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my Manske harmala hcl method Options
 
Tony6Strings
#1 Posted : 12/5/2019 7:36:17 PM

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I grind my Syrian Rue seeds in blender. Boil 3x in water with a healthy splash of acetic acid (white vinegar). I filter each boil through a cotton t-shirt. 👕 These teas are put into another pot on medium high heat to reduce. Once reduced to an amount that will fit in a wide mouth mason jar (less than 1 litre) I filter the tea through a coffee filter. Tea then goes back into the pot on stove, salt is added until no more will dissolve into the solution on a low boil. Salted tea is then poured back into clean wide mouth mason jar, put into refrigerator. As it cools, small needle like crystals form in solution and sink to the bottom. I leave it overnight. Next day, I pour the liquid through a coffee filter. A good portion of the harmala alkaloids stay at the bottom of the jar. This I scoop out with a spoon onto a plate to dry. When no liquid remains in filter, it is placed on a plate to dry. Dried alkaloids are collected and eaten or taken sublingual.

Learned this from the Endlessness writeup and the Tao of Rue. I don't filter nearly as much as recommended in these teks, which may be why my alks are more reddish brown and not gold. The alkaloids are very bitter and quite effective. I like to eat 50 to 100 mg before a smoalk. Just thought I would share this very basic method, it has worked very well for me.

This specific extraction, I started with 75 grams of rue. I will post yield weight of alkaloids sometime today when completely dry (they are still a tiny bit damp). Thank you Nexus for teaching me, this is where I have learned some of the coolest stuff I know.
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olympus mon wrote:
You need to hit it with intention to get where you want to be!

"We have arrived at truth, and now we find truth is a mystery- a play of joy, creation, and energy. This is source. This is the mystic touchstone that heals and renews. This is the beginning again. This is entheogenic." -Nicholas Sand
 

STS is a community for people interested in growing, preserving and researching botanical species, particularly those with remarkable therapeutic and/or psychoactive properties.
 
coAsTal
#2 Posted : 12/5/2019 8:54:07 PM

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My approach is very similar to yours Tony, but I do not grind the seeds, as I've read most everywhere that almost all of the alks are in the outer shell, and almost all of the impurities that people find difficult to filter are in the interior of the seed--

I am also a fan of letting the boil pulls settle at least a day or more to allow all of the sediment/particulates to collect at the bottom of the jar, and then I just pour the clarified top 95% through coffee filters into the pot I'm going to reduce with-- it makes it so much easier/faster than waiting 2 hours for the liquid to pass through the slimy sediment that collects fast on the coffee filter if it isn't settled out in the jar prior to filtering.

Rue is really great-- I wish I hadn't waited so many years before giving the extraction a go-- it's so easy!!!

 
Tony6Strings
#3 Posted : 12/5/2019 9:27:20 PM

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My next rue extraction will be performed on whole seeds, letting the tea settle and decant, otherwise same as this. I want to see if I can get this a little more pure by not adding the ground seed material to the equation. I recall a simple manske thread by Sakkadelic where he achieved golden alks in this fashion, not grinding the seeds, otherwise similar to what I've done here. Total weight of 17 grams, so I know this is not pure alkaloids. Still, it works for me, I like it much more than drinking rue tea or eating seeds, ugh, cannot stand the taste. Love the effects though before dmt. Soon going to attempt a pharma experience, I have never successfully taken oral dmt. Thanks coAsTal for reading and sharing some tips!
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olympus mon wrote:
You need to hit it with intention to get where you want to be!

"We have arrived at truth, and now we find truth is a mystery- a play of joy, creation, and energy. This is source. This is the mystic touchstone that heals and renews. This is the beginning again. This is entheogenic." -Nicholas Sand
 
Tony6Strings
#4 Posted : 12/6/2019 1:24:08 AM

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Decided to clean some of these up a little because I like the idea of purified alkaloids. Dissolved 2 grams of the rue extract salts in 8 oz warm water. Filtered this through a funnel with a wad of cotton in the neck. Based little by little with sodium carbonate until I no longer saw clouding. I then noticed an undisolved lump of sodium carbonate at the bottom, and went after it with my spoon. Broke it up, at this point the whole solution changed color and I began to see the alkaloids crashing out! Around the top there is a florescent green ring, you can see in the picture. Why? Does this mean there are more harmalas still in solution? Is this glowing green a normal thing?

If my yield from basing is half a gram or less I will know that I am a lot closer to purified alkaloids. This is the goal.
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olympus mon wrote:
You need to hit it with intention to get where you want to be!

"We have arrived at truth, and now we find truth is a mystery- a play of joy, creation, and energy. This is source. This is the mystic touchstone that heals and renews. This is the beginning again. This is entheogenic." -Nicholas Sand
 
Tony6Strings
#5 Posted : 12/6/2019 4:12:30 AM

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I am fairly certain the green glow was caused by the overhead florescent light in my kitchen. When turned off, the glow disappeared. Freebase harmalas drying on plate, will weigh when dry.
olympus mon wrote:
You need to hit it with intention to get where you want to be!

"We have arrived at truth, and now we find truth is a mystery- a play of joy, creation, and energy. This is source. This is the mystic touchstone that heals and renews. This is the beginning again. This is entheogenic." -Nicholas Sand
 
Tony6Strings
#6 Posted : 12/6/2019 5:27:09 AM

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Added more sodium carbonate to the glowing solution to no effect. Added a dash of sodium hydroxide, glow is gone and there are more precipitates in the solution.
olympus mon wrote:
You need to hit it with intention to get where you want to be!

"We have arrived at truth, and now we find truth is a mystery- a play of joy, creation, and energy. This is source. This is the mystic touchstone that heals and renews. This is the beginning again. This is entheogenic." -Nicholas Sand
 
Jees
#7 Posted : 12/6/2019 12:04:57 PM

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So far at least one A/B transition was part of my workflows. Usually the manske after that but clearly manske works as a extraction starter too.

Tony6Strings wrote:
...Based little by little with sodium carbonate until I no longer saw clouding. I then noticed an undisolved lump of sodium carbonate at the bottom...

I always try to base with a base liquid, not dry material. It eliminates the risk of having undissolved base material confused with wanted precipitation.

Happy experiments Thumbs up
 
Tony6Strings
#8 Posted : 12/6/2019 1:36:15 PM

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Thanks for the tip Jees! I will make up some solutions of carbonate, bicarbonate and NaOH today!! Freebase alkaloids from sodium carbonate weighed about 500 mg. Success!!!
olympus mon wrote:
You need to hit it with intention to get where you want to be!

"We have arrived at truth, and now we find truth is a mystery- a play of joy, creation, and energy. This is source. This is the mystic touchstone that heals and renews. This is the beginning again. This is entheogenic." -Nicholas Sand
 
potnoble
#9 Posted : 10/14/2020 7:40:44 AM

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Thanks for this!!!

Helped alot. It is one more cool thing i learned here.
Somehow i got my first extraction (Tao of rue) wrong.
Now i know Thumbs up

Thanks again

Have a gud one
Psychedelic drugs don´t change you, they don´t change your character,
unless you want to be changed. They enable change. They can´t impose it.
Alexander Shulgin
 
Tony6Strings
#10 Posted : 10/14/2020 11:34:43 PM

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I am happy you found it useful, friend!
olympus mon wrote:
You need to hit it with intention to get where you want to be!

"We have arrived at truth, and now we find truth is a mystery- a play of joy, creation, and energy. This is source. This is the mystic touchstone that heals and renews. This is the beginning again. This is entheogenic." -Nicholas Sand
 
potnoble
#11 Posted : 10/15/2020 8:14:23 AM

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Thanks

It is a great medicine on its own. I always had a bad stomach after eating as long as i
can remember. No matter what i tried.
After taking low doses of harmalas for two weeks i´m fine.
Now i can eat a whole cake again with no side effects Big grin

Have a gud one
Psychedelic drugs don´t change you, they don´t change your character,
unless you want to be changed. They enable change. They can´t impose it.
Alexander Shulgin
 
monomind
#12 Posted : 10/15/2020 4:59:39 PM

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Just adding my $0.02:
Separating manske from gunk I find is much harder than necessary.
1x A/B followed 1x Manske ( and then another B if you want a smoakable product ) is the minimum and for all practical purposes I believe is sufficient.
And mainly much easier to separate the alks after the initial A/B clean.

safe tavells!

p.s.
No need to grid the seeds imo. SR is cheap and according to knowledgeable sources most of the goods are in the shell anyway.

 
downwardsfromzero
#13 Posted : 10/15/2020 7:47:44 PM

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Even non-ground seed can be accompanied by unbelievable amounts of fine particulates, maybe precipitated tannins. Careful filtration through a cotton wool plug or five gets rid of this but one must pay close attention because at some point the fine particulates make their way all the way through the filter.

One Nexian - ACY, perhaps? - has used the approach of doing the first cook of the seeds in a basic solution, e.g. sodium carbonate, which is subsequently discarded. This locks the alkaloids into the seeds temporarily (as practically insoluble freebase) and allows the tannins, or whatever the particulates are, to be cleared up somewhat. Proceeding thereafter with the usual acidic boils in new water frees up the alkaloids; I haven't tested this myself but the reasoning seems sound enough that I would recommend it as being worthwhile to try.
Ora, lege, lege, lege, relege et labora

“There is a way of manipulating matter and energy so as to produce what modern scientists call 'a field of force'. The field acts on the observer and puts him in a privileged position vis-à-vis the universe. From this position he has access to the realities which are ordinarily hidden from us by time and space, matter and energy. This is what we call the Great Work."
― Jacques Bergier, quoting Fulcanelli
 
Sakkadelic
#14 Posted : 10/15/2020 8:28:01 PM
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nice work.

as pointed out previously it works better with whole seeds. here's my attempt at it https://www.dmt-nexus.me...spx?g=posts&t=74206

imo the key point in harmalas extraction from rue is the initial tea preparation
"Is this the end of our adventure? Nothing has an end. We came in search of the secret of immortality, to be like gods, and here we are... mortals, more human than ever. If we have not obtained immortality, at least we have obtained reality. We began in a fairytale and we came to life! But is this life reality? We are images, dreams, photographs. We must not stay here! Prisoners! We shall break the illusion. This is Maya. Goodbye to the holy mountain. Real life awaits us." ~ Alejandro Jodorowsky
 
monomind
#15 Posted : 10/17/2020 11:28:19 AM

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downwardsfromzero wrote:
Even non-ground seed can be accompanied by unbelievable amounts of fine particulates, maybe precipitated tannins. Careful filtration through a cotton wool plug or five gets rid of this but one must pay close attention because at some point the fine particulates make their way all the way through the filter.

One Nexian - ACY, perhaps? - has used the approach of doing the first cook of the seeds in a basic solution, e.g. sodium carbonate, which is subsequently discarded. This locks the alkaloids into the seeds temporarily (as practically insoluble freebase) and allows the tannins, or whatever the particulates are, to be cleared up somewhat. Proceeding thereafter with the usual acidic boils in new water frees up the alkaloids; I haven't tested this myself but the reasoning seems sound enough that I would recommend it as being worthwhile to try.


Cool idea...the initial basic cook. Will give it a go next time around.
In passing, keeping all the used filters and then doing a final acid cook on them yield surprising amount of alks!
 
 
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