CHATPRIVACYDONATELOGINREGISTER
DMT-Nexus
FAQWIKIHEALTH & SAFETYARTATTITUDEACTIVE TOPICS
Tannin Extraction from (Spent) MHRB ? Options
 
blue.magic
#1 Posted : 2/13/2020 9:21:21 PM

DMT-Nexus member


Posts: 1093
Joined: 11-Feb-2017
Last visit: 21-Feb-2020
While studying production of phenols, I found that gallic acid (precursor to pyrogallol) is commonly extracted from tannin.

We know tannins are a huge part of the Mimosa root bark so maybe tannins could be extracted from either spent root bark of even before alkaloid extraction.

If tannins were removed, the whole extraction might be more convenient since the presence of tannins make this a "dirty work" (at least for me).

Since I can also make further use of tannin (especially hydrolyzable gallotannins), this took my interest.

Here is a nice publication about tannins in electronic form:

Tannin Handbook

I have currently little time to study this so I am leaving it for discussion for now...
 

Good quality Syrian rue (Peganum harmala) for an incredible price!
 
Jagube
#2 Posted : 2/14/2020 8:53:44 PM

DMT-Nexus member


Posts: 706
Joined: 18-Feb-2017
Last visit: 24-Feb-2020
Location: Floresta
blue.magic wrote:
If tannins were removed, the whole extraction might be more convenient since the presence of tannins make this a "dirty work" (at least for me).

Have you heard of egg-white fining? A low tech method used in the wine industry and I always use it on my MHRB brews. And I wonder what difference it makes in extractions.
 
blue.magic
#3 Posted : 2/18/2020 5:23:16 AM

DMT-Nexus member


Posts: 1093
Joined: 11-Feb-2017
Last visit: 21-Feb-2020
I heard about it w.r.t. cactus extraction, but not MHRB... I will look it up. Anything that will clarify the mother liquor would be of great help.

I would also like to extract the hydrolyzable tannin, namely the gallic acid. This will be very useful in one of my chem projects, but synthesis is denied here so I won't elaborate. Just that gallic acid is of some value and it would be nice to obtain it from MHRB instead of throwing it out.
 
endlessness
#4 Posted : 2/18/2020 11:45:53 AM

DMT-Nexus member

Moderator

Posts: 13585
Joined: 19-Feb-2008
Last visit: 24-Feb-2020
Location: Jungle
Using egg whites can def help to remove tannins from a brew if you dont want them but im not sure that will be of use if you actually want the tannins, since now you'll have a mess of coalesced egg proteins and tannins. Not sure how easy it is to separate it.

Another question I'd have to you blue.magic is, how will you know you have what you want? Do you have any type of analysis or way of testing to know if you have gallic acid?
 
Jagube
#5 Posted : 2/18/2020 11:59:38 AM

DMT-Nexus member


Posts: 706
Joined: 18-Feb-2017
Last visit: 24-Feb-2020
Location: Floresta
Although I've never done it, I've heard that freezing a MHRB brew and thawing it results in gunk settling at the bottom of the jar and clears up the brew nicely. It seems to be the tannins that give the brew its murkiness, so I'm guessing this simple freeze-thaw procedure will do a good job at separating the tannins from the alkaloids and water?
 
blue.magic
#6 Posted : 2/21/2020 5:33:43 AM

DMT-Nexus member


Posts: 1093
Joined: 11-Feb-2017
Last visit: 21-Feb-2020
endlessness wrote:
Another question I'd have to you blue.magic is, how will you know you have what you want? Do you have any type of analysis or way of testing to know if you have gallic acid?


I have to study this first, it seems to be a large topic. But this has been done industrially and all steps of the process seem to be doable at home.

It seems they autoclave the wood chips to release tannins, then simply separate them as aqueous extract for further purification.

https://www.tannins.org/how-to-extract-tannin/
 
downwardsfromzero
#7 Posted : 2/21/2020 11:42:07 PM

Comical egg spurt; Senile mumbler

Chemical expertSenior Member

Posts: 4532
Joined: 30-Aug-2008
Last visit: 22-Feb-2020
Location: square root of minus one
You would have to check that MHRB tannins actually contain any gallic acid, as there are several different types of tannins.
Ora, lege, lege, lege, relege et labora

“To be GOVERNED is to be watched, inspected, spied upon, directed, law-driven, numbered, regulated, enrolled, indoctrinated, preached at, controlled, checked, estimated, valued, censured, commanded, by creatures who have neither the right nor the wisdom nor the virtue to do so. To be GOVERNED is to be at every operation, at every transaction noted, registered, counted, taxed, stamped, measured, numbered, assessed, licensed, authorized, admonished, prevented, forbidden, reformed, corrected, punished. It is, under pretext of public utility, and in the name of the general interest, to be place under contribution, drilled, fleeced, exploited, monopolized, extorted from, squeezed, hoaxed, robbed; then, at the slightest resistance, the first word of complaint, to be repressed, fined, vilified, harassed, hunted down, abused, clubbed, disarmed, bound, choked, imprisoned, judged, condemned, shot, deported, sacrificed, sold, betrayed; and to crown all, mocked, ridiculed, derided, outraged, dishonored. That is government; that is its justice; that is its morality."
― Pierre-Joseph Proudhon
 
 
Users browsing this forum
Guest

DMT-Nexus theme created by The Traveler
This page was generated in 0.017 seconds.