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Terence McKenna on Salvia Divinorum (1994) Options
 
Nydex
#1 Posted : 9/25/2019 8:19:32 PM

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A really interesting old video that made me think... I haven't been following the SD community and its discoveries closely at all, so I would appreciate it if some of you that know more about it (looking at you, gibran2 and jamie Very happy ) could share your thoughts on something Terence mentions in this vid.

He says that according to the taxonomic and historical research data that was present during those days s. divinorum was actually a novel plant that seemed to have appeared out of nowhere. The Mazatec Indians, who were the only ones blessed with this plant natively, said that it was "new" in justifying their lack of a name for it.

So what I'm wondering is if it really was new, or if later discoveries proved that it wasn't new and that it existed there for a long time, but was discovered only lately by those people. And if it was indeed new, how do we explain that?

Was it a "random" event resulting from the evolutionary wind shuffling the layers of the gene pool in such a way that it created a substance that is as marvelous and peculiar as salvinorin A? Or maybe it is one of many, many similar plants that we haven't yet discovered? Or maybe it was put there specifically by someone/something to serve a specific spiritual and metaphysical purpose? A key to open a door? Or a key to shut one?

Please share your thoughts and update me if necessary. Thank you for reading. Love
Seneca wrote:
For what is free from the risk of change? Neither earth, nor sky, nor the whole fabric of our universe, though it be controlled by the hand of God. It will not always preserve its present order; it will be thrown from its course in days to come. All things move in accord with their appointed times; they are destined to be born, to grow, and to be destroyed. The stars which you see moving above us, and this seemingly immovable earth to which we cling and on which we are set, will be consumed and will cease to exist. There is nothing that does not have its old age; the intervals are merely unequal at which Nature sends forth all these things towards the same goal. Whatever is will cease to be, and yet it will not perish, but will be resolved into its elements.


Voidmatrix wrote:
... trusting myself and the entheogen with confidence and gratitude, I allow myself this experience and now surrender.
 

Good quality Syrian rue (Peganum harmala) for an incredible price!
 
downwardsfromzero
#2 Posted : 9/26/2019 9:39:05 PM

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And here we are, 25 years later...

Some other species of Salvia do produce salvinorin A, albeit in smaller quantities. The overall terpenoid carbon backbone of salvinorin is commonly encountered throughout the genus so it's not an enormous step for the plant to have come up with it.

Terence, of course, was a delight to listen to - such a great raconteur. People should pay particular attention to his admonishment about gurus.

What the Mazatecs say about the plant having no name in their language and it being 'new' I suspect is down to them not wanting to tell outsiders its name or its origins, which is entirely understandable given the actions of the European invaders with respect to Ololiuhqui and its usage.




“There is a way of manipulating matter and energy so as to produce what modern scientists call 'a field of force'. The field acts on the observer and puts him in a privileged position vis-à-vis the universe. From this position he has access to the realities which are ordinarily hidden from us by time and space, matter and energy. This is what we call the Great Work."
― Jacques Bergier, quoting Fulcanelli
 
Nydex
#3 Posted : 9/26/2019 9:43:57 PM

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Oooh I see. Yeah all that makes a lot of sense. Thanks for sharing bro Thumbs up
Seneca wrote:
For what is free from the risk of change? Neither earth, nor sky, nor the whole fabric of our universe, though it be controlled by the hand of God. It will not always preserve its present order; it will be thrown from its course in days to come. All things move in accord with their appointed times; they are destined to be born, to grow, and to be destroyed. The stars which you see moving above us, and this seemingly immovable earth to which we cling and on which we are set, will be consumed and will cease to exist. There is nothing that does not have its old age; the intervals are merely unequal at which Nature sends forth all these things towards the same goal. Whatever is will cease to be, and yet it will not perish, but will be resolved into its elements.


Voidmatrix wrote:
... trusting myself and the entheogen with confidence and gratitude, I allow myself this experience and now surrender.
 
clouds
#4 Posted : 9/28/2019 4:16:36 AM

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I've also been curious about this and from my research it seems like the mazatecs genuinly dont know where and how it came from. According to their mitology, it is a feminine divinity, somehow related to the virgin Mary (because of the catholic syncretism.)

my suspicion is that it is indeed a spirit, angel or a gift or something like that, that has come to aid the human race (as many other psychedelics) in the conciousness transition that will take place the following decades.

where and how it came from is intriguing but of little importance right now and it will be revealed when the spirit decides it is time to reveal so.
 
Nydex
#5 Posted : 9/28/2019 11:05:30 AM

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clouds wrote:
I've also been curious about this and from my research it seems like the mazatecs genuinly dont know where and how it came from. According to their mitology, it is a feminine divinity, somehow related to the virgin Mary (because of the catholic syncretism.)

my suspicion is that it is indeed a spirit, angel or a gift or something like that, that has come to aid the human race (as many other psychedelics) in the conciousness transition that will take place the following decades.

where and how it came from is intriguing but of little importance right now and it will be revealed when the spirit decides it is time to reveal so.

Yeah I liked to entertain that idea that it came from the heaves to open or close a door for humanity, but then you find out there are numerous other Salvia species that contain Salvinorin A and are not endogenous to the Mazatecan area only, but all over the world pretty much.

This more or less dismisses that hypothesis, but if you zoom out a little bit and take ALL entheogens in perspective, of course you can again entertain the idea that they are here precisely because we need them as part of our next step on the spiritual evolutionary ladder.

Cheers! Thumbs up
Seneca wrote:
For what is free from the risk of change? Neither earth, nor sky, nor the whole fabric of our universe, though it be controlled by the hand of God. It will not always preserve its present order; it will be thrown from its course in days to come. All things move in accord with their appointed times; they are destined to be born, to grow, and to be destroyed. The stars which you see moving above us, and this seemingly immovable earth to which we cling and on which we are set, will be consumed and will cease to exist. There is nothing that does not have its old age; the intervals are merely unequal at which Nature sends forth all these things towards the same goal. Whatever is will cease to be, and yet it will not perish, but will be resolved into its elements.


Voidmatrix wrote:
... trusting myself and the entheogen with confidence and gratitude, I allow myself this experience and now surrender.
 
physics envy
#6 Posted : 9/30/2019 9:56:28 PM

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I have no idea *why* it's here, but I have a theory on what is *does*.

I believe it unlocks the ability to gain a consciousness/awareness perspective that is a layer behind our daily awareness.

Perhaps it is the awareness we have when in non-Rem sleep. I say this because when you use low doses, it becomes apparent that you have a perspective shift to a 'deeper' level. You have more control over your body and are at deeper decision-making level than when in sober/awake consciousness.

And it's not the same as dreaming consciousness (if you ever experienced lucid dreaming - then you know they're obviously different). But the consciousness level gained from salvinorin is very familiar...so maybe it's a level we go to when in deep sleep that we normally cannot remember.

To me, salvinorin feels like a cheat code to access this normally unattainable level.
Salvia quid enthusiast
 
 
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