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official extraction help thread Options
 
Jimbo1776
#3261 Posted : 11/22/2020 3:35:37 AM
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Had a interesting event doing a sodium carb wash in a very narrow shot glass. Upon separation the water settled as expected, followed by the slag forming a perfect wax like seal over the water followed by a nice yellow tinted Bestine. I was able to seperate my washed extract poured right from the glass, water sealed in the bottom. No pipette required.

Just was curious as this was my second wash ever, is this a typical occurrence or was this interesting lucky happenstance?
 

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grimlid
#3262 Posted : 11/22/2020 7:11:56 PM

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Jimbo1776 wrote:
Had a interesting event doing a sodium carb wash in a very narrow shot glass. Upon separation the water settled as expected, followed by the slag forming a perfect wax like seal over the water followed by a nice yellow tinted Bestine. I was able to seperate my washed extract poured right from the glass, water sealed in the bottom. No pipette required.

Just was curious as this was my second wash ever, is this a typical occurrence or was this interesting lucky happenstance?


Just a side note and sorry to hijack..... @Jimbo1776 .... do you find the carbonate wash really improves your quality?
I ordered some recently hoping to really remove some of the potential impurities from the NPS or lye soak in my finished molecules.
 
Aeroman
#3263 Posted : 11/24/2020 7:52:36 AM
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Please help!
I posted a couple of days ago, I'm still not having any success with my extraction attempts, I could really do with some suggestions, I followed Cybs' Hybrid ATB 'Salt' Tek to the letter, the only divergence is the solvent I use "Essence C", it's what French psychonauts use, it is supposed to be similar to naphtha, it evaporates cleanly and boils at around 60°, "naphtha" is hard to come by in Europe. I used 50 grams of shredded bark that I ground finely in my coffee grinder, 20 grams of the same bark in a mimosahuasca brew gets me straight into a breakthrough trip so I know there is decent levels of DMT in it.

I tried using petroleum ether (wundbenzin) but it either disappeared into the base or evaporated, there was no solvent layer to draw from afterwards.

I have done 2 pulls from the same base, the first looked thick and milky which made me optimistic but no crystals formed.

The second, I reused the recovered solvent and added some more Essence C and mixed on and off for 45 minutes with the jar in a bath of hot water 50-30°C, it wasn't as milky and resulted in an oily residue but no crystals.

I've had a look at the troubleshooting guide in the wiki but would really appreciate some pointers from some members with more extraction experience. How would you resolve this?




 
Woolmer
#3264 Posted : 11/24/2020 8:37:33 AM

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Aeroman wrote:
Please help!
I posted a couple of days ago, I'm still not having any success with my extraction attempts, I could really do with some suggestions, I followed Cybs' Hybrid ATB 'Salt' Tek to the letter, the only divergence is the solvent I use "Essence C", it's what French psychonauts use, it is supposed to be similar to naphtha, it evaporates cleanly and boils at around 60°, "naphtha" is hard to come by in Europe. I used 50 grams of shredded bark that I ground finely in my coffee grinder, 20 grams of the same bark in a mimosahuasca brew gets me straight into a breakthrough trip so I know there is decent levels of DMT in it.

I have done 2 pulls from the same base, the first looked thick and milky which made me optimistic but no crystals formed.

I've had a look at the troubleshooting guide in the wiki but would really appreciate some pointers from some members with more extraction experience. How would you resolve this?

What temperature is your freezer at? How long did you leave it in the freezer? The colder it is the faster DMT will precipitate! If your pulls are milky before hitting the freezer it should be precipitating easily.

Aeroman wrote:
it wasn't as milky and resulted in an oily residue but no crystals.

There is nothing wrong with oil/goo, although a re-x could allow it to crystalize rather easily especially if it is from MHRB.

Aeroman wrote:
I tried using petroleum ether (wundbenzin) but it either disappeared into the base or evaporated, there was no solvent layer to draw from afterwards.

You are having issues with emulsions here. It could not have evaporated in a closed container. How much lye and water did you use? There are many threads on the Nexus on how to clear emulsions... Use the search bar! Smile
 
Aeroman
#3265 Posted : 11/24/2020 10:53:38 AM
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Thank you Woolmer.

Quote:
What temperature is your freezer at? How long did you leave it in the freezer? The colder it is the faster DMT will precipitate! If your pulls are milky before hitting the freezer it should be precipitating easily.
It was at its maximum setting 5/5. It's really cold. I don't know the temperature but water freezes very quickly.

Quote:
There is nothing wrong with oil/goo, although a re-x could allow it to crystalize rather easily especially if it is from MHRB.
I found the goo thread after posting, so I vaped the goo that was extracted. There wasn't enough to get trippin but I did feel a mild effect.

Quote:
You are having issues with emulsions here. It could not have evaporated in a closed container. How much lye and water did you use? There are many threads on the Nexus on how to clear emulsions... Use the search bar!
I followed Cyb's .pdf instructions precisely, so each step added up = 640 ml of water. Everything up to the point of the pull went fine, I'm guessing that the solvent and freeze precipitation variables are the issues I need to resolve.

Should petroleum ether be used at room temperature instead of mixing with a heated bath? I replaced it with Essence C afterwards and that separated no problem.

This morning I experimented with room temperature solvent, Essence C is described as light Naphtha, there is another version called Essence F which is described as heavy naphtha, some French psychonauts claim to have had success with that.


 
Powerthoughts
#3266 Posted : 11/24/2020 3:59:38 PM
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Hello i have done a extraction using the lazymasns tek. Below is a picture of the result on a scale. It looked a bit dirty so i started to recrystallize it with naptha. But the only visible dirt that was left looks like household dust. therefore i think the end product will look very much the same as the first picture. I have read the thread "enough goo questions", but i just want to be sure it is safe to use my DMT freebase to make changa with caapi leaves.
Thanks for answers Smile

https://upload.vaa.red/b5Xbt#50176814ab659665a17124ff97dd9091

https://upload.vaa.red/2iZJBc#62149deba8966796baa67fed978560c3
 
downwardsfromzero
#3267 Posted : 11/24/2020 4:27:48 PM

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Aeroman wrote:
This morning I experimented with room temperature solvent, Essence C is described as light Naphtha, there is another version called Essence F which is described as heavy naphtha, some French psychonauts claim to have had success with that.

My very first successful extraction was with a heavy naphtha (BBQ lighting fluid, in the UK). Its pulling power was impressive, and the freeze precipitation went like a dream.

If you try (and with any luck succeed) pulling with Essence F, it would be best afterwards to recrystallise the product using the Essence C you already have.
Ora, lege, lege, lege, relege et labora

“There is a way of manipulating matter and energy so as to produce what modern scientists call 'a field of force'. The field acts on the observer and puts him in a privileged position vis-à-vis the universe. From this position he has access to the realities which are ordinarily hidden from us by time and space, matter and energy. This is what we call the Great Work."
― Jacques Bergier, quoting Fulcanelli
 
downwardsfromzero
#3268 Posted : 11/24/2020 4:29:42 PM

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Powerthoughts - that looks completely normal. The latest thinking is that traces of water in the naphtha contribute to a reversible polymerisation of small amounts of the DMT, leading to production of orange goo.
Ora, lege, lege, lege, relege et labora

“There is a way of manipulating matter and energy so as to produce what modern scientists call 'a field of force'. The field acts on the observer and puts him in a privileged position vis-à-vis the universe. From this position he has access to the realities which are ordinarily hidden from us by time and space, matter and energy. This is what we call the Great Work."
― Jacques Bergier, quoting Fulcanelli
 
Aeroman
#3269 Posted : 11/24/2020 6:47:03 PM
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downwardsfromzero wrote:
Aeroman wrote:
This morning I experimented with room temperature solvent, Essence C is described as light Naphtha, there is another version called Essence F which is described as heavy naphtha, some French psychonauts claim to have had success with that.

My very first successful extraction was with a heavy naphtha (BBQ lighting fluid, in the UK). Its pulling power was impressive, and the freeze precipitation went like a dream.

If you try (and with any luck succeed) pulling with Essence F, it would be best afterwards to recrystallise the product using the Essence C you already have.
Thanks, that sounds promising, essence F is much cheaper so I hope it is effective.
I still have some petroleum ether (wundbenzin) left, if I recrystalise with that, would the crystals be safe enough for pharmahuasca oral consumption?
 
downwardsfromzero
#3270 Posted : 11/24/2020 11:52:16 PM

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Aeroman - the petroleum ether should be fine for recrystallisation, and the resulting product will be fine for ayahuasca once all the solvent residue has evaporated. Traces of pet ether would be essentially harmless. The hazard from swallowing simple hydrocarbon solvents like that is the risk of lung damage if the liquid gets into the lungs. That won't happen with a few tens of milligrams of alkaloid in a capsule.
Ora, lege, lege, lege, relege et labora

“There is a way of manipulating matter and energy so as to produce what modern scientists call 'a field of force'. The field acts on the observer and puts him in a privileged position vis-à-vis the universe. From this position he has access to the realities which are ordinarily hidden from us by time and space, matter and energy. This is what we call the Great Work."
― Jacques Bergier, quoting Fulcanelli
 
Jimbo1776
#3271 Posted : 11/25/2020 7:57:42 AM
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grimlid wrote:

Just a side note and sorry to hijack..... @Jimbo1776 .... do you find the carbonate wash really improves your quality?


I am a complete novice, that said I have successfully extracted 10 grams and was trying out washing on some of my more impure pulls.

I am not a fan of the sodium wash, seems to lose a lot of spice and doesn't do any better than a basic re-x. But bear in mind at my experience level I am by no means a reliable or experienced source.


On a side note, Bestine vs Naptha.... All my research says Bestine is better for purity on a re-x but it seems harder to work with. It doesn't evap as quickly and tends to leave oily residue what's behind the Bestine love?
 
downwardsfromzero
#3272 Posted : 11/26/2020 10:59:07 PM

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Jimbo1776 wrote:
grimlid wrote:

Just a side note and sorry to hijack..... @Jimbo1776 .... do you find the carbonate wash really improves your quality?


[...]

I am not a fan of the sodium wash, seems to lose a lot of spice and doesn't do any better than a basic re-x. But bear in mind at my experience level I am by no means a reliable or experienced source.
[...]
You're not hijacking, - this is a FAQ thread Smile

Here's a tip - don't be sloppy with the chemical names. It would be less sloppy to say "carbonate wash". The sodium could be accompanied by a nearly limitless variety of counter-ions: carbonate, bicarbonate, hydroxide, cyanide, fluoroacetate... and clearly these are a lot more relevant to what will happen than the sodium is. Sodium melts at 98°C so you could even have been washing with actual liquid sodium using a steam bath - hopefully that wasn't the source of your disappointment Big grin

The sodium carbonate wash is broadly considered to be outdated and unhelpful nowadays and your view serves to confirm this.
Ora, lege, lege, lege, relege et labora

“There is a way of manipulating matter and energy so as to produce what modern scientists call 'a field of force'. The field acts on the observer and puts him in a privileged position vis-à-vis the universe. From this position he has access to the realities which are ordinarily hidden from us by time and space, matter and energy. This is what we call the Great Work."
― Jacques Bergier, quoting Fulcanelli
 
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