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Nerve Growth Factor (NGF) promoting substances Options
 
Nydex
#1 Posted : 2/14/2022 11:02:37 PM

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Hi friends,

Some of you may remember that I planned on conjuring a NGF-promoting cocktail and combine that with microdoses of psilocybin in order to alleviate (or best-case scenario - cure) my lifelong stutter. The time of my relative financial stability came, so I'm starting the process with gathering as much information as I can before I devise one (or more) recipes that I'll test on myself. I need your help in relation to that. If there are any people in here that consider themselves well-versed in the field of neurobiology, I would very much appreciate your input.

So far I have come to the decision to include three main components in this cocktail, and those are as follows:

1. Lion's Mane (powdered, or extract) - I talked with a couple of people on a popular facebook mycology group and they told me that Paul Stamets' products are actually just re-labelled Mushroom Matrix products. If anyone knows more about this and if it's true at all, I'd appreciate your input!

2. Psilocybin microdoses (haven't settled on a dosing pattern yet, will look into it at a later stage)

3. DHEA (androstenolone) - there's sufficient evidence on the internet that this substance promotes NGF quite noticeably, binding to and activating some of the primary neurotrophin receptors, like TrkA, TrkC, and p75. However, I am aware that it also has an effect on the levels of testosterone, and is a negative allosteric modulator for the GABAa receptor, so I'm a bit on the line whether or not it's a good idea to include that in the mixture. I will discuss this with my doctor, but it would still be very helpful if anyone here has more knowledge and experience with this rather mainstream fitness supplement.

So far these are the substances I've largely decided on, but I would love to explore what else can be included in the mixture in a way that would synergize well with the others and maybe even potentiate their effects. I've also contacted the Institute of Reconstructive Neurobiology in Bonn, Germany, and am waiting for a reply on their end with any advice/knowledge on the topic.

That being said, I would really love it if you kind folk could share your opinion on the above, and maybe suggest more NGF-promoting substances that I can consider including in the cocktail.

I'm at a stage in my life where I'm sort of desperate for something to at least alleviate this issue. I recently started a new job as a software engineer, and anyone with experience in the field knows how many meetings per day there are, and how often we are expected to talk and explain stuff. It's getting really exhausting for me.

Thank you a lot in advance. Be well. Love
TRUST

LET GO

BE OPEN
 

Good quality Syrian rue (Peganum harmala) for an incredible price!
 
slane
#2 Posted : 2/14/2022 11:18:48 PM

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I am not sure about Stamets sourcing from Mushroom Matrix. I got my lions mane capsules from his storefront and have been pleased with their quality. Maybe he does resell; I'm also curious to know.

My microdose regimen is .25g psilocybe cubensis combined with the recommended 2 capsules of lions mane (1g of mycelium) and 1000IU of vitamin D. The vitD is just for overall health while the mushrooms are targeted toward improving cognition & mood.

I take my "stack" every 3-5 days. Every third day if I remember to take it. This has been my schedule for at least a couple months now and there is definitely a mental boost that happens on the days that I have my doses. It has to be acknowledged that .25 is generally a higher dose than most would start out with for microdosing. I have tried .15g in the past and did not see tangible benefits. .25g is perfect for me. I would encourage everyone to start off small and find their best dose that enhances their thinking without undue distraction.
 
Voidmatrix
#3 Posted : 2/15/2022 12:06:12 AM

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First, it's great to see you. I've been meaning to reach out to you (so keep an eye on your inbox).

It seems that a good number of mushroom supplements on the market aren't actual mushroom fruit bodies that have been powdered, but rather the mycelium it grows from. I am not sure about whether Stamets repackages a different product.

Dr. James Faidman (the individual who popularized microdosing) suggests microdosing every three days for the best benefit. The days in between help one to not build a tolerance while also working through things without the medicine.

And thank you for bringing this up seeing as I have some microdose mushrooms prepped that I have yet to experiment with.

However other things that may help that I take are B vitamins, lions mane, citicoline, choline L-bitartrate, l-phenylaline, l-tyrosine, and ginko biloba. Apologies if you've already researched some of these.

Again, it's good to see you and congrats on the new job!

One love
What if the "truth" is: the "truth" is indescernible/unknowable/nonexistent? Then the closest we get is through being true to and with ourselves.


Know thyself, nothing in excess, certainty brings insanity- Delphic Maxims

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Question everything... including questioning everything... There's so much I could be wrong about and have no idea...
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Nydex
#4 Posted : 2/15/2022 10:13:39 AM

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slane wrote:
I am not sure about Stamets sourcing from Mushroom Matrix. I got my lions mane capsules from his storefront and have been pleased with their quality. Maybe he does resell; I'm also curious to know.

My microdose regimen is .25g psilocybe cubensis combined with the recommended 2 capsules of lions mane (1g of mycelium) and 1000IU of vitamin D. The vitD is just for overall health while the mushrooms are targeted toward improving cognition & mood.

I take my "stack" every 3-5 days. Every third day if I remember to take it. This has been my schedule for at least a couple months now and there is definitely a mental boost that happens on the days that I have my doses. It has to be acknowledged that .25 is generally a higher dose than most would start out with for microdosing. I have tried .15g in the past and did not see tangible benefits. .25g is perfect for me. I would encourage everyone to start off small and find their best dose that enhances their thinking without undue distraction.

I'll most likely follow the Fadiman protocol as Void mentioned, as I've heard good things about its effectiveness. And yeah, it seems that people from this myco group did not find that rumor about Stamets surprising at all. I'm inclined to believe it though, not sure why. I'll research it further.

Voidmatrix wrote:
First, it's great to see you. I've been meaning to reach out to you (so keep an eye on your inbox).

It seems that a good number of mushroom supplements on the market aren't actual mushroom fruit bodies that have been powdered, but rather the mycelium it grows from. I am not sure about whether Stamets repackages a different product.

Dr. James Faidman (the individual who popularized microdosing) suggests microdosing every three days for the best benefit. The days in between help one to not build a tolerance while also working through things without the medicine.

And thank you for bringing this up seeing as I have some microdose mushrooms prepped that I have yet to experiment with.

However other things that may help that I take are B vitamins, lions mane, citicoline, choline L-bitartrate, l-phenylaline, l-tyrosine, and ginko biloba. Apologies if you've already researched some of these.

Again, it's good to see you and congrats on the new job!

One love

Great to see you too buddy! Hope you're doing okay!

It seems like MM's Lion's Mane powder is made from a mixture of mycelium, primordia, and bodies all together. No idea what's the ratio of those, and I doubt they would disclose such information to the public. In any case, ordering from both of those vendors would come to about the same price. I don't really mind paying more though, as long as I know that what I'm buying is top-quality and worth the money.

I haven't researched most of the substances you mentioned. Have they been found to promote NGF? If so, I'll definitely consider including them in the mixture, as long as they don't raise some dangerous interactions between each other.

Thank you for your kind words and response! Looking forward to your PM!

Cheers! Thumbs up
TRUST

LET GO

BE OPEN
 
OliverJ
#5 Posted : 2/15/2022 1:30:57 PM

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Hi Smile

I do not have much knowledge in this subject matter.

Whilst I have done a quick google I am still unsure - would compounds promoting GDNF be of benefit to you?
 
Nydex
#6 Posted : 2/15/2022 4:01:30 PM

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OliverJ wrote:
Hi Smile

I do not have much knowledge in this subject matter.

Whilst I have done a quick google I am still unsure - would compounds promoting GDNF be of benefit to you?

Heya Smile From the rather quick google I did on this subject I found a few articles that discuss GDNF and NGF as potential components in a cure for Alzheimer and Parkinson's diseases, as well as implicating them as drivers of thermal hyperalgesia. However, I suppose those effects only occur in very high dosages, as I've never heard of anyone that has supplemented, say, Lion's Mane, exhibit any signs of hyperalgesia of any kind, and the active ingredient in this mushroom has been proven to promote NGF. Hopefully someone more knowledgeable in this can chime in.
TRUST

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Dirty T
#7 Posted : 2/15/2022 5:18:51 PM

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I don't know about his Lions Mane products but Stamets Cordyceps are powdered mycelium and rice cakes, it's says "mycelated rice cake" in the ingredients and he actually stated in interviews that his rice cake pills are more effective than whole fruit bodies, since he is a leading expert in mycology it makes me not want to ingest anything I didn't grow myself. Being largely unregulated and using sketchy science such as ricecake>fruitbody I can imagine quality control is just $$$ and those pills are equivalent to "Dr Demento's Miracle Dumpster Juice" Lord knows what's in it. Of course anyone with independent testing analysis is welcome to change my mind.

Psilocybin works wonders on the brain and nerve endings and Lions mane is good as well I would consider growing yourself. Lions Mane is easier than Psilocybin to grow and will grow on WBS and fruit in bags.
 
Nydex
#8 Posted : 2/15/2022 5:58:05 PM

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Dirty T wrote:
I don't know about his Lions Mane products but Stamets Cordyceps are powdered mycelium and rice cakes, it's says "mycelated rice cake" in the ingredients and he actually stated in interviews that his rice cake pills are more effective than whole fruit bodies, since he is a leading expert in mycology it makes me not want to ingest anything I didn't grow myself. Being largely unregulated and using sketchy science such as ricecake>fruitbody I can imagine quality control is just $$$ and those pills are equivalent to "Dr Demento's Miracle Dumpster Juice" Lord knows what's in it. Of course anyone with independent testing analysis is welcome to change my mind.

Psilocybin works wonders on the brain and nerve endings and Lions mane is good as well I would consider growing yourself. Lions Mane is easier than Psilocybin to grow and will grow on WBS and fruit in bags.

Aye that's a bold claim to make for sure...I wonder how it'll hold up against independent analysis. I've considered growing them myself, but it'll be a struggle keeping the humidity high enough due to my geographical location, as well as my spatial availability. Maybe I'll start off with powdered mushroom and if that doesn't have a strong enough effect I can switch to growing my own for a bit and see if there's any change.
TRUST

LET GO

BE OPEN
 
RhythmSpring
#9 Posted : 2/15/2022 10:32:23 PM

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Iboga

Harmalas "Harmine at high doses increased the BDNF (Brain-derived neurotrophic factor) protein level, which is decreased in depressive conditions..."
From the unspoken
Grows the once broken
 
Nydex
#10 Posted : 2/16/2022 8:57:22 AM

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RhythmSpring wrote:
Iboga

Harmalas "Harmine at high doses increased the BDNF (Brain-derived neurotrophic factor) protein level, which is decreased in depressive conditions..."

Thanks for sharing these with me! I will steer clear of iboga for now due to numerous reasons, but I am very interested in Harmine. I've managed to extract full-spectrum freebase from p. harmala seeds before and am somewhat familiar with the process, so it wouldn't be a problem to do that. It seems like this study confirms Harmine therapeutic dosages increase levels of BDNF, as seen in this graph:

The description is as follows:
Quote:
Effects of the acute administration of Harmine (5, 10 and 15 mg/kg, i.p.) and imipramine (10, 20 and 30 mg/kg, i.p.) on the BDNF levels in the rat hippocampus. Bars represent means ± S.E.M. of 10 rats.⁎P < 0.05 vs. saline according to ANOVA followed by Tukey post-hoc test.

So it seems quite obvious that Harmine can be used as an anti-depressant and has pronounced effects as such. However, the issue I have with this data is that the tests were performed only on lab rats, not on humans, so it's not really clear if the effects are so pronounced for us as they are for rodents. I will keep looking and definitely consider including this in the cocktail. I'll also probably need to adjust the psilocybin dosage as it will be potentiated by the Harmine due to its MAOI effects.
TRUST

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OliverJ
#11 Posted : 2/16/2022 12:39:28 PM

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Bromantane, for your consideration.
 
Voidmatrix
#12 Posted : 2/16/2022 1:57:52 PM

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Let me do a little research to find specifics. With l-tyrosine and l-phenylalanine, I'm not positive if they will impact ngf, visa versa, or reciprocally. They're amino acids and if I remember correctly, specifically, both are essential aminos. They are also both precursors.

One love
What if the "truth" is: the "truth" is indescernible/unknowable/nonexistent? Then the closest we get is through being true to and with ourselves.


Know thyself, nothing in excess, certainty brings insanity- Delphic Maxims

DMT always has something new to show you Twisted Evil

Question everything... including questioning everything... There's so much I could be wrong about and have no idea...
All posts and supposed experiences are from an imaginary interdimensional being. This being has the proclivity and compulsion for delving in depths it shouldn't. Posts should be taken with a grain of salt. 👽
 
Jupiter Man
#13 Posted : 3/19/2022 6:33:01 AM

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Nydex wrote:
Hi friends,So far these are the substances I've largely decided on, but I would love to explore what else can be included in the mixture in a way that would synergize well with the others and maybe even potentiate their effects. I've also contacted the Institute of Reconstructive Neurobiology in Bonn, Germany, and am waiting for a reply on their end with any advice/knowledge on the topic.

That being said, I would really love it if you kind folk could share your opinion on the above, and maybe suggest more NGF-promoting substances that I can consider including in the cocktail.


They're not from mushrooms, but cocaine, dextroamphetamine and dextromethamphetamine will enhance the neurogenesis; however, as cocaine has a higher addiction and dependence risk, amphetamines are preferable. About 5 cubensis pins and a low, appropriate dose of dextro(meth)amphetamine will almost exactly replicate a low dose of MDMA. And with that being said, I'm not trying to encourage you to go to the streets or make it yourself.

Generally, cannabis flowers and products from cannabis flowers also work well with mushrooms.
 
CosmicLion
#14 Posted : 5/23/2022 5:39:49 PM

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Don't forget this gem:

"All about Nerve Growth Factor and 50 ways to increase it"

https://selfhacked.com/b...-50-ways-to-increase-it/

Thumbs up
-Eternally Romping the Astral Savannahlands-
 
RhythmSpring
#15 Posted : 5/24/2022 3:43:55 PM

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CosmicLion wrote:
Don't forget this gem:

"All about Nerve Growth Factor and 50 ways to increase it"

https://selfhacked.com/b...-50-ways-to-increase-it/

Thumbs up

Hehehe... Falling in love promotes NGF...
From the unspoken
Grows the once broken
 
 
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