Hi Voidmatrix...

I found this discussion in post below..and wondered ... how good of a sleep aid is the sleepytime with rue mix...ive never tryed this combo..

You should have had some.. awesome dreaming!... with this mix..did you experiance a boost in dreaming?

How much rue did you use per cup of sleeptime?...How did this mix make you feel?





Voidmatrix
#8
Posted : 6/2/2021 8:12:51 PM
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I've been drinking rue with my Sleepytime Extra at night. Seems to be helping with sleep and depression. Rue is a good experience in and of itself.

Let us know what your experiences are likeSmile

One love

From my experience with similar herbs plus rue it should be a nice combo. I always dream like crazy anyhow, always have done - but some nights the right herb can bring an extra level of clarity or detail which IME is hard to repeat. The river is ever-changing.

2.5g rue seems to be a sweet spot, too much and it can really disrupt sleep. YMMV, aim lower if necessary.

Apologies that I am just now getting to respond.

So, I haven't done this combination in quite some time. There was a period where my cognition seemed to be waning and was also having worse sleep issues. Not sure if rue was influencing such or not, I stopped taking it for a while. That was a mistake.

Initially, the entire combination seemed to help with my sleep, but over time, the rue seemed to act more as a stimulant than anything, and so became a detriment to my sleep.

During the time in which I was working with that combination, I was typically dosing between 3.5g-5g of seeds per brew.

Now, I take my rue in the morning to see how it helps with my mental and spiritual being. I'm definitely fond of it.

Though, now I may increase the frequency to twice a day and add add it back to my sleepytime tea. See what happens.

Another caveat that I feel I should provide is that this combination is usually with sleepytime extra, which has valerian (and it may not be the best idea to make a nightly habit out of drinking this one as I have...).

And my dreams were more elaborate and vivid, which isn't always a good thing in my opinion. I find many of my dreams uncomfortable, so it's all good when I don't remember them.

One love

Do you find morning rue consumption still affects sleep?

I would say yes by way of improving my mood and mental state, allowing me to be more relaxed and ready to actually get some sleep. Sleep in a precarious thing for me.

One love

Hello.
I think consuming rue in these amounts daily would effect my eating habits a lot. I know most (all?) eating restrictions regarding harmalas are pretty lose. But I would still think about it, and the light nausea would also effect me. But the later is perhaps just a question about using it regularly.

Are your food intake not effected Voidmatrix?

I haven't found a reason to change my diet because of rue. It may be one of those things where the improvements on my mental health encourage better eating by means of regular work with rue.

Over time, I've found that the nausea subsides.

One love

Good to know! And glad to hear that rue does good. I'm fascinated by this plant. Have recently had a few sessions with rue tea (3 - 4.5g) and cannabis. Really strange that this is not more widely talked about

It is very much an underrated molecule. I think it could benefit many people, who want to work towards the goal of being benefited by rue.

I've enjoyed sessions at my meditation altar with some rue tea (and sometimes some lemon balm, chamomile, blue lotus, and or others added) while smoking a joint before going into a process. I find the experience of rue hard to pin down and describe, but it does induce meditative states well, and it can be a novel introspective (among other things) tool. I've found that when smoking harmalas with cannabis it is more mind opening, though there is a prevalent body load that I have come to find euphoric once I'm grounded the way I need to be in the experience.

One love

I have experienced a synergy between rue and cannabis as well. Not just with rue btw, but also with other MAOI's.
I think dopamine is the neurotransmitter responsible for these effects, and not serotonin. Maybe noradrenalin to some extent as well.

Dopamine has a bit of a bad reputation in relation to mind altering substances, because it is often being labeled as the "reward molecule" that is responsible for addiction and impulsive behaviour.
And that is probably true to some extent.

But it is also, like noradrenalin, one of the most important neurotransmitters, and it makes you experience things more vividly and intense.

I think the enhanced dopamine rush has the effect of making you more open to the experience and more appreciative as well. It can also enhance feelings of paranoia, wich is also something that i've experienced with MAOI's and cannabis btw.

The combo also makes me experience auditory hallucinations sometimes. Something cannabis by itself doesn't do.

Yes! I've taken rue as extract or tea many times over the last three years. But never daily. I can notice a tingeing or buzz in my nerves and some stimulation after about 2.5 - 3 h. If I meditate (sitting still breathing) I also get get vague images, mental images. But not much more except sometimes nausea and effected balance. But if I then vape some DMT or cannabis is really opens up the rue and makes it's psychoactive/psychedelic sides more apparent.
The last times with rue and cannabis (and I've also taken some DMT later to see how that was) I see short film-like clips. Like a repeated scene or clip from a movie. Very random places and characters and not from my life and history. They are subdued in light and colors (as if the light is turned off) but very different from mental images/fantasies/memories in the way that I can study details and focus on parts in them. Really unusual. No wonder that they wanted name Harmalas as Telepathine before.

I too sometimes get the random imagery/scenery of just random people doing random things, it's so odd, it is indeed like movie snippits or something but not anything i've ever seen, not memories either, and i'm not even really a visual person and don't visually imagine things, so like, i wonder where that kind of imagery comes from, and why. Like i said, just random people doing random things, lots and lots of random never before seen faces, going from one scene to the next rather fast-like, really reminds me of like movie scenes.

From my understanding, I wonder if there's a misconception and misunderstanding generally about the function of dopamine. It seems to be more of an "ambition" molecule rather than a reward molecule. As an example, a poker player gets the dopamine rush before they place their bet rather than after. All the same, the mechanisms of neurotransimitters is relatively complex, and so this doesn't mean that there is no role of dopamine in the pleasure response, but it may not be the main component of it.



Have you found that some of these visuals can blend with mental imagery? I'm glad that you brought this distinction up as it is always something very noticeable to me.



I get similar image sets, but then I also get faint images that are more akin to DMT visuals. That said, many of them are hard to describe and explain.

When I see what appear to be real people that I have never encountered, it makes me ponder whether some of these substances provide us with a lens to see and experience things in a non-local way.

One love

I like that idea/thought, could imo be worth exploring.

Imo/ime there's merit to this line of thinking. I myself have learned a few interesting things lately about Dopamine and Serotonin, mainly because i've been dosing L-Dopa for a good few years and recently started dosing 5-HTP with the L-Dopa, as well as P5P B6 for DOPA Decarboxylase activation to convert them to active Dopamine and Serotonin. Apparently i was like, low/deficient in B6 and didn't know it, and so L-Dopa to me pretty much just felt like L-Dopa and not particularly Dopamine, most of the time anyways, and then i started noticing a decline in Serotonin which come to find out L-Dopa can deplete Serotonin and 5-HTP can deplete Dopamine and so the two need to be in a balanced mix. But to me, Dopamine and Noradrenaline definitely seem more about productivity and focus/concentration and while it may be involved in reward to some degree, i feel like Serotonin is probably moreso the main signalling molecule, but that they both (and other compounds) work together and so Serotonin may trigger a Dopaminergic response in a certain area of the brain for example, or vice versa.

All i can really say for the moment is that it wasn't until i started adding in the 5-HTP for Serotonin, that i started noticing a bit more in the way of "pleasure" and such, i'm not sure if i would get that without the L-Dopa also being in the mix, but like i said i've been dosing L-Dopa for years and even with P5P B6, without the 5-HTP, those noticeable effects i get from having 5-HTP in the mix aren't there, so it leads me to believe it's something to do with Serotonin rather than Dopamine. But i'm Autistic and "ADHD" so i've had issues with my neurotransmitters for most of my life, apparently, it's been a long journey to figure myself out and learn things about the body and all that, and i still have so much more to learn, but imo i'm doing a better job than any psychiatrist i've ever seen who just wanted to put me on meds and not figure out what's really going on.