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Help Understanding A Study on Syrian Rue and Alcohol Damage Options
 
RhythmSpring
#1 Posted : 1/30/2021 5:40:38 PM

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Hey, I came across this study on erowid:

Hepatoprotective activity of Peganum harmala against ethanol-induced liver damages in rats

Abstract:

Quote:
In this study, we investigated the protective effects of Peganum harmala seeds extract (CPH) against chronic ethanol treatment. Hepatotoxicity was induced in male Wistar rats by administrating ethanol 35 (4 g/kg/day) for 6 weeks. CPH was co-administered with ethanol, by intraperitonial (IP) injection, at a dose of 10 mg/kg bw/day. Control rats were injected by saline solution (NaCl 9‰Pleased. Chronic ethanol administration intensified lipid peroxidation monitored by an increase of TBARS level in liver. Ethanol treatment caused also a drastic alteration in antioxidant defence system; hepatic superoxide dismutase (SOD), catalase (CAT) and glutathione peroxidase (GPx) activities. A co-administration of CPH during ethanol treatment inhibited lipid peroxidation and improved antioxidants activities. However, treatment with P. harmala extract protects efficiently the hepatic function of alcoholic rats by the considerable decrease of aminotransferase contents in serum of ethanol-treated rats.


~

It seems to imply that the administered alcohol at the same time as Peganum harmala. I was always taught to never mix alcohol and Syrian Rue or Ayahuasca, as Syrian Rue is an MAOI (but more accurately, they are RIMAs, so maybe the warning doesn't stand?), because it is highly dangerous.

It seems that they did this in the rat study and they noted no adverse effects in the rats. If anything, the Syrian Rue helped prevent liver damage from the alcohol. Am I missing something?
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downwardsfromzero
#2 Posted : 1/30/2021 6:43:05 PM

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Looking at the paper, the rue seed extract gave some level of protection for that particular handful of lab rats, apparently as a model for alcohol abusing subjects. Their subjective perception of the experience was not recorded, of course.

From what I have gathered, the combined vasodilating effects of the ethanol and the rue can make for a subjectively unpleasant experience, I would surmise perhaps leading to headache or postural hypotension. This could be risky when we consider as well that both substances are known to cause impairment of balance.

The risk of falling over and getting injured is alone sufficient reason to avoid combining rue with alcohol. In other instances where liver function is being impaired it would seem there is a possibility that Peganum harmala seed extract would confer some protection to the organ.

Interestingly, this is yet another instance where a yellow plant extract benefits liver function.
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Jozeh
#3 Posted : 1/31/2021 1:57:32 AM

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RythymSpring wrote:
I was always taught to never mix alcohol and Syrian Rue or Ayahuasca, as Syrian Rue is an MAOI (but more accurately, they are RIMAs, so maybe the warning doesn't stand?), because it is highly dangerous.

There is a traditional use of alcohol and Ayahuasca in sombunall ritual settings in literature. The advice to avoid alcohol probably stems from Western diets overindulgence, used a crutch to "switch off" which seems directly at odds with the psychedelic experience.

No doubt the typical MAOI diet, which advises avoiding alcohol because of dangerous tyramine interactions, has had some influence. Harmalas being RIMAs, it's not too much of a worry.

I do think DFZ's summary of effects should be noted and ventured with care. I've had the odd beer on a harmine dose day with no noticeable ill effect.

That being said the Mayans loved it so much they'd often utilised a different method of alcohol ingestion.
 
Triglav
#4 Posted : 3/29/2021 4:26:36 PM

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I have now ingested my harmala tea several times after having a beer. Note - I was only lightly under the influence of alcohol and then only took a small dose of harmala. I had never observed any adverse effects - on the contrary I really enjoyed the synergy these two substances created.

Only one time I had a beer which had a significant amount of higher alcohols (homebrewed belgian style). After that beer I was quite feeling it - and then took a small dose of harmala tea. Again I had a pleasant experience on the combination and did not experience any adverse effects from the combo but rather from the higher alcohols - which I had experienced at other times without harmala as well.

Do take caution and don't do anything stupid with plants and drugs. I agree with all the cautions downwardsfromzero put forward.
 
 
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