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The direct e-mesh thread. Options
 
starlord
#361 Posted : 12/15/2019 11:35:36 PM
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First of all, many thanks for this brilliant idea. Thumbs up

I got the Aegis Solo, the VandyVape 1 RDA and
100 Mesh SS316 formed like Propello tek (~0.101 Ω).

First I tried to calibrate it with the faintly red glow.
Which worked in the first place, but after I had changed my atomizer to steam my eliquid, and later back, the TCR value was no longer correct.

I burned Spice, and it smelled very badly.

Callibrated it again and everything worked until I unscrewed the head and after some time put it on again. After that the right TCR value was different again.

what I noticed then:
sometimes if I unscrew and screw the head again, a slightly different resistance is measured.
0.101, 0.107, 0.106, 0.110, 0.098, 0.120

Everything firmly screwed at room temperature, without liquid on the connection and
the mesh doesn't touch any other metals.

Also my eliquid Atomizer is measured slightly different sometimes.

I don't know if it comes from the room temperature fluctuating around 3-5C, but it seems to make a big difference in the right TCR value.

Then measured the Mesh temperature with an infrared thermometer.
I had exactly the same temperature with a TCR value of 110 and 210c as later TCR 128 and 210c.

So as long as the Resistance is locked, I have no problems, but as soon as I use another Atomizer I have to recalibrate TCR, because the lock will be deleted.

Accuracy of my infrared thermometer is given with 2% (+- 2-3C)
I also noticed: my mesh starts to glow faintly red at 220C-225C
You can't see anything at 210C. (in a completely dark room)


However, once TCR properly calibrated, it works perfectly. No smell, very nice. Big grin
 

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some one
#362 Posted : 12/16/2019 12:52:12 AM

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Thanks for sharing the info starlord
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starlord
#363 Posted : 12/16/2019 2:04:11 AM
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The problem seems to be the Aegis Solo Mod.
It often reads different/wrong resistance values.

A 0.3 Ω coil is sometimes 0.267 Ω and sometimes 0.278 Ω, without temperature change.
Is that normal?
Or is it a GeekVape Mod bug?

the change from 0.1 Ω to 0.11 Ω already makes a difference of 68C
on my mesh with the same TCR value.

0.1 Ω TCR=128 210C = 210C
0.11 Ω TCR=128 210C = 278C

There are a lot of people with a similar problem:
https://www.geekvape.com...reading-ohms-correctly/

Probably the measurements in this low resistance range are a bit less accurate.
I guess I need a second mod for the eliquid.
 
Propello
#364 Posted : 12/16/2019 9:44:41 AM

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Hi Starlord and thanks for your input.
I have tried to provoce the same issue as you have with different resistance, but my aegis solo shows correct ohm. You are referring to about 0,01 change in resistance, which is very little and shouldn't make any major difference to the configuration. The link at geekvape are the earlier model - the legend. Geekvape has since then updated the legend software, including the ohm lock option, which is already present on the solo. I have googled the issue, but nothing comes up on the solo, just the legend.

If you get different ohm every time you mount the mesh rda, I would check that the mesh legs are firmly mounted and the screws are tight. This is a common problem with self builds where the connection is not optimal. Try to heat the mesh and tighten the screws to ensure maximum contact between mesh and posts and check again.

In worst case scenario, it might be that you have gotten a bad mod. Do some more experimenting before you eventually make a complaint.

Blessings

 
some one
#365 Posted : 12/16/2019 11:32:14 AM

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starlord, at what temp are you vaping according to your IR temp gun (not modbox) when vaping works well? Are you vaping at 210C below the faint glow, or at 220C-225C on the faint glow? Where did you buy your SS316 100 mesh? Link? Could you measure your mesh resistance for us using a multi-meter?

See mattw1994 post:

mattw1994 wrote:
I made a fixed mesh with the 100 micron ss. My voopoo drag read it at .16 ohms. It seems that if my ohms on my voopoo drag on not in the .2-.25 my temp is way off. My drag was set at 100 degrees celsius on my drag and the my temperature radar device read it at 300 degrees celsius.

In the end all that matters is the temp your IR gun measures (or red glow ref point), you can tweak your modbox settings to get to the desired IR temp /red glow ref point.

Propello, your modbox displayed resistance of your SS304 100 mesh (cut per your tek) is 0.25 ohm, right? Have you measured the temp of the 'faint red glow' with an IR temp gun? Good to know starlord's info about Geekvape is n/a for the newest version.

I checked previous posts for resistance of used mesh metal types and lengths. Below is the reference data to check that your modbox displays the correct resistance. The 4cm lengths are for vertical loading, 7cm for horizontal. Should be measured after the coating is burned off at high temp.

4cm long (Propello tek dimensions) SS304 100 mesh: 0.15 (0.10-0.20) Ω
4cm long (Propello tek dimensions) SS316 100 mesh: 0.15 (0.10-0.20) Ω
4cm long VanyVape mesh role (13 mm wide) SS316 150 mesh: 0.25 Ω
7cm long VanyVape mesh role (13 mm wide) SS316 150 mesh: 0.40 Ω
8cm long VanyVape mesh role (13 mm wide) SS316 150 mesh: 0.45 Ω
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Steffen335
#366 Posted : 12/16/2019 4:56:58 PM
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Hi everyone! Thanks for the input. I'll try with lower temperature soon, then.

@zikzak, sorry I can't answer your PM, because my account is not fully unlocked yet, but here it is:

Steffen335 wrote:
Hi!

I think you can order directly from GlassCo, but at least 10 pieces... I used a local reseller. Maybe google "lab glassware shops" in your country, I'm sure someone will be selling GlassCo glass. Smile

If not, choose some other tube that matches your RDA, and then match appropriate o-rings. But this combination I posted works great. Smile

Good luck!
 
Propello
#367 Posted : 12/16/2019 5:46:13 PM

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Some one, I get 0.15 ohm on the 2 builds I got with fitted mesh.

Tried to measure temp with the ir gun, ir off. Hard to get a consistent reading, varies between 210-240C aiming at 14w in temp mode.

Edit.: got 230c in the second temp check.
 
some one
#368 Posted : 12/16/2019 6:11:49 PM

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Ok, that's good to know (I edited my post above), because in your video I saw 0.25ohm and mattw1994 was talking about 0.25 being correct and 0.15 wrong for his 100 mesh.
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Propello
#369 Posted : 12/16/2019 6:16:13 PM

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0.10-0.20 on fitted mesh, normally around 0.15. Varies with the mesh/build
 
some one
#370 Posted : 12/16/2019 6:17:06 PM

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Ok. So 230C (externally measured) is the sweet spot (dim red glow)?
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starlord
#371 Posted : 12/17/2019 3:41:08 AM
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WOW, thanks for all the help.
Really appreciate that.

mesh is from here:
https://www.zivipf.com/e...Products/ESS300x200-100

what I noticed: the battery should be full, otherwise the values are not correct anymore.
When the battery is half full or lower, the values are not usable.

I have rounded my mesh more and removed all kinks.
Now the upper surface is glowing almost as bright as the feet. (on higher temps)

The resistance is measured with 0.115.
And it still deviates when i change the atomizer, but often 0.115 is displayed.
This seems to be the right value as I now get very accurate temperatures with a TCR of 105.

On my last flight, i was shown that i shouldn't steam so much eliquid.
So the problem with different atomizers has been solved anyway. Big grin

I've calibrated my infrared thermometer and now I also see a faint glow at 230c, nothing below.

And on my last experience with 25mg at 208C, i pressed the button again after 5sec to pull about 15seconds on it.
Maybe 10 seconds would have been enough, but I wanted to be on the safe side.
That's my favorite temperature right now, very smooth.
 
Propello
#372 Posted : 12/17/2019 8:31:24 AM

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some one wrote:
Ok. So 230C (externally measured) is the sweet spot (dim red glow)?

Yes exactly. Dim red glow and aiming at 14w.

Glad to hear it worked out Starlord Thumbs up
 
some one
#373 Posted : 12/17/2019 9:44:43 AM

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- 230c externally measured is the faint red glow (for 4cm long 100 micron meshes)
- keep battery full
- round off mesh corners
- TCR 105 represents SS316 very well
- starlord prefers 208c

Good data!
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sbios
#374 Posted : 12/17/2019 2:14:03 PM

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Hi, I'm currently trying out additional builds. I've noticed the mesh type ranges from 100 ~ 316 mesh in the thread. I was assuming the higher mesh, say 300mesh (means smaller gaps in the mesh) will be less likely drip any liquified. Can anyone comment on what differences between say 100mesh to 300mesh in terms of the effects?

 
Propello
#375 Posted : 12/17/2019 2:49:49 PM

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sbios wrote:
Hi, I'm currently trying out additional builds. I've noticed the mesh type ranges from 100 ~ 316 mesh in the thread. I was assuming the higher mesh, say 300mesh (means smaller gaps in the mesh) will be less likely drip any liquified. Can anyone comment on what differences between say 100mesh to 300mesh in terms of the effects?



Hi Sbios!

SS316 is the metal standard - the type of steel classification, not microns.
The problem with the finer mesh like 300 and 400 microns, is that it is so thin, which makes it difficult to load without spilling spice. The coarser mesh has bigger holes but is also a lot thicker and more stable/rigid. The spice will still cling to 150 & 100 microns without the spice sliding through the mesh when melted. I haven't experienced any residue below the mesh on either mesh size.

I wouldn't do any finer than 150 microns. 100 microns is my preferred choice.

Blessings
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some one
#376 Posted : 12/17/2019 2:56:46 PM

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PS. Now that we seems to have TC under control, I will experiment more with Wattage mode. So that everyone without an expensive modbox can enjoy the game. And to make it easier for anyone struggling with TC settings. Input is welcome for steps 1 and 2 (or all).

For those with a good TC device:
1. Set the airgap so you breath comfortably filling your lungs in 10 seconds.
2. Turn TC on and inhale steady without DMT, check the average wattage occurring.
3. Switch to wattage mode, load DMT and inhale everything in 10 seconds (same airgap size).
4. Tweak temp with inhalation speed, slower inhalation is higher temp and stronger vapor.
5. share what wattage you used here, if it worked and what your sweet spot is.

Note: Wattage should work modbox independent (but is mesh size, metal type and shape dependent)

I used 22W last time if I remember correctly on a 8cm long VV 150 mesh. Higher could have been better, maybe 30W.
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Propello
#377 Posted : 12/17/2019 3:25:58 PM

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some one wrote:
PS. Now that we seems to have TC under control, I will experiment more with Wattage mode. So that everyone without an expensive modbox can enjoy the game. And to make it easier for anyone struggling with TC settings. Input is welcome.

For those with a good TC device:
1. Set the airgap so you breath comfortably filling your lungs in 10 seconds.
2. Turn TC on and inhale steady without DMT, check the average wattage occurring.
3. Switch to wattage mode, load DMT and inhale everything in 10 seconds (same airgap size).
4. Tweak temp with inhalation speed, slower inhalation is higher temp and stronger vapor.
5. share what wattage you used here, if it worked and what your sweet spot is.

Note: Wattage should work modbox independent (but is mesh size, metal type and shape dependent)

I used 22W last time if I remember correctly on a 8cm long VV 150 mesh. Higher could have been better, maybe 30W.


Good idea!

I think it is also important that people report the mesh resistance together with wattage. These values correlate - Lower resistance needs more wattage. We might be able to find a generic voltage for optimal wattage using Ohm's law (voltage*voltage/resistance=wattage)

 
some one
#378 Posted : 12/17/2019 4:00:34 PM

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For everyone new to e-vaping: the advantage of wattage mode is that you are not dependent on the TC algorithm of your modbox. Wattage mode will just output a continues amount of power. All mods should be able to handle this. If you notice that the smoke become too dense all you need to do in inhale faster. If you notice that the smoke is too little, inhale a little slower. This could take a bit of practice, but it's still easier than mastering a GVG.

Propello you are right. Power output is resistance dependent. Finding a generic W value for R would be great. Would you suggest using 230c as reference temp or 210? For now I chose 210c.

If we make a list of mesh types and sizes we use, then this can act as the starting point. Set mod to TC and 210c. Press fire button without inhaling. Note the W. Then do the same with inhaling slowly and steady, checking the average W occuring to hold the temp at 210c. 4cm length for vertical loading, 8cm for horizontal loading.
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some one
#379 Posted : 12/18/2019 9:07:52 AM

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Update: I tested and filled in the numbers for the VV 150 mesh, but don't have a 100 mesh yet. Propello, you already mentioned the 14W without breathing for your fitted 100 mesh at 230c, what is it for 210c? And with breathing at 210c?

@210c:

4cm long 15mm wide [Propello's 'fitted mesh'] SS304/SS316 100 mesh:
0.15Ω. 10.5W without breathing. 50W with breathing.

4cm long 13mm wide VanyVape mesh role SS316 150 mesh:
0.25Ω. 9.5W without breathing. 25W with breathing.

8cm long 13mm wide VanyVape mesh role SS316 150 mesh:
0.45Ω. 13W without breathing. 35W with breathing.

For Wattage mode usage, I would suggest to start 10% lower than the Wattage's with breathing stated above.
Then tweak power to find the optimal power setting which fits your breathing speed.

Edited: inserted Propello's data.
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Propello
#380 Posted : 12/18/2019 9:56:39 AM

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When I adjust tcr so 230C gives 14w, 210C 10-11w. Red dim glow.
When I do a 10 seconds inhalation, the wattage max at 50+ watt.
 
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