 AM

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rumplestiltskin wrote:

This thing looks pretty cool. I'm a bit apprehensive about putting Naptha in there and heating it up to 120(!) though. Seems like a potential bomb but maybe I'm just ignorant. I'm very close to buying one of these but would feel a lot better if a few members would chime in on the safety aspects of heating up solvents in one of these....


120 F is not that hot. It gets that hot in the desert here and the cans of naphtha don't start exploding. And my car hasn’t exploded yet and it is filled with gas.

If you're worried about sparks or something like that, simply enclose the container in a large Ziploc bag that is sealed. The Ziploc bag will expand and shrink as the temperature changes and prevent any air or sparks from getting into the jar.
PLEASE DO NOT PM ME.
I do not answer PMs! I delete all PMs no matter who they are from, even from a good friend. I don't have time for the PMs. I have very little free time. If you have a question just post it in a threadSmile


All my posts are hypothetical and for educational/entertainment purposes, and are not an endorsement of said activities. SWIM (a fictional character based on other people) either obtained a license for said activity, did said activity where it is legal to do so, or as in most cases the activity is completely fictional.
 
69ron
#20 Posted : 8/8/2008 6:50:51 AM

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SWIM just got an MR-138! He couldn't resist the temptation to get oneSmile

It looks a lot nicer than in the pictures. The lighted buttons are so cool looking. The fact that you can turn on the internal light from outside the cooler/heater to see inside easily without opening the door is quite nice.

It seems well made even though it’s made mostly of plastic.

Its being tested right now. It was set to 39 F (3.8 C). In 30 minutes it cooled down from 75 F (23.8 C) to 59 F (15.0 C), after a few more hours its down to 43 F (6.1 C). It seems to be steady at 43 F (6.1 C). You can hear the fan in it. That’s the only downside. So you don’t want it in the bedroom, that’s for sure.

This is a great new lab tool to play around with.

SWIM is excited to do some crystallization tests with this cool new environmental science toySmile

You can also use this to force certain difficult to fruit mushrooms to fruit because you can set the temperature to the exact fruiting temperature range instead of just putting them in the frig (which often doesn’t work for some picky species). Hmmm…

SWIM has lots of scientific experiments planned for this environmental science toy.

SWIM only wishes the readout could be set to C or F. But it’s only F.

EDIT: the following morning it was down to 39 F (3.8 C). This is the perfect temperature for storing most pharmaceuticals (0 C and below is normally not recommended).
PLEASE DO NOT PM ME.
I do not answer PMs! I delete all PMs no matter who they are from, even from a good friend. I don't have time for the PMs. I have very little free time. If you have a question just post it in a threadSmile


All my posts are hypothetical and for educational/entertainment purposes, and are not an endorsement of said activities. SWIM (a fictional character based on other people) either obtained a license for said activity, did said activity where it is legal to do so, or as in most cases the activity is completely fictional.
 
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