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Natalensis vs Cubensis - a few notes from the mycelial interwebz Options
 
Toshido
#21 Posted : 2/2/2023 6:50:05 PM

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If you ever get any mold I wanna see that too! A mushroom that eats the dreaded trich would be a sight to see.
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STS is a community for people interested in growing, preserving and researching botanical species, particularly those with remarkable therapeutic and/or psychoactive properties.
 
Fridge
#22 Posted : 2/3/2023 4:38:17 AM

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artificer wrote:
Looking good, Fridge!

Is this from multi-spore? Dense pinset is more easily achieved with cloning. Also, IME the pics are showing signs of high CO2/not enough FAE - but then again, I've never grown Natalensis so they may just be different.

More pictures please; it's enjoyable to watch them grow!

Thanks, artificer Smile.

This is a clone culture, I only work with ms to choose promising clones these days. I grow Natalensis for about 4 years now. I had a super clone culture which ticked all the boxes (no overlay, very potent, even canopy), but I donated that culture because I am about to move overseas and thought that process wouldn't take as long as it does. I will post a pic of that culture later.
So I started this one now to keep myself busy and my jar full.

I agree it might look like too little FAE, but that's just what Natalensis does. I practically grow outdoors, it's an old outhouse the window is always open and during daytime the door aswell, as it's summer here and super hot.
If you should ever grow them, keep an eye out for "fuzzy feet" as that's a more reliable indication insufficient FAE with Nats, in my experience.
It's a fascinating mushroom to grow. Have I asked you whether you got spores already Pleased?

@Widderic, I will keep my eyes open for trich. I got 6 of these tubs, but all look clean so far. Usually that stays like that till I dump them if they made it to this point. I have seen trich taking over a Natalensis tub in the past though, so I can't confirm the "Nats eat trich" hypothesis. They are aggressive though. Buuut I saw another kind of contamination, which was kept in one corner of the tub and couldn't spread out. I need to do research to identify that contamination though.

I will post another pic just before harvest.

...no need to worry...
 
artificer
#23 Posted : 2/3/2023 3:42:29 PM

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Oh, sounds like plenty of FAE lol. Yes it takes a lot of time and messing around to re-start from MS, I've started/stopped this hobby enough times to realize I'm always going to come back to it - will be making my first culture slants this time around.

No spores yet, but believe me it's on my mind every time I check the mail!

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Toshido
#24 Posted : 2/3/2023 6:39:28 PM

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Fridge wrote:
[quote=artificer]Buuut I saw another kind of contamination, which was kept in one corner of the tub and couldn't spread out. I need to do research to identify that contamination though.

I will post another pic just before harvest.



During my early cultivation days I encountered just about every mold there was. But, with mycology, mistakes are often welcome as it forces you to add on precaution after precaution during the prepping stages. Since it's such a long prep phase, there's no telling WHERE you introduced a possible contaminate. It could have been a cough, a tiny piece of fabric from your clothing, an eye lash, a piece of dust floating through the air, am improperly sterilized needle, the list goes on. Eventually, my success rate with tubs was around 90 percent which was pretty good for a quasi set up in the early 2000's.

Do you have a picture of that mold?
πŸŒ³πŸ‘¨β€πŸ”¬πŸŒ³ - My A/B Hot Plate TEK - πŸŒ³πŸ‘¨β€πŸ”¬πŸŒ³
🍜🍜🍜 - Don't Heat Your Naphtha, Heat Your Soup! - 🍜🍜🍜
✴✴✴ - White Spice vs Yellow Spice - 🌟🌟🌟
"You are an explorer, and you represent our species, and the greatest good you can do is to bring back a new idea, because our world is endangered by the absence of good ideas. Our world is in crisis because of the absence of consciousness." - Terence McKenna
πŸ™Œ "Dang, that's really impressive for a first extraction. Those xtals are nicely resolved." - Benzyme πŸ™Œ

 
Fridge
#25 Posted : 2/5/2023 11:31:37 AM

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widderic wrote:

During my early cultivation days I encountered just about every mold there was. But, with mycology, mistakes are often welcome as it forces you to add on precaution after precaution during the prepping stages. Since it's such a long prep phase, there's no telling WHERE you introduced a possible contaminate. It could have been a cough, a tiny piece of fabric from your clothing, an eye lash, a piece of dust floating through the air, am improperly sterilized needle, the list goes on. Eventually, my success rate with tubs was around 90 percent which was pretty good for a quasi set up in the early 2000's.

Do you have a picture of that mold?

I think I know exactly what you are talking about Smile. We all need to go through that phase... till you start to think like a piece of dust Big grin . Nowadays I only occasionally contam creeps in which is ok with me.
The contamination mentioned happened years back and I don't have pics unfortunately. It was mint green if I remember correctly.

Today I harvested the first flush. The fruits aren't huge, but super potent, just how I like it.
Fridge attached the following image(s):
IMG_20230205_123045.jpg (2,606kb) downloaded 207 time(s).
...no need to worry...
 
artificer
#26 Posted : 2/5/2023 2:50:00 PM

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It's like a snowy scene from someone's winter village collection but with mushrooms instead of the people and streetlights etc.

I see there's also a Natalensis Pan Cyan out there, have you had any experience with this?
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Fridge
#27 Posted : 2/6/2023 4:50:51 AM

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artificer wrote:
It's like a snowy scene from someone's winter village collection but with mushrooms instead of the people and streetlights etc.

I see there's also a Natalensis Pan Cyan out there, have you had any experience with this?

Big grin I love that describtion and I see what you mean! I too compare it to winter wonderland sometimes. This is probably something fun to look at while on mushrooms.

I haven't heard of a cross between Natalensis and Pan Cyans yet, but I am intrigued. I saw a cross between cubes and Nats though.
I read that the genetic sequence of Natalensis is very close to the one of Cubensis. I could imagine the genetic sequence of Pan Cyans to be quite different compared to the one of Natalensis, which in turn makes a successful cross very difficult to achieve (I could be wrong about this).
Do you know how they have been crossed? I would definitively want to grow a cross like that!
...no need to worry...
 
artificer
#28 Posted : 2/6/2023 2:03:21 PM

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I don't think it is cross bred; I think it's a standalone Panaeolus Cyanescens that also happens to be from Natal.
An affinity to entheogens that bring me to full submission,
A thriving esoteric greenhouse, I do envision
 
Fridge
#29 Posted : 2/6/2023 2:27:32 PM

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artificer wrote:
I don't think it is cross bred; I think it's a standalone Panaeolus Cyanescens that also happens to be from Natal.

Ah now I get you, sorry Smile. Yes, I know about a shroomery member that found cool looking pan Cyans in that area. I think he already domesticated them.
I also heard reports that they were even found further South.
...no need to worry...
 
Toshido
#30 Posted : 2/6/2023 8:12:18 PM

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Beautiful. I just want to live in there. Great photo!
πŸŒ³πŸ‘¨β€πŸ”¬πŸŒ³ - My A/B Hot Plate TEK - πŸŒ³πŸ‘¨β€πŸ”¬πŸŒ³
🍜🍜🍜 - Don't Heat Your Naphtha, Heat Your Soup! - 🍜🍜🍜
✴✴✴ - White Spice vs Yellow Spice - 🌟🌟🌟
"You are an explorer, and you represent our species, and the greatest good you can do is to bring back a new idea, because our world is endangered by the absence of good ideas. Our world is in crisis because of the absence of consciousness." - Terence McKenna
πŸ™Œ "Dang, that's really impressive for a first extraction. Those xtals are nicely resolved." - Benzyme πŸ™Œ

 
Bancopuma
#31 Posted : 9/10/2023 5:34:28 PM

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Having dabbled with a few different dosages of Natalensis, I thought I'd report back in case it's of interest to anyone. I had a 1g dosage on a beautiful sunny day out in nature by a lake with my mum (she had half a gram, and was seeing entities eyes closed and in the trees in the fading light - she's quite a fungal lightweight! But she really enjoyed it). I was really impressed with this taster dose...the coming up period was very smooth, there was no body load, I had a feeling of deep relaxed contentment at existing in the present moment, and I was brimming over with an ecstatic joy, and the sights and sounds of nature around me were amplified. This was nice and welcomed, life having been a bit of a bumpy ride of late.

Last night I had a 5g dose along with a good friend, in the same lakeside setting but this time on a particularly mild night under a star studded sky. The coming up period was fast! The mushrooms wasted little time...but once again, the transition was smooth. Coming up on a 5g Cubensis dose can be quite a gnarly experience at times, but the transition to a bemushroomed Natalensis state - despite the power of the dose consumed (which was quite something!!) was very smooth, I think up there with the smoothest of all mushrooms. There was some yawning during that initial phase, and I had my eyes closed for a chunk of it, the cosmic spectacle of the stars and Milky Way was almost too much at that point! The 5g dosage certainly didn't disappoint!! The Natalensis were in no way lacking power at this dosage...it was a deep immersion into the bemushroomed realms...but it felt very positive and uplifting, there were no hard edges at that dosage. Both me and friend noticed this, not being strangers to rocky or challenging mushroom experiences (it will be interesting to see to what degree this might replicate with subsequent experiences). The visuals were beautiful, an ever shifting shimmering abstract play of patterns woven from coloured light. There was no body load to speak of, even that this dosage, and in fact there was a lovely feeling in the body, like being wrapped up in cotton wool or liquid velvet. Once more, a deep feeling of contentment. We had planned to have a fire outside which I enjoy when tripping but we never got round to it as we were so wrapped up and content with the experience as it was. We didn't listen to any music, only night time nature sounds, owls and other critters put on quite a show, and we were very content with that (although we did sample some music once back inside before hitting the hay). My friend commented that he didn't find the Natalensis to be very introspective, which I know tallies with other peoples experiences. However I personally didn't find this to be the case...I had some insights on areas of life I could do with looking at, and also some insight on and inspiration for other things I have going on. So I feel they are capable of eliciting introspection, but dosage and context are likely important factors here. As we headed in for the night, we were met by the moon pulling a perfect Cheshire cat grin which and amused us both and was a nice way of rounding off the night. We dosed at 9PM and were largely on terra firma again by 2AM. I feel a little tired today (which makes sense, bed at 3AM and up at 9AM), but otherwise on good form.

Both myself and my friend were blown away with the Natalensis, in some sense they exceeded my expectations, despite having read up on them a fair bit before consuming them, and in my view, they are worthy of a good chunk of the hype they are receiving. The state of intoxication they produced was very pleasurable on a number of fronts...we drank deeply from the well of wonder and awe, had a deep upwelling of ecstatic joy and bliss, while feeling like we were enveloped in a soft velvety liquid cloud. Nature and the cosmos was truly spectacular to behold in that state. My friend described the peak as quite delirium like, and a tad confusing, but certainly not in any kind of negative way. I'm keen now to have a deep dive with Pan cyan, but Pan cyans I find to be very clear and clean...which is nice, but I find them somehow less intoxicating in some way. I had some with some MDMA with this same friend at a music festival, and the crystalline clarity of the Pan cyans actually seemed to sober both of us up, it was odd! I feel Pan cyans are more cerebral, like LSD, mainly hitting the brain rather than the body, and that is great, but I do actually appreciate the more somatic experience of the Natalensis. I've tried a range of different psilocybin mushroom species...P. cubensis, P. semilanceata, P. cyanescens, P. azurescens, P. mexicana, P. galindoi, P. tampanensis and Pan cyan...and I've come to feel through experience that the different species do vary consistently in character or qualities, and I prefer some to others. However - admittedly while basing this off these few experiences - I would personally consider P. natalensis to rank among the best of the best that the psilocybin mushroom world has to offer, and both myself and my friend consider this experience as being among the top tier mushroom experiences we've ever had (and I've been acquainted with the mushroom for around 20 years). My friend said it had a magical feeling that he'd not experienced with the mushroom for years, and I was beginning to wonder if such feelings were a thing of the past. Needless to say, we were both blown away by this mushroom, and we both had absolutely spectacular experiences which we both feel very grateful for.

What a gift! There is no doubt this is a South African gem of a species, and I consider this a good beginner mushroom - both from the ease of growing it, with its tenacious and resilient mycelium and bountiful yields - and due to it offering what I suspect to be a smoother and generally more positive and upbeat mushroom experience (compared to P. cubensis).
Bancopuma attached the following image(s):
P. natalensis.jpg (527kb) downloaded 127 time(s).
 
doubledog
#32 Posted : 11/5/2023 7:15:42 PM

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Toshido wrote:
doubledog wrote:
Thank you for this information Thumbs up very valuable and also I got it in exactly right moment - I was just thinking about restarting my growing hobby and do not want to grow cubes again as I do not like them much.

Spores are already on the way, so hopefully in a few months I will be able to report back on my experience.


Please do! I'd say that would be worthy of a bump if this thread gets old.


I would like to report my experience with these mushrooms. It's really easy to grow, same as cubensis, even easier, as Nats mycelium is quicker and stronger. In my opinion overlay is probably a reaction to high humidity, but it is really not a big problem. I had huge overlay and yield was still great.

What was much less satisfactory were the effects, ime they are quite similar to the effects of cubensis, which I do not like much. So I am not planning to continue to grow it.

But I am still glad that I started again with my mushroom hobby, as I tried to grow also Psilocybe subtropicalis. Growing of these is also quite easy (I've used same growing method as for Cubes or Nats with minimal modifications) and they are strong, very visual, probably the best shrooms I've ever had. Yield is much smaller, but that is not of any importance to me.

My new favourite shrooms Big grin
 
dithyramb
#33 Posted : 11/5/2023 7:57:29 PM

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I have minimal experience with cubensis and have a more established connection to liberty caps. Just received spores of natalensis from a beautiful soul who wanted to gift it to me. I guess I should not expect much similarity with liberty caps... I actually have an impression of natalensis as something more on the wild side. Pretty sure it would intrigue me, not sure what my wife (who is the actual mushroom person) would feel, as a passionate liberty caps fan.
The consciousness of plants is a constant source of information for medicine, alimentation, and art, and an example of the intelligence and creative imagination of nature. Much of my education I owe to the intelligence of these great teachers. Thus I consider myself to be the β€œrepresentative” of plants, and for this reason I assert that if they cut down the trees and burn what’s left of the rainforests, it is the same as burning a whole library of books without ever having read them.

~ Pablo Amaringo
 
Bancopuma
#34 Posted : 11/9/2023 2:57:34 PM

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doubledog wrote:
Toshido wrote:
doubledog wrote:
Thank you for this information Thumbs up very valuable and also I got it in exactly right moment - I was just thinking about restarting my growing hobby and do not want to grow cubes again as I do not like them much.

Spores are already on the way, so hopefully in a few months I will be able to report back on my experience.


Please do! I'd say that would be worthy of a bump if this thread gets old.


I would like to report my experience with these mushrooms. It's really easy to grow, same as cubensis, even easier, as Nats mycelium is quicker and stronger. In my opinion overlay is probably a reaction to high humidity, but it is really not a big problem. I had huge overlay and yield was still great.

What was much less satisfactory were the effects, ime they are quite similar to the effects of cubensis, which I do not like much. So I am not planning to continue to grow it.

But I am still glad that I started again with my mushroom hobby, as I tried to grow also Psilocybe subtropicalis. Growing of these is also quite easy (I've used same growing method as for Cubes or Nats with minimal modifications) and they are strong, very visual, probably the best shrooms I've ever had. Yield is much smaller, but that is not of any importance to me.

My new favourite shrooms Big grin


Hey doubledog,

Thanks for chiming in here. Sorry to hear that you weren't impressed with the Natalensis having sampled them. While those various accounts in the opening post on this thread might appear to have been cherry picked, I've kept my eyes peeled for testimonials from people who don't like Natalensis in comparison to Cubensis or other mushrooms. Not everyone prefers it, but it does seem like the overwhelming majority (say 90%) do. A few other testimonials from people also describe it as being similar in vibe to Cubensis...still others are surprised at how distinct it feels to Cubensis (which is interesting given how closely related the species are). Having had a few more experiences at lower dosages, I will say I've experienced a range of effects. One more recent experience with around 1g was definitely much more reminiscent of Cubensis for me...but my 5g experience was definitely in a league of its own (and this applied to both myself and my friend), and definitely had quite a distinct feel and vibe to any Cubensis experience I've had. Interestingly my prior experience with 0.5g also felt quite distinct. Obviously external set and setting factors are major determinants of outcomes, but from my fairly limited experience so far, they do seem to be variable in effect. Not sure if this could be partly down to them being a wild type species, not having been selectively bred into the various myriad strains as with Cubensis. But I would perhaps urge some caution passing judgement on the Natalensis based on a single experience.

Psilocybe subtropicalis is definitely an interesting species. Anyone with experience with it tends to hold it in very high regard...I would like to get better acquainted with it. My one experience with the mushroom was with a dosage of 3.5g with a friend, and it was my first time ingesting the mushroom in a Mazatec-inspired context (sitting up straight, with an altar). This was definitely among the more powerful and spectacular psychedelic experiences of my life, it wasn't an easy experience at that level and was very humbling. I've also had several experiences ingesting the potent mycelium of this species on grain, but if I was pursuing this species again, I would focus on the mushroom. But yeah I think this is a species I need to get to know better, so thanks for the nudge. This aside, currently I'm also focussed on Pan cyan - a particularly vigorous and potent strain, 'TTBVI' that is also making waves in grower/psilonaut communities.
 
doubledog
#35 Posted : 11/9/2023 5:34:52 PM

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Thank you for your input, bancopuma.
You are right that single experience is not enough for final conclusions, but I take mushrooms only 2 times per year, so there is only one chance for any new mushroom species to impress me. Elimination process is very tough in my case Big grin especially when I have access to various other species, which are better in my opinion.
I really don't want to discourage anybody from trying Nats, in fact I would probably prefer them over Cubensis if I had to choose one of them. I would definitely recommend Nats to any grower, it's really rewarding species.

3,5 g of P. subtropicalis is quite high dose, no wonder it was so powerful.
Pan cyans or maybe Panaeolus bisporus is also on my to do list.

I would also recommend to you or to any experienced user to try mix of various shrooms.
 
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