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Bufotenine Extraction Options
 
69ron
#21 Posted : 10/26/2008 7:35:59 AM

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DMT citrate is somewhat soluble in acetone, but bufotenine citrate is very poorly soluble in acetone and easily crashes out. That's why that tech is mostly for bufotenine.

However, DMT fumarate and bufotenine fumarate are both very poorly soluble in acetone, so by using fumaric acid instead of citric acid, you should be able to get both. But SWIM never tested this tech with fumaric acid. But it should work really well with a little adjustment. First of all fumaric acid is not as soluble in acetone as citric acid, so you’ll need to make adjustments there. I’m not sure what the solubility is offhand.

Look at the DMT fumarate thread on this forum for some ideas.
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Jorkest
#22 Posted : 10/30/2008 3:54:34 PM

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so SWIM was wondering what the end extract looks and feels like

he currently has some amber colored stuff..but its not drying completely..is this normal? this is the second time he has gotten the not quite dry stuff...it must be oils or something..because they never evap off...and the acetone he used dries completely..
it's a sound
 
69ron
#23 Posted : 10/30/2008 9:30:48 PM

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It depends entirely on the seeds used. Some produce sticky results, others don’t. The effects also vary a little from batch to batch, but are mostly the effects of bufotenine, except there’s some alkaloid(s) present that increase the side effects.

The sticky stuff is not oils, its one or more alkaloid contaminants. Oils can be removed by very thorough multiple A/B extractions, but this sticky stuff can’t.

There are at least two alkaloids present (I don’t know what they are named) that cause this. One is slightly greenish and extremely hygroscopic. The other is amber and slightly hygroscopic. Both make the extract sticky. Yopo (peregrina) is usually much worse than Vilca (colubrina). The more bufotenine to other alkaloids present, the less sticky the extract will be.

Try putting the extract in the oven at 300 F for 2 hours. One of those alkaloids will vaporize away and the extract will be less sticky and more potent.

SWIM has not found a good easy way to remove all of those pesky sticky alkaloids yet. They are pretty much dead weight and only serve to make the extract weaker.
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Jorkest
#24 Posted : 10/30/2008 10:59:10 PM

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ahh thats good to hear...SWIM was worried that he was doing something wrong...he can smell it in there..and knows there is some bufo present..but was worried...

this makes lots of sense...the stuff is definitely not the greenish stuff..luckily...SWIM doesnt have a stove..but he does have a mini hotplate that he can put it on..and perhaps put some sort of cover over to capture the heat and make a mini oven..
it's a sound
 
Observant
#25 Posted : 10/31/2008 1:55:34 AM

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I think i did something wrong.
I am currently evaporating my filtered Acetone for the first time
It must have come in contact with water .
Some drops on the Acetone, a big bubble of water under the Acetone.


I hope i didnt mess it up. Any advice?




Had he more quickly realized just who they were,he would have shown them more respect.Had he tried harder to fathom their brilliant minds,he would have taken more of their teachings to heart.Had he more clearly understood the purpose of their being,
he would have more vigorously tried to assist them.They were truly honorable; he was sadly prejudiced.
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#26 Posted : 10/31/2008 2:31:52 AM

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hmm...well...you will just have to let the resulting goo dry for a long time to get the water to evap...try putting it in the oven as 69ron posted..that should speed things up
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69ron
#27 Posted : 10/31/2008 5:40:30 AM

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associativum wrote:
I think i did something wrong.
I am currently evaporating my filtered Acetone for the first time
It must have come in contact with water .
Some drops on the Acetone, a big bubble of water under the Acetone.


I hope i didnt mess it up. Any advice?


Yes, you can chemically dry the acetone which is very fast.

You can add salt to the acetone to absorb all the water, or dried Epsom salt (anhydrous magnesium sulfate) is even better.

You can get Epsom salt at most pharmacies.

Anhydrous magnesium sulfate is dried Epsom salt. It absorbs water like crazy and is used to dry acetone all the time.

To make anhydrous magnesium sulfate from Epsom salt, put 200 grams of Epsom salt in the oven at 400 F for 2 hours. That’s it. 200 grams can absorb about 157 ml of water! To absorb 1 ml of water requires 1.27 grams of dried Epsom salt.

Epsom salt is edible and normally sold for internal use, so it’s safe.


After you dry it, filter it again and you're good to go.
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Jorkest
#28 Posted : 10/31/2008 6:15:44 AM

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you may have gotten water in there when you were evaping...it evaporates so fast that it cools whatever the acetone is in down so much that it starts to have water condense on it..so slow down the evap..or use a little hotplate to keep the acetone hot while a fan blows the acetone away
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Jorkest
#29 Posted : 11/1/2008 2:19:16 AM

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so SWIM took a bit of acid tonight...and hes thinking about trying a small dose of bufo to compliment...hes not sure if anybody has done this or what will happen if he does..he will report to me about it later...but he was wondering if anybody has ever tried it...
it's a sound
 
Jorkest
#30 Posted : 11/1/2008 2:40:43 AM

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so far its making SWIM VEEEEERY sleepy
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69ron
#31 Posted : 11/1/2008 10:43:13 AM

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SLEEPY? I didn't expect that reaction. Any other effects from the combination?
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Jorkest
#32 Posted : 11/1/2008 2:01:41 PM

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well SWIM is also in the process of really figuring this mole out...trying to get it just right..and i dont think its quite there yet...

SWIM isnt quite getting the effects that he should be...its active no doubt..but his method needs to be tweaked a bit..

but from what SWIM remembers..he was just really tired..and things were happening..but it needs to be looked into further...his bufo is not quite right yet...trying to get enough to get a nice experience out of it...hes just having issues..but he knows where the bugs are

ill keep you informed of SWIMS observations and updates
it's a sound
 
Jorkest
#33 Posted : 11/1/2008 8:17:34 PM

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SWIM was wondering what the yield would be around at 100g of seeds
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SpasticSpaz
#34 Posted : 11/2/2008 5:15:30 PM
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SWIM has a quarter pound of colubrina and wishes to do an extraction, but does not have access to citric acid/sour salt (She has searched extensively) or an oven, and therefore cannot use this extraction.

How soluble is the desirable form of bufotenine in naptha? I ask this on behalf of SWIM because SWIM was wondering if she could make vilca (ie, mix the lightly toasted beans with lime), then mix the powder with naptha and filter off while saving the solids (in order to defat the beans), then extract the powder with acetone (saving the liquid this time) and evap said acetone.

Would this work in getting a passable extract (SWIM knows it'll hardly be PURE)? How much bufotenine will be lost in what SWIM hopes is a defatting step?
 
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#35 Posted : 11/2/2008 5:29:11 PM

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you can get food grade citric acid at Amazon*com
it's a sound
 
Jorkest
#36 Posted : 11/2/2008 5:31:12 PM

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Quote:
How soluble is the desirable form of bufotenine in naptha? I ask this on behalf of SWIM because SWIM was wondering if she could make vilca (ie, mix the lightly toasted beans with lime), then mix the powder with naptha and filter off while saving the solids (in order to defat the beans), then extract the powder with acetone (saving the liquid this time) and evap said acetone.


i dont think you would have to mix it with lime to do the defat...you maybe able to just grind the seeds and then do naptha defatting a few times...im not sure though...im sure somebody else here may know though
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SpasticSpaz
#37 Posted : 11/2/2008 7:02:19 PM
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What form bufotenine present as in the seeds? An acid salt? Freebase? Basic salt? (Is it still unknown if the phenolic oxygen is readily deprotonated or not?) Mixture of the three?
 
Observant
#38 Posted : 11/4/2008 1:25:53 AM

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Out of curiosity , I seperated some of the water and put it in a petry dish.
Its green ,thick, and after 4 Days at 30+ degrees its still liquid ,it lost all smell of Acetone. :/


My Initial Extraction Acetone so far is around 150ml , still has a lower green water layer , and a lot of oil blobs on top. A little less than 100g of toasted/crushed Yopo Seeds were used.
Had he more quickly realized just who they were,he would have shown them more respect.Had he tried harder to fathom their brilliant minds,he would have taken more of their teachings to heart.Had he more clearly understood the purpose of their being,
he would have more vigorously tried to assist them.They were truly honorable; he was sadly prejudiced.
They were exceedingly well informed; he was grossly ignorant.They were totally indefatigable; he so often, and so quickly,gave up. Still, for many years there was a strong inter-species alliance between the Eleven-Eleven of the Half-way Realm, their Seraphic Associates,and their flesh-and-blood friend, a common mortal. Much was accomplished, many profited, and, there’s only one regret...They could have achieved so much more...

All Hypnotizing Hypnotizes Hypnotizing
 
Jorkest
#39 Posted : 11/4/2008 3:04:14 AM

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what you need to be VERY careful about is how quickly and the temperature that you evap the acetone...because what SWIM noticed was that acetone evaps so quickly that is actually caused water to condense on the jar he was using(because when something evaps..it makes it cold for some reason...just like when you put some acetone on your hand it makes it feel cold)...so what he does..is use a HOT PLATE...to keep the acetone warm while he evaps it...if the outside of the jar or glass gets too cold...water will form on the inside and outside...so make sure you keep everything at a nice HOT temperature

and like 69ron has posted...bufo is extremely durable...the boiling point is around 600 degrees...so there is no worry of it vaporizing off...

but keep it warm and you wont have water get into your batch
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SpasticSpaz
#40 Posted : 11/4/2008 6:19:09 AM
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SWIM just told me that when she added lime to her ground colubrina seeds, she smelled ammonia only faintly, and the odor quickly faded. She has heard that that ammonia smell was an indicator of potency. Is the lack of smell bad? The seeds have had a VERY strong peanutty/rubbery smell all throughout.
 
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