I share this from my empathy.

We use words to communicate with one another, but sometimes we use them as terms, and as such, these terms help us categorize things in a way that helps us feel as though we have an understanding of the situation and context in question that the term is applied to.

I am starting to wonder if many are led astray and impacted by the power of suggestion by the use term 'breakthrough' at this point in time. As DMT becomes more popular in the societal milieu, certain phrases and terms become more prominent within the groups that talk about it. Often, these terms come from a small pool of source, but end up impacting and effecting a larger pool of people who may or may not be as “in the know.” I have noticed, that based off of either a small pool of people or from a popular source, specific niche information makes it into the wider subset of people interested in such topics. People's expectations are altered by this. So there become instances where people expect certain aspects and events before calling their DMT experience a 'breakthrough.'

An example would be how many are under the impression that if they can still be in touch with their bodies, then they probably didn't breakthrough. It's not comprehensive. The term breakthough reflects a certain level and intensity of experience (and from my experience, there are many layers and levels to what I'd call breakthrough experiences), but won't always have the same indicative aspects to identify it as such each time. The DMT experience may very well be infinite, and as such, there's an infinite number of permutations of variables and aspects of hyperspace. DMT always has something new to show you, and the 'breakthrough' experience, while appearing to have some intersubjective clout, is still largely subjective, and as such, many definitions are not facts nor objective. In all of your interactions with DMT you may never enter a waiting room, or see a chrysanthemum, etc.

Lastly, there seems to be a preoccupation with 'breaking through' when so much can be gleaned from “lower” levels of experience as well. It's not always about reaching the pinnacle, but basking in the entire paradigm as a whole.

Simply, do you. Define it for yourself. If it's an intense experience, and there were entities, and your consciousness was doing things that it's never done before (or at least never touches outside the space), and you experienced alterations of some kind that you've never come across before, and it's 'vivid,' then it's probably safe calling it a breakthrough. However, what's more important, is whether or not your experience fulfilled you and covered your goals for your journey. Be clever in how you describe the depth of your personal experience.

Be well.



One love

Hi VoidMatrix:

Thank you for bringing this topic to light.

Having spent a significant amount of time reading the wealth of experience reports that members of the Nexus have posted and reading so often about the coveted "breakthrough" has often-times made me feel quite inadequate with my experiences as I slowly raise my dose of DMT trying to reach a state which matches the amazing descriptions that I read about.

I realise that this is a very human feeling surrounding the dynamics of interactions with others and learning to trust our own perception and sense of worth; on its own, this aspect and the realisation of it is a powerful learning experience on its own.

I suspect that I have already experienced "breakthrough" but have been so busy comparing my experience with what others have written (about something that is almost impossible to describe in words anyway) that I am missing some of the wonder because I am making myself stuck trying to fit the experience into other people's words. I guess I suffer from the problems that plague the type of people who like to read manuals!

Anyway, thanks for making a point of mentioning this.

Respect.

Well put.

I know I struggle with this classification of experience mostly due to reading trip reports, as I hardly see the truly awe inspiring things that others have undoubtedly come across. That being said, I've taken a little time to figure out what it is that I personally want from my journeys. I'd consider myself a fool for expecting to be able to control what is given to me via travelling. I have become far less dependent on visuals described by others, and whether or not my own experiences would fall within the same class.

This Molecule is far too peculiar to try to equate ones experience to another. If something deeply resonates with you in that Otherness or is so supremely surreal as to make you ponder on it for days or weeks; You've struck something that classifying would diminish in some way.



This hits home as when I first started to take steps into hyperspace, this was my predominant focus. I would cast aside some of the more striking trips as mere hallucination or something I deemed "not the right kind of experience" for me.

There is a unquantifiable beauty in every experience I have had to date, and it is only now that I can appreciate them for what they were.

Take all of this with a grain of salt, as it has helped me on my path. It may not be the same one anyone else needs to walk to come to their own conclusions.

Safe Travels,
Duck

Thank you both for weighing in, and I'm glad it was useful to you.

This has been something that has been on my mind for a while, and I was feeling for many people that I felt were missing out on the potential beauty and value of their experience because they couldn't reconcile whether they had a 'breakthrough' or not.




You hit the nail on the head here with regard to pointing out the normalcy of gravitating and assimilating in human interactions. While we can learn from others in many ways, it's important not to neglect honing our own mental faculties and abilities. It's very much a balance.

This is one way in which I was personally very fortunate; when I first did DMT (and mushrooms for that matter), I knew nothing about them. I didn't know many people who had done them. I hadn't heard of Leary, or McKenna, or Shulgin, or Hoffman, etc. There was nothing to color my thinking about the experiences. I was a fresh, open, clean slate. That's not to say that I wasn't naive in my use. All I looked up was how much it takes to overdose so as to avoid that outcome. First time with mushrooms: Friend was adamant in her suggestion, 7g, Avatar in 3D... First time with DMT: Friends heard about how many mushrooms I was eating, heavily suggested DMT, 3 journeys, all over 200mg, sandwich method...



That's beauty in growth right there.



One love

One's definition of and relationship to the notion of breakthrough is likely to change over one's course working with dmt. An epiphanic breakthrough? Visually startling breakthrough? A nonhuman communion breakthrough?

There are seemingly endless tiers of dwellers to meet and thresholds to cross.

Yesterday I was thinking about the same topic since reading new members' posts. I don't say this as a form of judgement, on the contrary I would like them to enjoy every experience they have because they're all valuable. So I like your post and especially this part:

I have pondered this topic many times also. In some aspects I couldn't be more grateful for the knowledge people have shared for me to find about the molecule. In other aspects I wonder if there are negative consequences for the preconceived ideas I may have picked up along the way that potentially influence my experiences to become not entirely my own.

On one hand, I agree with most of what is said in OP.

On the other, from my own experience, you can definitely say when you have a breakthrough experience.
It is as much undefinable as any other concept, like love. Love is different for everybody.
And just like there are different kinds and levels to love, there are different kinds and levels of BT experiences.

I, personally, do not advise to chase BT experiences until you have a plenty of less intense trips and enjoy them

Then also, our hypothetical psychonaut should consider, that any of his BTs can also mean: either end of honeymoon with the substance, or further abstinence from iy altogether.
BT can take you to infinity of experiences, and infinity means EVERY KIND of experience.

I think of BT as of a little death

Great examples, and what I mean by different layers and levels of the breakthrough experience!



Thank you so much CR. I come across this both in reading trip reports and talking with people and end up feeling for them.



It's a strange double-edge and balancing act, isn't it? Fortunately, we can purify and crystalize our minds, removing preconceptions from future experiences.



There's some synchronicity here for me, as one of my best friends and I said the same. However, the three of us may be some that never focused too much on finding that kind of experience and so our intuition allowed us to identify and label our experience without any pressure to do so.

Thank you everyone for your thoughts.

One love

Hey Exitwound. I'm wondering again if we can ever apply a single rule to everyone at once. Personally I'm more of a jump in the deep end kind of person. My second DMT experience was definitely excessive dose that blew my brains out but it also kindled the fire that now drives me to keep exploring the molecule. Albeit now with more reverence, restraint and respect.

Perhaps a series of less explosive experiences would have led to less interest. I may have even forgotten about it and never taken much benefit from the experiences. As it was, that second trip taught me something that has changed my life for the better. Stopped me from self destructing a relationship that is more important now than anything else in my life.


Please dont think I am refuting what you said. I'm certain for many people the advice is solid. But perhaps not everyone.

fink, of course! It would be hypocritical of me to think otherwise, that my advice applies to everybody
If you read my first experiences, I dived into the abyss head on with foolish smile on my face (ref. picture tarot card The Fool).

Hehe, I'm guessing a lot of the population of the nexus might have similar entries to this game.

Ironically, I've not smoked for a while and am soon to dive back in. My instinct is to hit a couple of 10mg trips before going harder. Probably some part cowardice. Yet I never regret the ignorant and innocent first high jumps.

Is it cowardice, or would it be more apt to say that it's awareness, wisdom, and prudence?

One love

Very generously suggested man. Some part is definitely fear.

Naturally. And feeling fear, being with fear, is not a bad thing. The toughest person in the world experiences fear. It's about how we manage it and if we allow it to hinder and deter us that matters. Have fear, just don't give in to fear.



One love

Well said indeed. I am pretty accustomed to managing fear and often seek out things in life that scare me on purpose. This is why I feel pretty confident recognising an element of fear in smoking DMT. I love it.

Back on track. Heroic dose or dipping the toes gently, breakthrough or not. The only answer is to smoalk moar right?

Well I'd certainly hope so... you jump out of planes for a living!

And YES YES YES, SMOALK MOAR! Do what's right for you, integrate when necessary

One love

Good topic and posts!
Great to share thoughts around the terminology/language of the experiences. But also about the thought/language system(s) that is inherited and created among the users. Especially interesting since this substance gives what seems to be an extra ordinary range of different experiences and worlds to visit.

But back on track. One variable that is central to what I've thought to be a breakthrough, is the feeling of presence. The feeling of actually being somewhere completely else. Not looking at or sensing something, and not only being surrounded (like in digital VR), but actually feel/know that your consciousnesses is fully present in this place. And it's not where you had your breakfast.

This experience has changed something and opened my feelings for my everyday consciousnesses and presence. Other drugs (cannabis and N₂O) and classic psychedelics has also expanded my world, but not as much as DMT regarding my presence.

I really like how you described that variable. For me, and I don't know why, but it impacts my careful approach, is experiencing various levels simultaneously, as if I've almost been cloned, and have the awareness of each clone of myself. My mind and consciousness can be fully someplace else while also being aware of my body and pragmatic surroundings. It's a little hard to describe.

And yep, nothing does it that quite like DMT for me either.

One love

After my first breakthrough I never again thought of WHAT a breakthrough is.
I don't see how anyone that has surely broken through can be wondering about the definition 'cause there's no doubt. So if you're wondering what a breakthrough is then I don't think you've ever experienced a breakthrough. Breakthrough the vail to a completely other reality.